Ok so about a month I bought my first mustang it is a 1988 mustang gt hatchback it has IRS suspension, 5 lug swap, trickle flow upper lower heat series intake, 70mm tb, New motor 30k miles from an 87', cold air intake, gt40 heads, air mass sensor 87mm, shorty headers, smog ac and power steering delete/underddrive pulleys. It was running good when I bought it but now all of the sudden it'll start and then die unless I give it gas for about 10 seconds after that it won't do it for the rest of the day, or it'll keep on doing it. I'm buying a code reader soon to see what it has to say, also I'll check for vacum leaks but does anybody know what could be the main problem?Thanks in advance
Starts Then Stalls (sometimes)
- Thread starter Foxstang31
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Sounds like you have a pretty solid car and somebody put a lot of time and money into that car. Post some pics!!
The fact that it ran just fine when you got it tells me that the combo works well together and your MAF most likely matches your injectors (however it sounds really over sized, it only needs to be 75mm at the most). I think you will find the answer to your problem when you run codes.
You don't need to wait till you get the reader unless you want to. @jrichker for help with diagnostics. Once you run codes you can post them up and he is a great person that will help you through fixing them (assuming you have codes present).
Off the top of my head I think a simple easy thing to try would be to clean your throttle body and IAC (idle air control) with TB cleaner.
The fact that it ran just fine when you got it tells me that the combo works well together and your MAF most likely matches your injectors (however it sounds really over sized, it only needs to be 75mm at the most). I think you will find the answer to your problem when you run codes.
You don't need to wait till you get the reader unless you want to. @jrichker for help with diagnostics. Once you run codes you can post them up and he is a great person that will help you through fixing them (assuming you have codes present).
Off the top of my head I think a simple easy thing to try would be to clean your throttle body and IAC (idle air control) with TB cleaner.
Somebody gave that thing away huh? Do tell....when you post pics.Ok and I'll post some pics up later today, and you wouldn't belive the price I paid for it
As suggested...
Dump the codes: Codes may be present even if the Check Engine Light (CEL) isn't on.
Dumping the computer diagnostic codes on 86-95 Mustangs
Revised 26-July-2011. Added need to make sure the clutch is pressed when dumping codes.
Codes may be present even if the check engine light hasn’t come on, so be sure to check for them.
Here's the way to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.
Post the codes you get and I will post 86-93 model 5.0 Mustang specific code definitions and fixes. I do not have a complete listing for 94-95 model 5.0 Mustangs at this time.
Be sure to turn off the A/C, and put the transmission in neutral when dumping the codes. On a manual transmission car, be sure to press the clutch to the floor.
Fail to do this and you will generate a code 67 and not be able to dump the Engine Running codes.
If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.
The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.
89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.
The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.
WARNING!!! There is a single dark brown connector with a black/orange wire. It is the 12 volt power to the under the hood light. Do not jumper it to the computer test connector. If you do, you will damage the computer.
What to expect:
You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good. No code 11 and you have some wiring problems. This is crucial: the same wire that provides the ground to dump the codes provides signal ground for the TPS, EGR, ACT and Map/Baro sensors. If it fails, you will have poor performance, economy and driveablity problems
Some codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.
Dumping the Engine Running codes: The procedure is the same, you start the engine with the test jumper in place. Be sure the A/C is off, and clutch (if present) is pressed to the floor, and the transmission is in neutral. You'll get an 11, then a 4 and the engine will speed up to do the EGR test. After the engine speed decreases back to idle, it will dump the engine running codes.
Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.
Your 86-88 5.0 won't have a working Check Engine Light, so you'll need a test light.
See AutoZone Part Number: 25886 , $10
Alternate methods:
For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see Actron® for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.
Or for a nicer scanner see Equus Digital Ford Code Reader (3145) Equus - Digital Ford Code Reader 3145.
It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $22-$36.
Dump the codes: Codes may be present even if the Check Engine Light (CEL) isn't on.
Dumping the computer diagnostic codes on 86-95 Mustangs
Revised 26-July-2011. Added need to make sure the clutch is pressed when dumping codes.
Codes may be present even if the check engine light hasn’t come on, so be sure to check for them.
Here's the way to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.
Post the codes you get and I will post 86-93 model 5.0 Mustang specific code definitions and fixes. I do not have a complete listing for 94-95 model 5.0 Mustangs at this time.
Be sure to turn off the A/C, and put the transmission in neutral when dumping the codes. On a manual transmission car, be sure to press the clutch to the floor.
