Build Thread 1978 Mercury Cyclone. The pig is in the pen.

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#8,341
I would try a few things to keep the glass. You put a lot of work into smoothing the inside of the box to show it off, not to mention the ITBs are all but covered by it and lost to the average car show spectator. You'll get it sealed, and then wrapped in male hand bag leather straps for good measure, and it will look glorious.
 

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#8,343
Is there a way to install the glass from behind the mating surface?

imag0097_zpsu2zcermx-jpg.jpg


Any time a pressure panel is installed within an airframe it is installed so that the positive pressure makes the panel seal against the airframe.
Care still needs to taken to ensure there are no leaks when there are negative pressure effects but those times are less often and less severe, aren't they?

Ideally, you would have a channel or slot that the glass panel would slide into with seal on each side of the panel. Making this channel at this point might be pretty tough. A machined panel that installs over the top of the glass panel might be doable. One rigid piece of aluminum to serve as a frame and torqued down evenly?
 
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#8,344
If there is enough material in the box, you could also use a thicker piece of glass that is held on with multiple perimeter fasteners. A lot of aircraft cockpit windows are installed this way that are are not plug-type sealed.
 
#8,345
Noobz347 said:
Is there a way to install the glass from behind the mating surface?

imag0097_zpsu2zcermx-jpg.jpg


Any time a pressure panel is installed within an airframe it is installed so that the positive pressure makes the panel seal against the airframe.
Care still needs to taken to ensure there are no leaks when there are negative pressure effects but those times are less often and less severe, aren't they?

Ideally, you would have a channel or slot that the glass panel would slide into with seal on each side of the panel. Making this channel at this point might be pretty tough. A machined panel that installs over the top of the glass panel might be doable. One rigid piece of aluminum to serve as a frame and torqued down evenly?
Click to expand...

I'm gonna do something like that...(kinda).

It looks like the sealant is permanent. ( with positive pressure being the determining factor here). The glass is embedded, with added spooge that goob-u-lated out around the perimeter. Besides the disasterous mess that made of the glass, it has for the immediate....... locked it in place.

I'm going to get some 1/8" steel flat bar and make a frame ( have to use steel,....can't weld aluminum) right now, the only thing I can do to hold the frame on the glass is a strap...And right now, the only thing that can be used as a strap that has the cinching power is a HD wire tie. And I have some...........unfortunately,...........

they're white.
 
#8,346
It was for the best though....I had boost leaks at every throttle body.

There are collars that I built for alignment when installing the box. They sit on the first inch of the throttle body. Andddddd.....they're a little wonky.

That leaves a fitment issue. You can see a pretty significant air gap right at the top of the throttle body where the bell transition sits....Normally aspirated,. I didn't care that a tiny little bit of air might get sucked past the throttle body horn, where I've added an O ring to help seal it, and over the top where the bell meets.....but now that there is pressure there...

Let's just say I could see how bad it would leak.

In order to get that air box to slide over the o rings, I had to lubricate them,....And when you look at the underside of the air box, you could see where the oil had been blown out....in six places.

That forces me to add some silicone sealant ( ultra-black) to the bottom of the bells where they'll sit on top of the throttle bodies to act as sealing rings.. .Even though I really want to use an o ring....the durometer, and wonkiness of the meeting surface won't let the box top go on properly.
 
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#8,347
Ok......we'll see if this works.
IMAG0104_zpscxv2joli.jpg

An 1/8" frame held down by 75lb rated wire ties....5 of them.

5x75= 375 pounds of force.......holding that glass down against the goop that it's bedded in.

I welded tabs on top of the frame to make sure that there was actually a stand off so the straps could truly apply downward force.

I also filled the gap between the transition on the collar, and put the thing together wet...
( probably never be able to get it apart...but at least it won't leak pressure)
The pic doesn't show the damage to the finish on the box as a result of having to dick around with it so much....Ill have to touch it up as best I can I guess.

So hopefully this is a fix. Other than weld nuts around the perimeter so I could lay metal straps across the top and add small bolts/screws to the straps so I could add tightening force down on the frame...it's the best I can do......for now.
 
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#8,350
95BlueStallion said:
So are you datalogging again tonight???
Click to expand...
No,...the damn silicone needs 24 hours to fully cure, and I'm not about to blow it all out because of impatience.

I just went down there...I started it, and let it come up to operating temp, (190) then shut it off.

I put my hands on the turbo compressor.....cold.
The charge tube.....cold.
The air box...cold
The throttle bodies,....cold.

How perfect is this gonna be when I start stuffing1 additional atmosphere in it.

I know I brag about this thing, but it amazes even me...I just didn't build an engine.

When it starts after three cranks...I have to just stand there and marvel at the whole combination of events..How this thing is even running just freakin floors me.

:banana:
 
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#8,352
CarMichael Angelo said:
No,...the damn silicone needs 24 hours to fully cure, and I'm not about to blow it all out because of impatience.

I just went down there...I started it, and let it come up to operating temp, (190) then shut it off.

