So how do we prepare ourselves against radar happy cops?

Chythar · May 10, 2009

Hmmm, this is a big subject. Some basics: There are different "bands" of radar out there that I know of: X, K and Ka. The radar works by bouncing a radar wavelength off a moving target and receiving the bounced signal back. The signal received has been changed a certain amount based on the speed difference. The radar gun compares that new signal to a "baseline" signal it stores internally to calculate your speed.

Two flaws in the radar gun system that I know of:
1. There is a "Pop" mode on radar guns that claims to be able to detect your speed without a radar detector going off. These modes operate so fast that the internal electronic equipment doesn't have a chance to synchronize itself and the resulting speed measured is not guaranteed to be accurate. This is as per the instruction manuals included with the radar guns, so the "pop" mode is not admissible in court.

2. Radar guns report the speed difference between the gun and the target. Most guns are intended to be stationary for that reason. Car-mounted radar guns shoot a second signal to the side of the road, which presumes that the signal returned is from a stationary target. The equipment can them calculate the target's speed accurately. The problem is, sometimes that second signal bounces off of a moving target such as a semi truck. So the math is off and the radar gun may report the target's speed too high. So you get a speeding ticket for 15 miles over the limit while you were only 7 over, or something like that.

Another thing to protect yourself in court. All states have laws on officer training and how often the radar gun must be calibrated. You can get out of a ticket if a cop can't prove in court that he has had the correct training and the radar gun was maintained properly. However, this is a very tricky gambit and should only be attempted by a lawyer, IMO.

Now, as for the "best" detector I'm sure you'll get plenty of opinions. I've used the Valentine One for several years, it's only sold online. I can think of several specific instances that the Valentine One's unique features have given me an early enough warning to slow down and avoid a ticket. The main thing to realize is, any radar detector is a tool. If you do not learn how the tool works and how to interpret what it's telling you, it won't help you at all.

Pokageek · May 10, 2009

toyman · May 10, 2009

Beyond radar detection protection, you may also want to consider the rare but possible, "dead in their sites laser gun" attack - only Escort and Bel (in our list of detectors to consider) have add-on systems that completely disarm the laser gun and prevent it from targeting and tracking you for purposes of being stopped.

This becomes trickier if caught with a blocking device. Where I am and I'm sure in most jurisdictions this can now bring an obstruction of justice charge. This really become a serious offense and can bring serious jail time. That's a whole different ballgame.

What disclaimers do Bel and Escort make for the use of the disarming feature?

Adam95GT · May 10, 2009

just dont speed

yukisho · May 10, 2009

I am one to go a little faster than the current speed is set at. I usually play by the 5 over rule. If you are at only 5 over and a cop radars you and your caught, depending on his/her mood you can get out of it. Usually 7mph or more you get a ticket. There are so many ways to try an get out of a ticket, but bottom line is that you were speeding and you are guilty no matter how you argue it. The one thing a cop hates is someone arguing with them. If you have a valid statement then you may get out of it. But do as I do, follow the 5 over rule. And don't street race. That grounds for an impound and possible license loss.

blksn955.o · May 10, 2009

Learned my lesson the hard way. I am at most 5-7mph over the limit if I am at all. Unless weather conditions are poor I am at least doing the speed limit. Don't be the rabbit also helps.

Oddly enough the thing I found to help get to my destination quicker. I avoid the lanes with a Dodge/Chrysler/Plymouth products or any Mini van in it if I can. I took 10min off my avg drive time by doing this...90% of the time if it one of the above they are the problem holding up traffic. I explained this "Dodge Theory" as I call it to a few people. All looked at me like I was nuts...then they tried it/noticed there is something to this theory. My wife now actually blurts out...DAMN DODGE. This really helped on the highway the most but its great at giving a slight edge to stop and go traffic to use what lane.