Fail to do this and you will generate a code 67 and not be able to dump the Engine Running codes.
If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.
The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.
89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.
The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.
WARNING!!! There is a single dark brown connector with a black/orange wire. It is the 12 volt power to the under the hood light. Do not jumper it to the computer test connector. If you do, you will damage the computer.
What to expect:
You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good. No code 11 and you have some wiring problems. This is crucial: the same wire that provides the ground to dump the codes provides signal ground for the TPS, EGR, ACT and Map/Baro sensors. If it fails, you will have poor performance, economy and driveablity problems
Some codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.
Dumping the Engine Running codes: The procedure is the same, you start the engine with the test jumper in place. Be sure the A/C is off, and clutch (if present) is pressed to the floor, and the transmission is in neutral. You'll get an 11, then a 4 and the engine will speed up to do the EGR test. After the engine speed decreases back to idle, it will dump the engine running codes.
Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.
Your 86-88 5.0 won't have a working Check Engine Light, so you'll need a test light.
See AutoZone Part Number: 25886 , $10
Alternate methods:
For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see Actron® for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.
Or for a nicer scanner see Equus Digital Ford Code Reader (3145) Equus - Digital Ford Code Reader 3145.
It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $22-$36.
Alright codes are in code reader came with a book full of code readings and this is what I got!
Engine was not running key was on though!
11
31-EVP or PFE circuit below minimum voltage
67- clutch not pressed in
85-shift solenoid
51-ect sensor out of range indicated/circuit open
53-fuel injector pump lever sensor input is greater than self test
54-intake air charge temperature sensor circuit open;vane air flow sensor out of range
@jrichker the ground wire that was used to dump the codes did not have a good ground I had to hook it up to the battery like the book said so does that mean I'll have poor performance, economy, and drivability problems?
Engine was not running key was on though!
11
31-EVP or PFE circuit below minimum voltage
67- clutch not pressed in
85-shift solenoid
51-ect sensor out of range indicated/circuit open
53-fuel injector pump lever sensor input is greater than self test
54-intake air charge temperature sensor circuit open;vane air flow sensor out of range
@jrichker the ground wire that was used to dump the codes did not have a good ground I had to hook it up to the battery like the book said so does that mean I'll have poor performance, economy, and drivability problems?
Last edited:
What you got from the code reader book is pretty much useless.
The fact that you could not get codes to dump using the diagram I provided suggests that you have wiring or computer problems. You need to check that out before chasing any code problems. They may be causing some of the codes.
Computer will not go into diagnostic mode on 86-90 model 5.0 Mustangs
Disconnect the battery positive terminal before making any resistance checks.
The voltage drop in the ground cable will cause incorrect resistance readings.
How it is supposed to work:
The black/white wire (pin 46) is signal ground for the computer. It provides a dedicated ground for the EGR, Baro, ACT, ECT, & TPS sensors as well as the ground to put the computer into self test mode. If this ground is bad, none of the sensors mentioned will work properly. That will severely affect the car's performance. You will have hard starting, low power and drivability problems. Since it is a dedicated ground, it passes through the computer on its way to the computer main power ground that terminates at the battery pigtail ground. It should read less than 1.5 ohms when measured from anyplace on the engine harness with the battery pigtail ground as the other reference point for the ohmmeter probe.
What sometimes happens is that the test connector black/white wire gets jumpered to power which either burns up the wiring or burns the trace off the pc board inside the computer. That trace connects pins 46 to pins 40 & 60.
The STI (Self Test Input ) is jumpered to ground to put the computer into test mode. Jumpering it to power can produce unknown results, including damage to the computer. The ohm test simply verifies that there are no breaks in the wiring between the test connector and the computer input.
How to test the wiring :
With the power off, measure the resistance between the computer test ground (black/white wire) on the self test connector and battery ground. You should see less than 1.5 ohms.
If that check fails, remove the passenger side kick panel and disconnect the computer connector. There is a 10 MM bolt that holds it in place. Measure the resistance between the black/white wire and pin 46 on the computer wiring connector: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that 1.5 ohms is a wiring problem. If it reads 1.5 ohms or less, then the computer is suspect. On the computer, measure the resistance between pin 46 and pins 40 & 60: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that that and the computer’s internal ground has failed, and the computer needs to be repaired or replaced.
See Computer issue? | Mustang Forums at StangNet for Joel5.0’s fix for the computer internal signal ground.
