Coupe ducktail carbon fiber mold

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

Hey all!

Getting closer to making a final mold for a wing I have in the works. Maybe y’all could weigh in on critiques?

its a moderate ducktail spoiler that pulls a bit of inspiration from the 03/04 cobra.

currently, with no good mounting locations for hardware (no access under deck lid for bolts to go “thru”) I am thinking about 3M adhesive.

I cringe 1) thinking about sticking something to my car 2) hesitate on bonding ability... but everyone swears with enough surface area there are no issues. Still some things to do like cap ends and rework some curves but this is basically it! Will make revisions and print other half.

critique away!

hoopty5.0 · Aug 5, 2020

I like this 10,000x more than the 'other' sheet metal option that people seem to think looks acceptable.

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

hoopty5.0 said:
I like this 10,000x more than the 'other' sheet metal option that people seem to think looks acceptable.

much appreciated ! Put a good bit of thought into this one. Happy to see someone isn't unhappy with it =]

bird_dog0347 · Aug 5, 2020

I think it's gonna look great!

lemosley1973 · Aug 5, 2020

What do you mean by adhesive? Do you mean a panel bonding adhesive? @Davedacarpainter has experience with PBA and that's strong stuff.

Still, I'd want a mechanical fastener on an aero element - you don't want that coming off and hitting some guy on a motorcycle (me) at 70 mph.

I like the look though.

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

lemosley1973 said:
What do you mean by adhesive? Do you mean a panel bonding adhesive? @Davedacarpainter has experience with PBA and that's strong stuff.

Still, I'd want a mechanical fastener on an aero element - you don't want that coming off and hitting some guy on a motorcycle (me) at 70 mph.

I like the look though.

3M VHB double sided tape.

I haven’t given up on working in fasteners, and would prefer to... left enough room in design to work in Tbolts to decklick portion of the wing. May work a couple into the next print

lemosley1973 · Aug 5, 2020

I'd be worried about tape too. At the very least, it will allow some movement, which probably doesn't matter on a street-only car. I know they use it for fastening some trip pieces nowadays, but those pieces are usually designed to be slippery, where a spoiler isn't.

I'll bet PBA would hold it. Dave said he's seen metal tear around where PBA was used, but that probably requires both surfaces to be paint free.

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

This is kind of what I needed to hear. I’ll work in some hardware one way or another. Appreciate the insight

90sickfox · Aug 5, 2020

I customized an early 80s gt wing for my notch back. Used 3m8115 and it's been stuck on for 3 years.

I wanted to make a mold of it so I could sell a couple. Just no time at all. Even looked into 3d cameras to get some modeling done. I actually wanted it for a few projects that I think would be mildly lucrative.

I really like what you have going on with your wing. Back I'm the 80s and early 90s they used to mold wings out of this black closed cell foam stuff. Was light weight and easy to fit.

eighty5fox · Aug 5, 2020

I think the tape would hold fine. I have it to secure my fender flares on currently and saleen skirts and they are strong as can be. I did also use a adhesive promoter. I can shake my entire car from the flares. I really like the design you are going for. I personally think it should be taller but looks great. Keep up the good work!!

lemosley1973 · Aug 5, 2020

Listen to @90sickfox . He's forgotten more than I know.

91TwighlightGT · Aug 5, 2020

hoopty5.0 said:
I like this 10,000x more than the 'other' sheet metal option that people seem to think looks acceptable.

Probably my favorite style of spoiler on a Coupe. It just really has to be done right.

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

90sickfox said:
I customized an early 80s gt wing for my notch back. Used 3m8115 and it's been stuck on for 3 years.

I wanted to make a mold of it so I could sell a couple. Just no time at all. Even looked into 3d cameras to get some modeling done. I actually wanted it for a few projects that I think would be mildly lucrative.

I really like what you have going on with your wing. Back I'm the 80s and early 90s they used to mold wings out of this black closed cell foam stuff. Was light weight and easy to fit.

These are very kind words. Sweet spoiler! The 3D imaging is the next stop for me, as well. Though, those scanners run about 9k at the moment. All of my designs I do by extrapolating dimensions or simply guess and check on the car. Hoping once done I can sell a couple to make the mold making process worth while. Then.. after that who knows ?

