Ford GT dyno numbers are in !

kirkyg said:

your post makes little sense. You acuse of being a fanboy based on a few comments about a caddie? I dont like the new caddies. I like the old ones, along with lincolns, mercedes, bmws, ferrari, lexus's, infiniti, even audis. That being said i can't afford most of those vehicles right now so my ford will have to do the job that i need it to do. Eventually i can see myself having a luxury vehicle or maybe even an exotic car...so much for being a fanboy

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I call you a fan boy because you bash GM all the time...I dont care about your opinion of caddy. The whole time I have been on stangnet I dont recall you stating something you actually liked about GM. Its funny, I dont recall seeing you and Monkie reply in the same post before...are you one in the same?

Your right though...i've had too many bad experience with GM and Chrysler vehicles more specifically. Here is my general feeling about the two companies GM makes ugly vehicles that are fairly reliable (which rules them out first because i put more emphasis on styling than anything else), and chrysler makes some stylish vehicles but the majority of them are notorious for lack of reliability from transmission problems to hard to find electrical problems.

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Too bad you have had bad experiences. When is the last time you have bought GM? I think QC has gone up dramatically in the last 10 years.

I think the corvette is a good vehicle i'm just afraid they are going to destroy it the way they have everything they've touched in the past few years. If that makes me a fanboy then so be it i'll be a fanboy. I like all performance cars too. I have a focus on styling first then performance second. As for your comments about my mustang, you may end up waking up half the board on your tail because you just lied for one and two this is a mustang board.

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How did I lie? I could care less about waking up half the board. If you talk out your a$$, I'll call you on it.

You say my vehicle has no potential yet a low boost intercooled Kenne Bell supercharged mustang puts out more hp than a vette by far, as well as most other vehicles that are non-exotics. What is your reasoning behind this?

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Hahaha! I have seen low boost GT's dyno 350-370rwhp. It takes 350rwhp in a GT to run with a stock C5 M6 (the autos are slower though). I have seen stock vettes trap over 110mph stock with a good driver. I'd say 350rwhp will be close 110mph in a GT. I hate to tell you, but what you consider an exotic must be an S2000 or an old a$$ NSX because a real exotic (911 TURBO, Ferarri, Viper, etc.) would destroy a last Gen Mustang GT with less than 375rwhp.

Oh and btw, that guy from VT posted a dyno of a n/a 2valve GT putting out over 350 rwhp and said they didn't even use aggressive cams yet.

kirkyg

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Congrats to him. Sadly, its the first time I have ever heard of a 4.6L 2V in street trim make over 300rwhp, but I guarantee his cams arent emissions legal (i.e. pass the sniffer). Its nice to see the aftermarket starting to pick up.

Z28x said:

I was looking at the sales figures in the April '04 MotorTrend, my bad, it is Cars, not brand.

For car sales it is #1 = Chevy, #2 = Toyota, #3 = Ford, #4 = Honda
last year it at this time was #1 = Toyota, #2 = Ford, #3 = Honda, #4 = Chevy. Chevy car sales are on the incline.

Do you have a link to that page on Automotive News, I'm interested to see the stats on other brands.

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www.autonews.com, though you might need a subscription to get to the data,I'm not sure.

For car sales- Ford - 792,313 to Chevys - 799,479 close.
For Trucks Ford - 2,094,262 to Chevys - 1,843,104
Both reported a reduction in truck sales over 2002, Toyota showed a 50K increase.
Also, as with any data, it all depends on how you report it. You could make it look like either one was better than the other just by selecting the right data.

I'm aware they are selling more because they are advertising more. Someone i used to work with used to talk about cars with me. He always said 'all they have to do is put 4 wheels on it and give it an engine and they'll sell the hell out of them.'

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Yeah, that's it, that's the ticket. It's their ADVERTISING!! LOL Very funny. You've got an interesting debating technique. When you get proved wrong, you either conveniently "drop" all mention of that particular subject, or you make something up and toss it on a post in the hopes that it sticks. Now it's advertising and rebates/incentives, calmly breezing past the fact that ALL THREE of the major U.S. automakers are offering 0% financing, or heavy cash rebates, and advertising like mad.

GM has no interest in bringing back a true muscle car heritage. They dont believe it will improve their bottom line. Their marketing has not fit that style for a VERY long time.