I put my hands on the turbo compressor.....cold.
The charge tube.....cold.
The air box...cold
The throttle bodies,....cold.

How perfect is this gonna be when I start stuffing1 additional atmosphere in it.

I know I brag about this thing, but it amazes even me...I just didn't build an engine.

When it starts after three cranks...I have to just stand there and marvel at the whole combination of events..How this thing is even running just freakin floors me.

:banana:
Click to expand...
Because you're Mad Mike...Mikey 2-Times...CarMichael Angelo!! :hail::hail:
 
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#8,354
I like the glass look. Couldn't you just build a metal frame that the glass sits into and bolts over the outside edges of the glass into the intake box ?? Would even have 1" metal straps every 4" or so in between the runners that go across the glass attaching to the frame and painted the orange color.

I think the issue you'll have with trying to seal that glass is the sealing material has nothing to stick too. Youd have to scuff the glass for the material to stick too.
 
#8,355
Excuse the rough drawing... it's late. Something like this where the glass is still one sheet but fits inside the metal or aluminum frame with the straps going across for extra support. Then drill and tap the intake for the same bolts you used on the valve cover. might be able to get away with a custom cork gasket too.
IMAG0104_zpscxv2joli.jpg
 
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#8,356
stangboy said:
Because you're Mad Mike...Mikey 2-Times...CarMichael Angelo!! :hail::hail:
Click to expand...

It was "do it twice Mike" I believe...

old_blue said:
Excuse the rough drawing... it's late. Something like this where the glass is still one sheet but fits inside the metal or aluminum frame with the straps going across for extra support. Then drill and tap the intake for the same bolts you used on the valve cover. might be able to get away with a custom cork gasket too.
IMAG0104_zpscxv2joli.jpg
Click to expand...
And here I was thinking that you had made a nice crochet decoration to hide the straps....

The glass is tempered. It cannot be through drilled, so I cannot run a long bolt through to the base.

I believe the hindsight analysis of what happened to the old setup was caused by 3 things...

#1. I used an inferior sealing agent.
#2. Pressure pushed the lid off of that sealing agent.
#3. Pressure vented through the air gap when the lid lifted.

Now that there is a method in place to lock the glass down, it can't lift and create a pressure escape path around the edges so easily. The sealant is around the full circumference of the glass, and not just under it. That means that the sealant is stuck to the metal around the glass. Think of it like any other gasket that isn't relying on sticking to both mating surfaces to maintain the seal....As long as the glass don't lift, the gasket remains intact.

Now.......If I can only keep the glass from lifting.

I was looking at using the numerous t-bolt hose clamps I have laying around here as straps due to my ability to tighten them so tightly, and I may still do that if the current setup doesn't work...
 
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#8,357
CarMichael Angelo said:
It was "do it twice Mike" I believe...


And here I was thinking that you had made a nice crochet decoration to hide the straps....

The glass is tempered. It cannot be through drilled, so I cannot run a long bolt through to the base.

I believe the hindsight analysis of what happened to the old setup was caused by 3 things...

#1. I used an inferior sealing agent.
#2. Pressure pushed the lid off of that sealing agent.
#3. Pressure vented through the air gap when the lid lifted.

Now that there is a method in place to lock the glass down, it can't lift and create a pressure escape path around the edges so easily. The sealant is around the full circumference of the glass, and not just under it. That means that the sealant is stuck to the metal around the glass. Think of it like any other gasket that isn't relying on sticking to both mating surfaces to maintain the seal....As long as the glass don't lift, the gasket remains intact.

Now.......If I can only keep the glass from lifting.

I was looking at using the numerous t-bolt hose clamps I have laying around here as straps due to my ability to tighten them so tightly, and I may still do that if the current setup doesn't work...
Click to expand...

I feel like you should know if its working or not by now...

Then again, my car should have been road worthy a month ago. Stupid life getting in the way of our builds.
 
#8,358
95BlueStallion said:
I feel like you should know if its working or not by now...

Then again, my car should have been road worthy a month ago. Stupid life getting in the way of our builds.
Click to expand...
Ahhh....you think I should've driven the car with an unknown tune in it in the rain....
This is Alabama...it rains in the afternoon here almost daily it seems here lately. hotteranamuthrfckr all day long, then it clouds up around 4-5, rains for about an hour, just enough to completely saturate the air, and the ground,...then the sun comes back out for the rest of the day ( what's left of it anyways..)

I got home to a dark house at 8 pm last night...It rained like hell, and the wind blew like mad while I was at work...I had no idea I would be powerless at my house 5 miles away.

What was I to do? All I could do was sit in the dark, illuminated by my phone,...eat a sammich,....and have a glass of tully.

Ohh look!
image.jpeg

It's raining again.
 
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#8,360
It's typical though...The temp has dropped fully 20 degrees..If there was ever a better time to tune a car, it'd be now..
Except the damp roads...

Nothing more fun than having a car come into boost on a road that is wet..
 
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