If the first ground check was good, there are other wires to check. Measure the resistance between the STI computer self test connector (red/white wire) and pin 48 on the computer main connector: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that 1.5 ohms is a wiring problem
The following is a view from the computer side of the computer wiring connector: it is for an A9L, A9P computer.
Diagram courtesy of Tmoss & Stang&2birds
Check out the diagram and notice all the places the black/white wire goes. Almost every sensor on the engine except the MAF is connected to it.
See the following website for some help from Tmoss (diagram designer) & Stang&2Birds
(website host) for help on 88-95 wiring Mustang FAQ - Wiring & Engine Info
See the graphic for the 10 pin connector circuit layout.
Computer will not go into diagnostic mode on 86-90 model 5.0 Mustangs
Disconnect the battery positive terminal before making any resistance checks.
The voltage drop in the ground cable will cause incorrect resistance readings.
How it is supposed to work:
The black/white wire (pin 46) is signal ground for the computer. It provides a dedicated ground for the EGR, Baro, ACT, ECT, & TPS sensors as well as the ground to put the computer into self test mode. If this ground is bad, none of the sensors mentioned will work properly. That will severely affect the car's performance. You will have hard starting, low power and drivability problems. Since it is a dedicated ground, it passes through the computer on its way to the computer main power ground that terminates at the battery pigtail ground. It should read less than 1.5 ohms when measured from anyplace on the engine harness with the battery pigtail ground as the other reference point for the ohmmeter probe.
What sometimes happens is that the test connector black/white wire gets jumpered to power which either burns up the wiring or burns the trace off the pc board inside the computer. That trace connects pins 46 to pins 40 & 60.
The STI (Self Test Input ) is jumpered to ground to put the computer into test mode. Jumpering it to power can produce unknown results, including damage to the computer. The ohm test simply verifies that there are no breaks in the wiring between the test connector and the computer input.
How to test the wiring :
With the power off, measure the resistance between the computer test ground (black/white wire) on the self test connector and battery ground. You should see less than 1.5 ohms.
If that check fails, remove the passenger side kick panel and disconnect the computer connector. There is a 10 MM bolt that holds it in place. Measure the resistance between the black/white wire and pin 46 on the computer wiring connector: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that 1.5 ohms is a wiring problem. If it reads 1.5 ohms or less, then the computer is suspect. On the computer, measure the resistance between pin 46 and pins 40 & 60: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that that and the computer’s internal ground has failed, and the computer needs to be repaired or replaced.
See Computer issue? | Mustang Forums at StangNet for Joel5.0’s fix for the computer internal signal ground.
If the first ground check was good, there are other wires to check. Measure the resistance between the STI computer self test connector (red/white wire) and pin 48 on the computer main connector: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that 1.5 ohms is a wiring problem
The following is a view from the computer side of the computer wiring connector: it is for an A9L, A9P computer.
Diagram courtesy of Tmoss & Stang&2birds
Check out the diagram and notice all the places the black/white wire goes. Almost every sensor on the engine except the MAF is connected to it.
See the following website for some help from Tmoss (diagram designer) & Stang&2Birds
(website host) for help on 88-95 wiring Mustang FAQ - Wiring & Engine Info
See the graphic for the 10 pin connector circuit layout.
The fact that you could not get codes to dump using the diagram I provided suggests that you have wiring or computer problems. You need to check that out before chasing any code problems. They may be causing some of the codes.
Computer will not go into diagnostic mode on 86-90 model 5.0 Mustangs
Disconnect the battery positive terminal before making any resistance checks.
The voltage drop in the ground cable will cause incorrect resistance readings.
How it is supposed to work:
The black/white wire (pin 46) is signal ground for the computer. It provides a dedicated ground for the EGR, Baro, ACT, ECT, & TPS sensors as well as the ground to put the computer into self test mode. If this ground is bad, none of the sensors mentioned will work properly. That will severely affect the car's performance. You will have hard starting, low power and drivability problems. Since it is a dedicated ground, it passes through the computer on its way to the computer main power ground that terminates at the battery pigtail ground. It should read less than 1.5 ohms when measured from anyplace on the engine harness with the battery pigtail ground as the other reference point for the ohmmeter probe.
What sometimes happens is that the test connector black/white wire gets jumpered to power which either burns up the wiring or burns the trace off the pc board inside the computer. That trace connects pins 46 to pins 40 & 60.
The STI (Self Test Input ) is jumpered to ground to put the computer into test mode. Jumpering it to power can produce unknown results, including damage to the computer. The ohm test simply verifies that there are no breaks in the wiring between the test connector and the computer input.