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The exact same thing could have been said about Ford in 1989 when the Mustang was slated to become a Probe, and look where Ford is today? You're just blabbing rhetoric, not facts. To say that about a company that's releasing a 400 h.p. rwd M5 fighter in the CTS-V, a 350 h.p. 2-door sport-coupe in the GTO (for which they are advertising in all the major magazines in HUGE 6-page heavy-stock spreads, so much for your claim that GM doesn't market their muscle), and very substantial rumors/leaks regarding taking the CTS-V platform and doing a RWD SS Impala, and there's also news that Chevy is developing a more substantially powered SS pickup to compete with Ford's Lightning and Dodge's V-10 truck, and of course the Vette is alive and well, so....., the FACT is that GM actually has more "muscle car" irons in the fire than Ford does by a long shot. We've got the new Mustang and the Lightning and........ that's IT. Don't even say "New Ford GT", cause a $140,000 supercar may as well be a 5 billion dollar aircraft carrier to those of us typing here on Stangnet.

Oldsmobile and buick should have both been cut

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Proof positive that your whole outlook on what is "smart" or "stupid" in the automotive industry has nothing to do with anything but your own narrow point of view. Oldsmobile was the oldest car company left in the U.S.. Heritage DOES count for something, I'm not living in the past. Look at how important heritage is to the Mustang and Corvette. GM took over 100 years of brand equity and loyalty and heritage, and crumpled it up and threw it into the dumpster rather than fixing it. A good idea, according to you.

RICKS

Yes ford almost made a huge mistake. But that was with one vehicle. Not their whole vehicle line up!!!!

If your talking about the convertible cadillac i could care less about it. Its out of just about every normal persons price range. They want 72k for it STARTING with no extra options. Thats called pricing yourself out of the market.

The Ford GT is a highly priced car but it is going to sell off of nastalgia and nothing more. You see there is a marketing scheme there that will most likely work. Yet i'm just not seeing it with chevy. You may say that they have increased sales in the past 2 years up to a level not reached since 1994. That sounds exciting but anytime you have a newly remodelled line its likely your sales are going to go up temporarily. The real question how will they sustain the growth and thats where my skepticism comes in.

Realquick,

As a matter of fact two times in my life i almost bought a GM vehicle. My parents of course have owned mostly GM in the past but now are moving to imports and other brand names. I almost purchased a full sized chevy truck but they just would not come down in price enough for us to be able to buy it for my first vehicle. I ended up with a dodge and that was a big mistake. I used to like the old pickup look (early 90's) but they screwed that up as they've screwed up most things. The second GM vehicle i was looking at was a black TA with ram air. I've always thought they were decent looking and the only thing i really dont like about their outside appearance is the rear which just seems kinda out of kilter with the rest of the vehicle. The interior is was turned me off most about the vehicle. Poor design and i could see why they turned into rattle traps. Again, the main reason i didn't end up buying it was because of the price and because of exhaust quality. I got to hear a few mustangs with flowmasters on them and looked them over really well and i was sold. Needless to say the price i got on the mustang was about 6,500 less than the TA was.

I guess i've gotten into cutting them down so much i dont say anything good and i appologize for that. I just simply do not understand GM taking some heritage names and destroying them...taking a perfectly good looking truck and making it the ugliest truck ever to hit the road...I just dont quite get it thats all.

It also seems as though you've been seeing too many 'Kiss Me''Kiss Me''Kiss Me''Kiss Me'ty drivers driving supercharged mustangs. Perhaps if you had a chance to come out to HRP in houston you could see some real drivers. There was a guy running 12.9's with nittos, spec stage II clutch, 3.73's, exhaust and a shifter. Talk about quick for cheap. Also, one of the KB members on this board ran i think it was 11.9x the first time out with his KB installed and had LESS than 400 rwhp.

Exotic cars are as you stated. The honda s2k is a joke for 35k.

Sadly enough you haven't been seeing the literally tons of 300+ rwhp 2valve posters coming on more and more frequently lately.

kirkyg

kirkyg said:

hahaha too freakin funny man. Japs are FAR from done for and GM is far from all about quality

kirkyg

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Looks like you don't do your homework 2 of the top 5 brands in initial quality are GMs, GM is ahead of off the japanese brands except Toyota and Honda, but they are very quicky catching up.

edit: why does it put "Kiss me" over the word J-a-p? since when is that bad?

If your talking about the convertible cadillac i could care less about it

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Nope, I never mentioned the new convertible XLR 'cause it's so expensive. The CTS-V is the 4-door 400 h.p. Cadillac that is pictured right in front of your nose in this thread! You really know nothing about any of these subjects we've been debating

Thats called pricing yourself out of the market.

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Again, what do you base that nugget of wisdom on? XLR's are pre-sold before they even hit the showroom floor, and I think it will continue to be a hot seller (relatively speaking for a car in that segment) ongoing.

