Fox Is my 255lph fuel pump causing my issue?

HarshFyasko66

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Sep 20, 2018
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So I’ve posted on here before and have gotten some great help! Been overseas for awhile and finally able to put some work in on my 90 lx fox.
So here’s the question. When driving a few different things can happen. 1st- car runs great with now issues but does feel slower. 2nd- the car will “bog” when trying to floor it then when I let go of the throttle it will pick up in RPMs then die down. Usually when this happens it’ll start to surge during idle and sometimes even die at a stop.
Past advice I was given was there was a vacuum leak somewhere ( Ran a smoke test through the heads which only revealed a very small leak coming from a crapped out oil cap which has been replaced and no leak now, also used some carb cleaner and sprayed every hose and port I could see with no changed to the engines idle showing) the other advice I was given was to test the voltage of my O2 sensors since they had tripped my CEL. Both tested fine with no issues. I don’t remember the code but I remember it saying they were running lean.
So now that you’re caught up with where I’m at this is my question. I remembered today that my old pump went out when I bought the car and I decided to replace it with a bigger pump. I installed a walbro 255lph. Would that be causing my issue? I’m still running the stock 19lb injectors and everything is pretty much stock aside from some long tube headers.
Any advice is great. Oh and th AJ you for ready this long a** message!
 

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nickyb

WAIT,you now have a pair?
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I replaced my stocked with the same Fuel pump and it's been running fine for years now,so I think you have other problems. The surging idle checklist is your new best friend,have at it.
 
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90sickfox

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Usually, if it's an oversized pump it'll cause fuel aeration that is more prevalent when the tank is below 1/2 tank.

If you were smoking the intake and smoke came out of the oil cap there could be a leak in the lower intake gasket causing the vacuum leak. It's a very common issue on our cars. You need to buy a cheap vacuum gauge ( Harbor Freight ) and post some readings.

Try smoking the intake again but plug the hose going to the pcv valve. That hose can allow smoke into the crankcase from the intake sometimes.
 
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General karthief

wonder how much it would cost to ship you a pair
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Pump not the problem, what's your static/operational fuel pressure?
Lean at the 02's say vacuum leak. Re do the smoke test like described above.
 

HarshFyasko66

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I did do a compression test awhile back. I don’t remember the numbers but I do remember they were all pretty much the same with maybe one or two being 1 lighter. I’ll run it again and get more accurate numbers. As for a smoke test I’ll need to build it again since the old one was thrown away when cleaning out the garage. Thank you for the advice!!
 

jrichker

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So I’ve posted on here before and have gotten some great help! Been overseas for awhile and finally able to put some work in on my 90 lx fox.
So here’s the question. When driving a few different things can happen. 1st- car runs great with now issues but does feel slower. 2nd- the car will “bog” when trying to floor it then when I let go of the throttle it will pick up in RPMs then die down. Usually when this happens it’ll start to surge during idle and sometimes even die at a stop.
Past advice I was given was there was a vacuum leak somewhere ( Ran a smoke test through the heads which only revealed a very small leak coming from a crapped out oil cap which has been replaced and no leak now, also used some carb cleaner and sprayed every hose and port I could see with no changed to the engines idle showing) the other advice I was given was to test the voltage of my O2 sensors since they had tripped my CEL. Both tested fine with no issues. I don’t remember the code but I remember it saying they were running lean.
So now that you’re caught up with where I’m at this is my question. I remembered today that my old pump went out when I bought the car and I decided to replace it with a bigger pump. I installed a walbro 255lph. Would that be causing my issue? I’m still running the stock 19lb injectors and everything is pretty much stock aside from some long tube headers.
Any advice is great. Oh and th AJ you for ready this long a** message!

How to clear codes.
Clearing the codes by pressing a button on the scan tool or disconnecting the test jumper used to start the code dump does not erase the “learned settings”. All it does is erase the stored codes in memory.