The theory goes

- What seems like 90% or so of the cars that are going 10mph or more under the speed limit tend to be a Dodge/Chrysler/Plymouth product or Mini van.
- A large majority of the drivers who cut across 2+ lanes without a signal or make sudden lane changes with no signal tend to be in said automobiles.
- Automobiles that are smoking at take off like they are part of a city mosquito fogger program...tend to also drive in the far left lane below speed limit tend to be Dodge/Chrysler/Plymouth or soccer mom mini vans.
- A majority of the drivers that pull out in front of you in a BIG hurry then once in one lane tend to drive well below the speed limit.
- Most of these drivers have to come to a COMPLETE stop before making any kind of turn no matter if they are going 50mph or 5mph..."Ohhhhhh damn I need to stop for this???".
- Those that turn in these automobiles almost always can not keep their automobile in 1 lane while turning or within the first 5 miles of said turn.
- No ability to keep or maintain any sort of constant speed.

It is not 100%, but an overwhelming majority. Try it you might find yourself arriving sooner than you normally do and on a regular basis.

revhead347 · May 10, 2009

I use a Valentine One. Once you use a Valentine One, you will never go back to any other radar detector. It is worth the money. Most of Georgia has gone to those Liadar detectors, which use lasar. It's instant on, and it's very hard for the radar detector to catch it. The only way to get it is if he pops someone up the road from you, the radar detector will catch it even if it isn't aimed at you. There is no radar detector that will protect you 100% of the time. A few of the home made radar jammers work, but I've generally heard the ones that are mass produced don't do anything. I did hang out with this guy in high school who was a genius, and built his own cop stopper. But half the time it didn't work and it was bulky, and it put a lot of load on his alternator. I wouldn't have the faintest idea how to make one.

Kurt

Pokageek · May 10, 2009

Chythar · May 11, 2009

Pokageek said:
It should definitely not be a federal offense to jam some a h ole s gadar gun.

Problem is, jamming radar is treated the same whether you're jamming a radar gun or jamming airplane radar. You'd be in big doo doo if you tried and were caught.

To refute a few things in that article you quoted:

"only Escort and Bel (in our list of detectors to consider) have add-on systems that completely disarm the laser gun and prevent it from targeting and tracking you for purposes of being stopped"

True, the Valentine One does not attempt to jam LIDAR, nor do they ever plan to. That's a nice gray area in the law, as toyman mentioned.

"Only Escort and Bel have a detector that is fully prepared to ***** and alert you to red light and speed camera threats accurately"

Many red light and speed cameras aren't radar-based. All these systems are doing is tracking you by GPS and warning you when you're approaching one. Here's a bit more info from Valentine One on their position:

Valentine One Tech Report #7

As far as I know, the Valentine one has two very important features that no other detector has: the Bogey Counter and Directional arrows. The V1 counts how many signals it's picked up, and uses the arrows to indicate where the signal is coming from. What do all the other detectors do when you get a new signal in?

*BEEP*

Cops love to hide in areas where you get false signals. A nearby mall might be spraying X band radar over the road, and a cop using a Ka band radar gun can hide in that false signal. The V1 will indicate both X and Ka are picked up, and show 2 signals. Other detectors won't warn you of the cop's Ka signal, you'll get the same *BEEP* you always do; guess (wrong) that it's just the mall again and speed on by. BAM! The taxman gets you again.

If you can't tell, I'm a big fan of the Valentine One. Red Light cameras don't bother me 'cause I simply don't run red lights or try to sneak through during the yellow. The speed cameras that don't use radar are stationary, and there are signs on the road warning you about them. I always read all signs by default, so no worries for me there either.

For many scenarios where the V1 beats out other detectors, check out their V1 Moments. While these stories are supposed to be "real" events, I take them as scenarios where the V1 gives you an edge over the other detectors.

Black95GTS · May 11, 2009

I always travel with a beautiful girl in the passenger seat.

Adam

Venom351R · May 11, 2009

does she inflate?

Pokageek · May 11, 2009

Car Nut · May 11, 2009

Great discussion!

I got more tickets using a radar detector than without one. Only got one ticket without a detector, but too many with it active. Best practice is to keep the pace of traffic and keep the lane changes to a minimum.

