Progress Thread First Project Car - '93 Notch.

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James V

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Feb 26, 2017
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Ok guys, I've been keeping my eye on the marketplace. I love my notch but I think it just needs too much body work to get right. On top of that I see so many foxes on facebook that have near perfect exteriors and a ton of mods that I would be in way more if I bought them for my notch rather than just buying a different fox. But then again I go back and forth debating if I would really trade the notch, I still like the idea of continuing my progress. But what do you guys think of this? Hes asking $12,000

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Rdub6

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Dec 29, 2017
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Been on the road a few days? Needs a tune and bigger injectors? Spool (there was an interesting thread about that idea on a street car). $12000 and he’s almost telling you it will not run right until you do some work. What is he NOT telling you?
I’d stay away!
And yeah....... LS swaps are cool....... just not in a Fox!
 

James V

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Feb 26, 2017
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Connecticut
Ok guys I think the vision of what I want is finally coming together. I'm keeping my notch. I'm getting it painted. And now I'm moving forward with an engine build. I saw the top end kits on LMR for a 302 but would I be better off buying a 351 block and building from there? What's the most a 351 can be bored to? And are there pros and cons between a 302 vs a 351?

And I remember you guys telling me a windsor is better than a Cleveland. How do I confirm someone is selling me a windsor?
 
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General karthief

wonder how much it would cost to ship you a pair
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TOOLOW91

If you're the village idiot what's that make me?
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Bud all those cars you posted are pales . Neither are worth the money . That old Paxton was good for it’s time period and then got crushed by the gear driven SCs we have today . Stock ported e7s ? That car is a money pit stay away . Same with that cobbled together LS car . Car been on the road a few days ? Thats a major red flag in itself . Sits like a truck looks like a sloppy mechanics type build . KEEP your car and take your time . Here’s what mine started out as ......

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TOOLOW91

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20190704_113342.jpg


In the process of a wire tuck and I totally forgot where these 2 wires get connected too.. anyone know?
One is ground ( Star one ) other is 12v it should be a black wire with a orange tracer and like a blue color I think . But hit a diagram and double check
 
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TOOLOW91

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So making life easier on your wire tuck . This will only work with a car that already has a 93 style mini starter. I deleted the ford sol . Went with this which elimates the night mare with the posts being short
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Added this and a relay off the key to the starter only thing I did here was 30 off the relay can go right to one of the power outputs on the junction stud above .
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TOOLOW91

If you're the village idiot what's that make me?
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Ok guys I think the vision of what I want is finally coming together. I'm keeping my notch. I'm getting it painted. And now I'm moving forward with an engine build. I saw the top end kits on LMR for a 302 but would I be better off buying a 351 block and building from there? What's the most a 351 can be bored to? And are there pros and cons between a 302 vs a 351?

And I remember you guys telling me a windsor is better than a Cleveland. How do I confirm someone is selling me a windsor?
So the most you want to take either stock block bore wise is 40 over . The cyl walls become to thin after that and you run into over heat issues and possible cracking in the walls .

A stock 302 block is a time bomb after 550 whp . Depending on the tune up some guys make more etc but it isn’t some concrete number . Concenus is they start to rattle the crank esp If you have any detonation or spinning the engine some high rpm and crack right up through the cam journal .


So if you are starting from scratch what’s the long term goal power goal ? If the plan is a fully freshened engine the 351 is a no brainer . If you’re just looking for a heads cam intake car that’s a 300 hp cruiser with the intent to never really turn it up to its limit then a 302 maybe out of explorer or something with good heads on it and a good cam would be easier on the pocket .

351 for power ? Let’s just say we have a stock 79 block and crank , je piston 30 over , good rods and a 78 mm turbo that’s been 8.52 at 157 in the 1/4 and together for 8 years .

Starting from scratch on the 351 youd need an oil pan , dist , matching upper and lower intake , headers , and 28 oz flywheel before even touching the motor . Also hood clearance . Can’t remember as I’m writing if you have a Stock hood or not but Guys Have used vert mounts and k member spacers and it has beem done under one .

You cannot plan the engine build until you decide your final goal power wise .

After you did that then you need to sit and make sure the chassis , suspension and every part In the drivetrain will not be a weak link . Building cars is fun isn’t it ?
 
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Cobbage_45

Member
Jul 25, 2019
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LMR provides a general list for 351w swap as well! I did a 351w swap and putting in some goodies drove my spending up really quick though! There were only a few times that I regret doing a 351w swap simply because I'm living in California for now (also it was originally supposed to be a $6k budget now it's way over that...).
 
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James V

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Feb 26, 2017
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So the most you want to take either stock block bore wise is 40 over . The cyl walls become to thin after that and you run into over heat issues and possible cracking in the walls .

A stock 302 block is a time bomb after 550 whp . Depending on the tune up some guys make more etc but it isn’t some concrete number . Concenus is they start to rattle the crank esp If you have any detonation or spinning the engine some high rpm and crack right up through the cam journal .