You must clear the codes anytime you replace any sensor. The following tells you how and is different from the method above
Clear the computer codes by disconnecting the battery negative terminal and turn the headlights on. Turn the headlights off and reconnect the all sensors including the MAF and anything else you may have disconnected. Then reconnect the battery negative cable.. This clears all spurious codes may have been generated while troubleshooting problems. It also clears the adaptive settings that the computer "learns" as it operates. Clearing the codes does not fix the code problems, it just gives you a clean slate to start recording what the computer sees happening.

Run the car for at least 30 minutes of driving and dump the codes again to assure that you have fixed the code problem or sensor problem. This is necessary for the computer to relearn the adaptive settings that the computer uses for proper operation. The engine may run rough at first, but should smooth out as it runs for the 15-20 minute learning period.

Code 41 or 91. Or 43 Three digit code 172 or 176 - O2 sensor indicates system lean. Look for a vacuum leak or failing O2 sensor.

Revised 01 Sep 2019 1.) To emphasize do not attempt to measure the O2 sensor resistance. Disconnect the O2 sensor from the wiring before doing any resistance checking of the sensor to computer wiring.

Code 41 is the passenger side sensor, as viewed from the driver's seat.
Code 91 is the driver side sensor, as viewed from the driver's seat.

Code 172 is the passenger side sensor as viewed from the driver's seat.
Code 176 is the driver side sensor, as viewed from the driver's seat.

Code 43 is not side specific according to the Probst Ford Fuel injection book.

The computer sees a lean mixture signal coming from the O2 sensors and tries to compensate by adding more fuel. Many times the end result is an engine that runs pig rich and stinks of unburned fuel.

The following is a Quote from Charles O. Probst, Ford fuel Injection & Electronic Engine control:

"When the mixture is lean, the exhaust gas has oxygen, about the same amount as the ambient air. So the sensor will generate less than 400 Millivolts. Remember lean = less voltage.
When the mixture is rich, there's less oxygen in the exhaust than in the ambient air , so voltage is generated between the two sides of the tip. The voltage is greater than 600 millivolts. Remember rich = more voltage.
Here's a tip: the newer the sensor, the more the voltage changes, swinging from as low as 0.1 volt to as much as 0.9 volt. As an oxygen sensor ages, the voltage changes get smaller and slower - the voltage change lags behind the change in exhaust gas oxygen.

Because the oxygen sensor generates its own voltage, never apply voltage and never measure resistance of the O2 sensor. Before checking the O2 sensor circuit wiring resistance, disconnect the O2 sensor from the rest of the circuit wiring. To measure voltage signals, use an analog voltmeter with a high input impedance, at least 10 megohms. Remember, a digital voltmeter will average a changing voltage. End Quote

Testing the O2 sensors 87-93 5.0 Mustangs

Measuring the O2 sensor voltage at the computer will give you a good idea of how well they are working. You'll have to pull the passenger side kick panel off to gain access to the computer connector. Remove the plastic wiring cover to get to the back side of the wiring. Use a safety pin or paper clip to probe the connections from the rear.


Disconnect the O2 sensor from the harness and use the body side O2 sensor harness as the starting point for testing. Do not measure the resistance of the O2 sensor, you may damage it. Resistance measurements for the O2 sensor harness are made with one meter lead on the O2 sensor harness and the other meter lead on the computer wire or pin for the O2 sensor.
Computer wiring harness connector, computer side.
88243.gif


Backside view of the computer wiring connector:
71316.gif



87-90 5.0 Mustangs:
Computer pin 43 Dark blue/Lt green – LH O2 sensor
Computer pin 29 Dark Green/Pink – RH O2 sensor

The computer pins are 29 (RH O2 with a dark green/pink wire) and 43 (LH O2 with a dark blue/lt green wire). Use the ground next to the computer to ground the voltmeter. The O2 sensor voltage should switch between .2-.9 volt at idle.


