Lets Talk Traction

final5-0 · Jul 1, 2007

I'm gonna share a thought process with ya'll now I have kinda been
wanting to do for some time

I've been reluctant cause I feel might not be received all that well

Never the less ... Let me start by asking a Question

You know how some street surfaces are kinda slick. You certainly
can't get any traction in first so you quickly shift to second and still
gain nothing.

If you've done this .......

Ever notice when in second ... you let off a bit and still spin ......
You let off a bit more but continue to spin ....
You have to back all the way off
or
Almost all the way off to hook while still in second

If you do the same in first only and back off .....
You don't have to back off nearly the amount as before to gain hook

If anybody can relate to what I'm trying to get across here ........

Why do you see it said most of the time you will get no traction
if you go to a steeper gear and it is made to seem like .....
All is lost by doing so

I guess I am throwing out the thought that .......

Yes ... Steeper ratios will mean the tires are easier to spin
but
You can gain control with less effort ... so ... All is not lost

OK Folks

Time for you to .....

tell me I'm crazy
tell me you know what I mean
tell me you have never thought about it

Grady

Guero · Jul 1, 2007

I know exactly what your saying. Maybe I think its cause in second you have more momentum and you can spin them easier after they already started spinning.

The Green GT · Jul 1, 2007

I got a better 60' time at the track with my 3.73's than I did with my 2.73's.

But then again i also had some nittos on. lol

HISSIN50 · Jul 1, 2007

I get it too Grady. I just woke up so this is probably wrong and won't make sense:

I think Mew sub S and K come into play with regard to the application of torque. Once you lose one-to-one adhesion with the tire/road interface, the gearing isnt super critical (compared to when you have traction) and since you're spinning the wheels faster in second, you gotta let it slow down a lot more before it will re-bite (let alone that it's harder to modulate the gas pedal to find that sweet spot).

The Green GT · Jul 1, 2007

The main thing I like about my gears, is that if I let off too much, I can correct it quicker.

sage2k · Jul 1, 2007

The Green GT said:
I got a better 60' time at the track with my 3.73's than I did with my 2.73's.

But then again i also had some nittos on. lol

my best that day was with your street tires

rj95svt · Jul 2, 2007

Your right on. With higher gears once you get the tires spinning although they are harder to initially break loose they spin faster and are much harder to modulate without completly lifting. The thing is that with lower gears the initial launch is much more tricky.

final5-0 · Jul 2, 2007

rj95svt said:
Your right on. With higher gears once you get the tires spinning although they are harder to initially break loose they spin faster and are much harder to modulate without completly lifting. The thing is that with lower gears the initial launch is much more tricky.

Yes ... You have described what I wanted to get across.

Let me pose these two Q's to the all the members

Speaking Street use ONLY

1) What application of traction is important to you?

A) Cruise around town with WOT applied from a roll
B) Stoplight start at WOT

2) How would you describe your ability to hook with driving conditions A & B?

For me ... I rarely do B

My main application would be A

I can't get traction in 1st at WOT from a roll

In 2nd ... I can hook at WOT from a roll about 50% of the time
Only IF
I go to the floor kinda slow with the skinny pedal

I rarely break loose in 3rd from a roll

Grady

1slow95 · Jul 2, 2007

With my street tires, 315/35/17 GSD3's, both A and B would not hook up at all in 1st. If I roll into the throttle slowly I could go WOT in 1st without spinning much. From a roll in 2nd it would hook up most of the time, but occasionally it would light them up and it would almost always start spinning near redline.

With my 315/35/17 M/T ET Streets, I've only done A so far and I can spin them a little if I'm trying to. Usually I just get a chirp and the car takes off. That's in 1st, 2nd hooks up even better.

Usually I get up to about a 5mph roll and punch it. I haven't actually done B in a long time. If I'm in town I don't like to get on it too much because my exhaust is so loud. Any other stop lights/signs I come to generally require turning when going through the intersection.

gcomfx.com · Jul 2, 2007

A & B =

http://www.100mphclub.com/movies/331_gcomfx1.mov

B =
http://www.100mphclub.com/movies/331_gcomfx2.mov

I really want more traction from a stop personally.

final5-0 · Jul 2, 2007

Low-5.0 said:
With my street tires, 315/35/17 GSD3's, both A and B would not hook up at all in 1st. If I roll into the throttle slowly I could go WOT in 1st without spinning much. From a roll in 2nd it would hook up most of the time, but occasionally it would light them up and it would almost always start spinning near redline.