So if you are starting from scratch what’s the long term goal power goal ? If the plan is a fully freshened engine the 351 is a no brainer . If you’re just looking for a heads cam intake car that’s a 300 hp cruiser with the intent to never really turn it up to its limit then a 302 maybe out of explorer or something with good heads on it and a good cam would be easier on the pocket .

351 for power ? Let’s just say we have a stock 79 block and crank , je piston 30 over , good rods and a 78 mm turbo that’s been 8.52 at 157 in the 1/4 and together for 8 years .

Starting from scratch on the 351 youd need an oil pan , dist , matching upper and lower intake , headers , and 28 oz flywheel before even touching the motor . Also hood clearance . Can’t remember as I’m writing if you have a Stock hood or not but Guys Have used vert mounts and k member spacers and it has beem done under one .

You cannot plan the engine build until you decide your final goal power wise .

After you did that then you need to sit and make sure the chassis , suspension and every part In the drivetrain will not be a weak link . Building cars is fun isn’t it ?
Thanks for all the insite. Based on what you told me and some other research I've done I think I'm going to stick with my 302 block and build that. Mainly because my budget, I didnt realize building a 351 could get so pricey. I would like to make around 400hp. So maybe I'll get it bored to a 331 or 347, I saw some kits for those too. My last thing that i have to decide is whether i want to turbo it. What's your opinion on should I just build it N/A or single turbo?
 

Cobbage_45

Member
Jul 25, 2019
25
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Thanks for all the insite. Based on what you told me and some other research I've done I think I'm going to stick with my 302 block and build that. Mainly because my budget, I didnt realize building a 351 could get so pricey. I would like to make around 400hp. So maybe I'll get it bored to a 331 or 347, I saw some kits for those too. My last thing that i have to decide is whether i want to turbo it. What's your opinion on should I just build it N/A or single turbo?
I read on forums that 351w can be built with a lower budget. I got mine from a 1994 F-150 and had it bored 40 over after i dropped it off in a machine shop. I forgot to mention I brought this on myself because I bought a lot of new parts like AFR heads, trickflow intake and whatnot. Also, other stuff like TKO600 and associated stuff like stiffler crossmember, new aluminum driveshaft, rebuilt rear end and dropped in a 3.73. The car needed alot of work at the time.

Only a few times I wish I still have a 302 though. I think I want to go with a 347 if I ever need a new motor.

If it really matters to you...all smog parts from 302 fits except the smog crossover tube (Too short since 351e is slightly wider). I just got a 1994 F-150 351w smog crossover and screwed on the check valve that fits, then route a 3/4" hose to the diverter valve... probably not the correct route but functionally it's the same haha.

I last saw LMR was selling an On 3 turbo kit for 1.6k:


Also got a video on the website about the installation. One thing about that... if you ever move to CA, it doesn't have CARB EO.

I was hungry for power until this lately I thought to myself... do I really need all that power even though it'll be rare for me to even race (Yeah... why did I even do the 351w swap). Also $6k for SC is a hard one to swallow for now.
 

James V

Active Member
Feb 26, 2017
355
125
53
26
Connecticut
I read on forums that 351w can be built with a lower budget. I got mine from a 1994 F-150 and had it bored 40 over after i dropped it off in a machine shop. I forgot to mention I brought this on myself because I bought a lot of new parts like AFR heads, trickflow intake and whatnot. Also, other stuff like TKO600 and associated stuff like stiffler crossmember, new aluminum driveshaft, rebuilt rear end and dropped in a 3.73. The car needed alot of work at the time.

Only a few times I wish I still have a 302 though. I think I want to go with a 347 if I ever need a new motor.

If it really matters to you...all smog parts from 302 fits except the smog crossover tube (Too short since 351e is slightly wider). I just got a 1994 F-150 351w smog crossover and screwed on the check valve that fits, then route a 3/4" hose to the diverter valve... probably not the correct route but functionally it's the same haha.

I last saw LMR was selling an On 3 turbo kit for 1.6k:


Also got a video on the website about the installation. One thing about that... if you ever move to CA, it doesn't have CARB EO.

I was hungry for power until this lately I thought to myself... do I really need all that power even though it'll be rare for me to even race (Yeah... why did I even do the 351w swap). Also $6k for SC is a hard one to swallow for now.
I think the idea of a 351 is something that I would like to do in a future project car down the road. Im such a novice still. I was reading about boring a 351 to 400+ cubes which sounds amazing. Right now I think if I can just get cheaper and reliable power I'd be happy. I'm not really worried about smog since I live on the east coast. I was seeing some 351 blocks for $200 on craigslist, that's what got me interested originally. Most likely I'll make my 302 a 347, I'll get the stroker kit from LMR and a nice top end kit, then I have to figure out my trans situation.
 
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