The honda s2k is a joke for 35k

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They're not 35K, more like 30K, and it's plenty of car for the money, if you're looking for a canyon carver. You sound like you're a 1/4 mile kind of guy, so you don't understand cars like the S2000. Don't trash what you don't necessarily comprehend, plenty of enthusiasts out there think our Mustangs are glorified 1978 Ford Fairmonts with boat-anchor V8's that are terribly inefficient hp/displacement. And they are JUST as justified in that statement, maybe even moreso (as there is an element of truth to it), as you are in saying the S2000 is a joke when it could take your GT to a road course, even with your blower, and show you its taillights. And lastly, I think the new Chevy trucks look great. The old design was a yawn, and was old and tired. It looked good 15 years ago. But I like the new F150 even better, especially inside and mechanically.

LOL

First we need to know how they gathered their information, more specifically their statistics to see if they were truly random, and also to see what their definition of a vehicle "problem" is. I've seen surveyed information like this and it can and usually is manipulated for many possible reasons.

For instance JD power and associates has given awards to dodge ram for years running until the last year or two. Thats a prime example of how much creditibility we should give JD power and associates

Consider this also that may show these numbers to be just unimportant numbers. There maybe 137 dodge issues / 100 vehicles and the majority of those are rebuilt or replacement tranmissions (i can almost guarantee they are because ive owned 2 dodge rams and they BOTH had transmission rebuilds under warranty). Now consider ford has 136 issues / 100 vehicles, but what if most of those complaints are about a squeeky shock or a car tsb for a computer update? Would you consider the quality of the dodges as good as the ford even though they have much more serious issues than ford vehicles?

I didn't think so.

kirkyg

And lastly, I think the new Chevy trucks look great. The old design was a yawn, and was old and tired.

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Thats all i needed to know to disregard anything else you ever say

I think the arguing on the internet is like the special olympics picture is needed here.

kirkyg

RICKS said:

Nope, I never mentioned the new convertible XLR 'cause it's so expensive. The CTS-V is the 4-door 400 h.p. Cadillac that is pictured right in front of your nose in this thread! You really know nothing about any of these subjects we've been debating

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First of all we WERE debating a ford vehicle on a ford forum. Secondly, the truth is i didn't even waste my time to read through that whole thread i just skimmed it and from what i did catch it thought you were referring to the xlr convertible. I know plenty of these subjects but the fact of the matter is were supposed to be talking about ford vehicles so dont come on here expecting everyone here to diss fords and love GMs. Its just not going to happen. Probably most of the people are those that have had good experience with ford.

kirkyg

kirkyg said:

First of all we WERE debating a ford vehicle on a ford forum.

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Dont forget, a ford guy brought GM into this conversation by mention the ZO6. You guys should stop whining about GM coming in and ruining a Ford thread.

True true...but this still shouldn't have become the topic of conversation.

kirkyg

RealQuick said:

Dont forget, a ford guy brought GM into this conversation by mention the ZO6. You guys should stop whining about GM coming in and ruining a Ford thread.

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all this crap is about my comment? cool...

say what you want, to me Ford looks like they are going in a better direction than GM. thats just my eyes...

is the new GT an amazing car? of course
is a viper just as fast in the 1/4 with better brakes, weight distribution, and all for $60,000+ cheaper? yes

i'm very excited that ford built a car that can trounce the 360 modena (my dream car), but i do wish they had paid a little more attention to the competetion right here in america...

I'm waiting for a real-deal, production car vs production car, show-down ho-down. Prior to that, it's all speculation.

Kirky, the "Ummm I just skimmed it, I wasn't really reading it" excuse is older and dustier than the pyramids.

First of all we WERE debating a ford vehicle on a ford forum.

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Hey, you eagerly walked into the kitchen, it's not our fault you got outcooked. Bottom line is that Ford, GM and Chrysler are ALL making strides in quality. And I just came across an article in the Detroit Free Press that's extremely encouraging regarding the '05 Mustang. I'll post the link here, but I'll also post it on its own thread http://www.freep.com/money/autonews/stang15_20040315.htm

Yes they are all making strides in quality. As for the older than dust argument...you can believe what you want but thats exactly what i did...skimmed what you said and guessed what you meant.

I noticed on that list above infiniti is right there at the top. I always liked infiniti's but i do still question the source of information.

kirkyg

awalbert88 said:

But then, there hasn't been anything to confirm that GM is serious about a supercar-level Corvette, which I don't believe the Z06 qualifies as.

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Has anyone heard of the Blue Devil?


EDIT: Damn, this thread is freaking old....didn't even see how old it was.

Yellow01GT said:

Has anyone heard of the Blue Devil?


EDIT: Damn, this thread is freaking old....didn't even see how old it was.

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how the heck do you even find a thread that old

JonJon said:

how the heck do you even find a thread that old

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I had the exact same question. Talk about digging up a grave......

351CJ said:

I had the exact same question. Talk about digging up a grave......

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Yeah...I cleared the cache in my browser to be sure I wasn't bringing up an old page!