With my 315/35/17 M/T ET Streets, I've only done A so far and I can spin them a little if I'm trying to. Usually I just get a chirp and the car takes off. That's in 1st, 2nd hooks up even better.

Usually I get up to about a 5mph roll and punch it. I haven't actually done B in a long time. If I'm in town I don't like to get on it too much because my exhaust is so loud. Any other stop lights/signs I come to generally require turning when going through the intersection.

Good info Mike

I understand about the exhaust noise and attracting attention

Just one more reason I've not upgraded my cat back :Word:

I keep a pretty low profile with my catted h pipe and oem cat back when
talking WOT application

As for rolling into WOT ...
Mike ... My tiny 302 doesn't quite make the torque
your bad boy stroker does

Those ET Streets ... I got a Q or two for you

Soft for great traction
but
They ain't gonna last for too many street miles ... are they

How bad would they be in the rain

I got caught in the rain once with Full Wrinkle Wall Slicks

Anything much over idle was ... Slick City

Grady

WHITE94COBRA · Jul 2, 2007

I havnt yet geared my car, so my data may be a little off of everyone elses, I can go WOT in first but it breaks traction pretty easy, second I can hit WOT, and it just goes, matter a fact I get a little bog unless I was on it in first. When I had my old falken tires on it would light up first and second with the press of the throttle, with the nittos I can get first to spin pretty easy still but second I can only get a chirp out of it, and third, well it hooks dead. I really dont know if the previous owner did gears, but my car spins kinda high on the freeway at 75mph, im at about 2100 - 2300 rpm's. Also since I gut the cats (they were melted badly) it seems my car has lost alot of power, now I understand the TQ will drop without the presence of backpressure, but even my upper rpm HP seems soft??? My dyno runs will tell the tale here pretty soon.

I would expect my car to spin pretty easy, considering I have 18's on it. They are 285 35 18's to be exact...

1slow95 · Jul 2, 2007

final5-0 said:
Those ET Streets ... I got a Q or two for you

Soft for great traction
but
They ain't gonna last for too many street miles ... are they

How bad would they be in the rain

I got caught in the rain once with Full Wrinkle Wall Slicks

Anything much over idle was ... Slick City

Grady

These tires are extremely soft. The general consensus going around the net is 3000 miles, give or take a 1000 or so depending on driving style. I only drive my car around 1000 miles a year so they should last me a few years.

As for driving in the rain, I had to do it once for about a mile, and it went pretty smooth. They should do alright for the random shower that pops up, as long as there's still some tread left on them.

(I believe the smaller versions of these tires have a different tread pattern, so I have no idea how they would do in the rain.)

Guero · Jul 2, 2007

What brand are those?

1slow95 · Jul 2, 2007

Guero said:
What brand are those?

Mickey Thompson's. http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/strip.php?item=ETStreetRadial

The Green GT · Jul 2, 2007

Low-5.0 said:
Mickey Thompson's. http://www.mickeythompsontires.com/strip.php?item=ETStreetRadial

How long do you think those would last on a daily driver?

Pokageek · Jul 2, 2007

final5-0 said:
...

Time for you to .....

tell me I'm crazy
tell me you know what I mean
tell me you have never thought about it

Grady

Yoo crazy.

cbarr300 · Jul 2, 2007

1st - (WOT) no traction from a stop...no traction from a roll...period

2nd - from a roll...as long as I slip the clutch a bit I can get it to hook...then it breaks at 4500 or so. Downshifting and flooring it......those tires have no hope.

I've had 3rd break on me going from 4th/3rd (only once...didn't mess with that anymore). I have falken fk-451s (in the 285 variety). It's a decent tire and holds up well under daily driving. Thinking about the 555r though.

Edit: also have 3.73s with a 3550 tranny

sage2k · Jul 2, 2007

The Green GT said:
How long do you think those would last on a daily driver?

1slow95 · Jul 2, 2007

sage2k said:

x2

I'd say it's a safe bet that you'd be replacing tires every other oil change or sooner.

Lets Talk Traction

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