How to test the wiring :
With the power off, measure the resistance between the computer test ground (black/white wire) on the self test connector and battery ground. You should see less than 1.5 ohms.
If that check fails, remove the passenger side kick panel and disconnect the computer connector. There is a 10 MM bolt that holds it in place. Measure the resistance between the black/white wire and pin 46 on the computer wiring connector: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that 1.5 ohms is a wiring problem. If it reads 1.5 ohms or less, then the computer is suspect. On the computer, measure the resistance between pin 46 and pins 40 & 60: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that that and the computer’s internal ground has failed, and the computer needs to be repaired or replaced.
See Computer issue? | Mustang Forums at StangNet for Joel5.0’s fix for the computer internal signal ground.
If the first ground check was good, there are other wires to check. Measure the resistance between the STI computer self test connector (red/white wire) and pin 48 on the computer main connector: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that 1.5 ohms is a wiring problem
The following is a view from the computer side of the computer wiring connector: it is for an A9L, A9P computer.
Diagram courtesy of Tmoss & Stang&2birds
Check out the diagram and notice all the places the black/white wire goes. Almost every sensor on the engine except the MAF is connected to it.
See the following website for some help from Tmoss (diagram designer) & Stang&2Birds
(website host) for help on 88-95 wiring Mustang FAQ - Wiring & Engine Info
See the graphic for the 10 pin connector circuit layout.
Computer will not go into diagnostic mode on 86-90 model 5.0 Mustangs
Disconnect the battery positive terminal before making any resistance checks.
The voltage drop in the ground cable will cause incorrect resistance readings.
How it is supposed to work:
The black/white wire (pin 46) is signal ground for the computer. It provides a dedicated ground for the EGR, Baro, ACT, ECT, & TPS sensors as well as the ground to put the computer into self test mode. If this ground is bad, none of the sensors mentioned will work properly. That will severely affect the car's performance. You will have hard starting, low power and drivability problems. Since it is a dedicated ground, it passes through the computer on its way to the computer main power ground that terminates at the battery pigtail ground. It should read less than 1.5 ohms when measured from anyplace on the engine harness with the battery pigtail ground as the other reference point for the ohmmeter probe.
What sometimes happens is that the test connector black/white wire gets jumpered to power which either burns up the wiring or burns the trace off the pc board inside the computer. That trace connects pins 46 to pins 40 & 60.
The STI (Self Test Input ) is jumpered to ground to put the computer into test mode. Jumpering it to power can produce unknown results, including damage to the computer. The ohm test simply verifies that there are no breaks in the wiring between the test connector and the computer input.
How to test the wiring :
With the power off, measure the resistance between the computer test ground (black/white wire) on the self test connector and battery ground. You should see less than 1.5 ohms.
If that check fails, remove the passenger side kick panel and disconnect the computer connector. There is a 10 MM bolt that holds it in place. Measure the resistance between the black/white wire and pin 46 on the computer wiring connector: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that 1.5 ohms is a wiring problem. If it reads 1.5 ohms or less, then the computer is suspect. On the computer, measure the resistance between pin 46 and pins 40 & 60: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that that and the computer’s internal ground has failed, and the computer needs to be repaired or replaced.
See Computer issue? | Mustang Forums at StangNet for Joel5.0’s fix for the computer internal signal ground.
If the first ground check was good, there are other wires to check. Measure the resistance between the STI computer self test connector (red/white wire) and pin 48 on the computer main connector: it should be less than 1.5 ohms. More that 1.5 ohms is a wiring problem
The following is a view from the computer side of the computer wiring connector: it is for an A9L, A9P computer.
Diagram courtesy of Tmoss & Stang&2birds
Check out the diagram and notice all the places the black/white wire goes. Almost every sensor on the engine except the MAF is connected to it.
See the following website for some help from Tmoss (diagram designer) & Stang&2Birds
(website host) for help on 88-95 wiring Mustang FAQ - Wiring & Engine Info
See the graphic for the 10 pin connector circuit layout.
Try removing and reinstalling the EEC. It's behind the pass side kick panel, if that's not been mentioned already.
The possibility exists that the EEC is chipped too. Check to make sure. If it is, remove and reinstall the chip. Toss a piece of duct tape over it to ensure it stays seated. If it's some off-the-shelf turbo 9000 chip from Pep_Boys, pull that thing and smash it with your boot heel.
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