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

eighty5fox said:
I think the tape would hold fine. I have it to secure my fender flares on currently and saleen skirts and they are strong as can be. I did also use a adhesive promoter. I can shake my entire car from the flares. I really like the design you are going for. I personally think it should be taller but looks great. Keep up the good work!!

Wow. That strong? I did read up that adhesive promoter is "the way" to go if doing such.

I had it a bit taller.. but the larger, swooping profile started to give me "DECH" vibes. Wanted it a bit more suttle. BUT, may rework to be a bit bigger in the future if a 3rd brake like needs to be slotted in there...

a91what · Aug 5, 2020

What size printer are you using and what are you printing in?

90sickfox · Aug 5, 2020

This thing I made looks a lot easier than it is. It was designed for a hatch and I had to fabricate the end caps.

There are some cheaper 3d scanners but the end result needs a bunch of smoothing. Seems like they would get the basic dimensions pretty good. There are so many hidden curves on a vehicles panels. I have way more respect for anyone that can 3d model anything that fits right. That takes work and it looks like you're coming along pretty good.

Maybe I need to invest in a 3d printer. It's super hard for me to map out dimensions and send them to someone in a digital file.

I'm an old foam carving guy. Now, I'm playing with plasticine clay. Smh.

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

a91what said:
What size printer are you using and what are you printing in?

Ender 3, print bed volume 8.5"x8.5"x10" pretty standard.
Material is PETG, a bit more stringing than PLA (lego plastic) but allows a bit more flexibility.

I would print in ABS, but that requires an enclosure (I use my dogs travel kennel thats made out of fabric, haha) and a bit more heat. Though its SUPER strong.

Will be printing Nylon-X (carbon infused nylon) material on a bit bigger bed with hotter extruder end in future for end use products like wing mounts, bezels, jigs etc.

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

90sickfox said:
This thing I made looks a lot easier than it is. It was designed for a hatch and I had to fabricate the end caps.

There are some cheaper 3d scanners but the end result needs a bunch of smoothing. Seems like they would get the basic dimensions pretty good. There are so many hidden curves on a vehicles panels. I have way more respect for anyone that can 3d model anything that fits right. That takes work and it looks like you're coming along pretty good.

Maybe I need to invest in a 3d printer. It's super hard for me to map out dimensions and send them to someone in a digital file.

I'm an old foam carving guy. Now, I'm playing with plasticine clay. Smh.

3D printing is simpler than ever, and a lot of the pieces that one would need are most likely in a cadlibrary. I bet with your keen eye you could get within +/- 1/16". The print material is cheap, so print a quick mockup (I usually just do a thin layer about .06") overlay it to my object and adjust.

I encourage you to try! The ender 3 is what I use, VERY basic - and print quality is stellar for the price ($200). Until you step up to the $4-5000 machines most printers are pretty similar in the functions.

I see the printer/inhouse designer being a big commodity and have been working at my degree and getting mechanical design certs so one day a highend fab shop will scoop me up. Or just make parts for the fox out of my home and call it a day. That's my (dream) goal, atleast!

a91what · Aug 5, 2020

JDSpeed said:
Ender 3, print bed volume 8.5"x8.5"x10" pretty standard.
Material is PETG, a bit more stringing than PLA (lego plastic) but allows a bit more flexibility.

I would print in ABS, but that requires an enclosure (I use my dogs travel kennel thats made out of fabric, haha) and a bit more heat. Though its SUPER strong.

Will be printing Nylon-X (carbon infused nylon) material on a bit bigger bed with hotter extruder end in future for end use products like wing mounts, bezels, jigs etc.

I am currently running an ender5 plus I could likely print that in 3 pieces fairly easily.. are you using Fusion?

JDSpeed · Aug 5, 2020

a91what said:
I am currently running an ender5 plus I could likely print that in 3 pieces fairly easily.. are you using Fusion?

I have been looking to upgrade to something bigger/can print nylon x. May wait to get something a bit more hefty like a Lulzbot taz6. I use SOLIDWORKS.

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