91-93 5.0 Mustangs:
Computer pin 43 Red/Black – LH O2 sensor
Computer pin 29 Gray/Lt blue – RH O2 sensor

The computer pins are 29 (RH O2 with a Gray/Lt blue wire) and 43 (LH O2 with a Red/Black wire). Use the ground next to the computer to ground the voltmeter. The O2 sensor voltage should switch between .2-.9 volt at idle.


94-95 5.0 Mustangs; note that the 94-95 uses a 4 wire O2 sensor.
The computer pins are 29 (LH O2 with a red/black wire) and 27 (RH O2 with a gray/lt blue wire). Use pin 32 (gray/red wire) to ground the voltmeter. . The O2 sensor voltage should switch between .2-.9 volt at idle.


Note that all resistance tests must be done with power off. Measuring resistance with a circuit powered on will give false readings and possibly damage the meter. Do not attempt to measure the resistance of the O2 sensors, it may damage them.

Testing the O2 sensor wiring harness
Most of the common multimeters have a resistance scale. Be sure the O2 sensors are disconnected and measure the resistance from the O2 sensor body harness to the pins on the computer. Using the Low Ohms range (usually 200 Ohms) you should see less than 1.5 Ohms.



87-90 5.0 Mustangs:
Computer pin 43 Dark blue/Lt green – LH O2 sensor
Computer pin 29 Dark Green/Pink – RH O2 sensor
Disconnect the connector from the O2 sensor and measure the resistance:
From the Dark blue/Lt green wire in the LH O2 sensor harness and the Dark blue/Lt green wire on the computer pin 43
From the Dark Green/Pink wire on the RH O2 sensor harness and the Dark Green/Pink wire on the computer pin 29


91-93 5.0 Mustangs:
Computer pin 43 Red/Black – LH O2 sensor
Computer pin 29 Gray/Lt blue – RH O2 sensor
Disconnect the connector from the O2 sensor and measure the resistance:
From the Red/Black wire in the LH O2 sensor harness and the Red/Black wire on the computer pin 43
From the Gray/Lt blue wire on the RH O2 sensor harness and the Gray/Lt blue wire on the computer pin 29

94-95 5.0 Mustangs:
Computer pin 29 Red/Black – LH O2 sensor
Computer pin 27 Gray/Lt blue – RH O2 sensor
From the Red/Black wire in the LH O2 sensor harness and the Red/Black wire on the computer pin 29
From the Dark Green/Pink Gray/Lt blue wire on the RH O2 sensor harness and the Gray/Lt blue wire on the computer pin 27


There is a connector between the body harness and the O2 sensor harness. Make sure the connectors are mated together, the contacts and wiring are not damaged, and the contacts are clean and not coated with oil.

The O2 sensor ground (orange wire with a ring terminal on it) is in the wiring harness for the fuel injection wiring. I grounded mine to one of the intake manifold bolts

Check the fuel pressure – the fuel pressure is 37-41 PSI with the vacuum disconnected and the engine idling. Fuel pressure out of range can cause the 41 & 91 codes together. It will not cause a single code, only both codes together.

Make sure you have the proper 3 wire O2 sensors. Only the 4 cylinder cars used a 4 wire sensor, which is not compatible with the V8 wiring harness. The exception is that the 94-95 uses a 4 wire O2 sensor.

Replace the O2 sensors in pairs if replacement is indicated. If one is weak or bad, the other one probably isn't far behind.

Code 41 can also be due to carbon plugging the driver’s side Thermactor air crossover tube on the back of the engine. The tube fills up with carbon and does not pass air to the driver’s side head ports. This puts an excess amount of air in the passenger side exhaust and can set the code 41. Remove the tube and clean it out so that both sides get good airflow: this may be more difficult than it sounds. You need something like a mini rotor-rooter to do the job because of the curves in the tube. Something like the outer spiral jacket of a flexible push-pull cable may be the thing that does the trick.