Ever seen someone coming up on you or going past you and they are just driving like a moron (rage, stupid, big hurry, or whatever)? Don't be that person. A cop will notice this much quicker as that is the only thing he is doing at the moment.

You can add speed and red light camera locations to just about any GPS uinit. I get these from a place that updates very often. I have no intention of running red lights, but I do want to make particularly sure that I don't finish a turn or do anything that might get me caught up in an intersection (traffic, etc.). No speed cameras in GA that I know of, so that is not an issue.

If I did get another detector, it would be a Valentine One (quality has proven itself for years) in concealed fashion. No sense having a detector in plain view, because that will just about remove any chance of getting a warning.

Honestly, in Atlanta, I see maybe one or two cops a month (if that) targeting speeders. If you want to speed, come to the Atlanta interstates where we average about 80mph (55mph zones) in non-peak traffic. Of course, understand that all traffic is going that speed or greater. You'll be speeding, but only within the flow of normal traffic.

revhead347 · May 11, 2009

They aren't too bad up where I am in Acworth, but I've seen them start to hit I-285 a little harder lately.

Kurt

wytstang · May 11, 2009

Funny how cops are "a holes" when they enforce the law. Then they are sorry "a holes" when they don't.

Pokageek · May 11, 2009

wytstang said:
Funny how cops are "a holes" when they enforce the law. Then they are sorry "a holes" when they don't.

Yea whatever. I've got friends, relatives, etc who are cops dude so relax. We're talking about speeding no tburglery or assault. They let each other off and speed all the time and do whatever they want and you know it. Then they nail a guy like Chris who is mostly a responsible driver cruising in his newly built car with no one around and putting no one in danger.

94-302-vert · May 11, 2009

Car Nut said:
Great discussion!

I got more tickets using a radar detector than without one. Only got one ticket without a detector, but too many with it active. Best practice is to keep the pace of traffic and keep the lane changes to a minimum.

Ever seen someone coming up on you or going past you and they are just driving like a moron (rage, stupid, big hurry, or whatever)? Don't be that person. A cop will notice this much quicker as that is the only thing he is doing at the moment.

I will also add to look FAR enough ahead to catch brake lights... I usually know there is a cop hiding a half mile before those around me....

revhead347 · May 11, 2009

wytstang said:
Funny how cops are "a holes" when they enforce the law. Then they are sorry "a holes" when they don't.

Actually, it's technically not the law. Speed limits have to be posted in order to be legal, since they removed the Federal Speed limit in the 90s. According to the Standardization act of 1976, Speed limits have to posted with a specific sign, and more specifically in KPH. The Act had a clause in it giving states a reasonable period of time to comply. There are only two cities in America that are in compliance. Sunrise, FL is one of them, and I forget the other one. There was a commentary on this on motorist.org one time. I think you could make an argument that 33 years is more than a reasonable period of time. Don't waste your time in GA or FL though, the traffic judges here aren't even literate.

Kurt

timeless2 · May 11, 2009

Black95GTS said:
I always travel with a beautiful girl in the passenger seat.

Adam

Redline_351R said:
does she inflate?

Travis, you ass.

Pokageek said:
Yea whatever. I've got friends, relatives, etc who are cops dude so relax. We're talking about speeding no tburglery or assault. They let each other off and speed all the time and do whatever they want and you know it. Then they nail a guy like Chris who is mostly a responsible driver cruising in his newly built car with no one around and putting no one in danger.

How would he/she feel if he/she let someone off for speeding, then later got a call for a scene where that same individual t-boned another car, with the obvious cause being excessive velocity? Not saying it's the case here, but it is definitely something to think about...

So how do we prepare ourselves against radar happy cops?

Pokageek

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Chythar

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Pokageek

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toyman

Adam95GT

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yukisho

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blksn955.o

revhead347

Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.

Pokageek

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Chythar

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Venom351R

Pokageek

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revhead347

Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.

wytstang

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Pokageek

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94-302-vert

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revhead347

Apparently my ex-husband made that mistake.

timeless2

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