If you get only code 41 and have changed the sensor, look for vacuum leaks. This is especially true if you are having idle problems. The small plastic tubing is very brittle after many years of the heating it receives. Replace the tubing and check the PVC and the hoses connected to it.

Complete computer, actuator & sensor wiring diagram for 94-95 Mustangs
94-95_5.0_EEC_Wiring_Diagram.gif


Complete computer, actuator & sensor wiring diagram for 91-93 Mass Air Mustangs
91-93_5.0_EEC_Wiring_Diagram.gif


Complete computer, actuator & sensor wiring diagram for 88-90 Mass Air Mustangs
88-91_5.0_EEC_Wiring_Diagram.gif
 

HarshFyasko66

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Sep 20, 2018
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Found two leaks when performing a smoke test on the vacuum line going under the manifold. One is from the line going to the vapor canister and the other is from some component on the left side(facing the engine) posting below.
 

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90sickfox

Wasn't a pretty sight...and I've got big hands
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Do you still have the smog pump on your car ?

One of those things in the corner controls the EGR valve. The other one controls the bypass valve for the smog air injection system. Might be a cracked rubber boot on one of those vinyl vacuum lines down there.

The one under the intake looks like an easy vacuum line fix.
 

HarshFyasko66

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Sep 20, 2018
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I believe all the smog stuff was removed since the tubing off of the back has been removed and plugged off.
I remember it was throwing an EGR not opening properly code awhile back and when I changed it for a new one it still gave the same code. Could that sensor on the left be the culprit for the EGR acting up?
 

HarshFyasko66

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Sep 20, 2018
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So I ran the smoke test again but through the passenger exhaust side and plugged the driver side to allow the smoke to fill with a bit of pressure to see if any leaks appear. I had a bit leak through one of the headers runners before it connected to the collector.

Ran a compression test and got the following:
Cylinder:
1 - 160
2 - 155
3 - 158
4 - 150
5 - 160
6 - 150
7 - 150
8 - 150

I also dumped the codes and ran it for about 30 mins. The following codes came up:
KOEO= 11 - 10
KOER= 12 - 21 - 41 - 91 - 33
I know what the codes mean and have tested the following:

code 12: checked timing and the TPS sensor and both are in the right range with a base idle of about 800 RPMs

code 21: changed the sensor awhile back and the code never resolved. Haven’t done anything else since then with this code mostly because I feel that it isn’t related to my issue (icould be wrong?)

code 41-91: checked the voltages and resistances. All are in range and the sensors are pretty new maybe 100miles on them.

code 33: tested EGR and it opens and closes fine with no issues. I even went as far as to buy a new one; cleared my codes hooked it up and still got the same error.

By now I’m pretty much at a point where I believe I just have to fix the vacuum leaks pointed out by the smoke test. Any ideas? Am I on the right path? Also a buddy of mine pitched the whole “just switch to carb idea” what are your thoughts?
 

rdharper02

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I agree completely with going through JR's checklist, but General Karthief has a point. I did not read about an aftermarket fuel pressure regulator, and a factory should do fine, but you are working with unique circumstances. If you have my luck your mustang was rarely driven while you were gone. Between ethanol and other problems that occur from sitting........well give the fuel pressure a check. It could be high, low, or up and down. It's easy to check and has been a problem for me before.
 

90sickfox

Wasn't a pretty sight...and I've got big hands
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One of those vacuum solenoids is the control for the EGR. It's called the EVR. ( far left of picture area ) When the car is off the line off the EGR should be sealed. You can put a vacuum pump on it and check to see if that line is broken or the solenoid is not sealing. If its not working the egr will not work.

Screenshot_20210314-130658_Chrome.jpg
 

HarshFyasko66

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Sep 20, 2018
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Great thanks!! I’ll test those once I get the engine back in.... I ended up just pulling the engine to redo all the gaskets and seals. I have to replace my clutch and resurface the flywheel as well.