347, which heads?

86bluecobra · Nov 29, 2005

ouch just when i was starting to lean towards buying a set. back to the overpriced afr's i guess.

Modular2v · Nov 29, 2005

86bluecobra said:
ouch just when i was starting to lean towards buying a set. back to the overpriced afr's i guess.

i thought the same thing....but i would rather pay another 2-300 for a higher quality piece

86bluecobra · Nov 29, 2005

true enough

Rick 91GT · Nov 29, 2005

They are still a very good head that with some work can go fast..... Peter Champani (NMRA D/R) goes low 8's with a ported Vic Jr and a 85mm Turbo

Rick 91GT · Nov 29, 2005

86bluecobra said:
no air care here no emmissions i have to meet. i really want 205's i see a set of used twisted wedge heads selling for around 700 usd right now on ebay they maybe a good deal.

The regular TW heads are too small for a healthy 351W based motor... I'd go Vic Jr's over them on a 351.

86bluecobra · Nov 29, 2005

ok thx sir right now i have holley systemax II heads i don't think they come close to what i need. if i was to get afr 205's i am told i need a big lift cam while it is a 351 but i can go to a smaller cam once i stroke it does anyone know why?

1991vert · Nov 29, 2005

so what about those exhaust ports?

would they hurt performance if i stayed n/a?

AaronC · Nov 29, 2005

How fast are you looking to go? That will ultimately decide which parts you should use. I'll post links to some of my buddies build ups and their successes which might show you what parts it took to accomplish their results. I have since ditched my 302 stuff and gone 347 with 185's, ported RPM, HiTech custom cam. It's enough to put my convertible in the 122 mph trap range. I shift it at 6500 and it drives easy. All of these strokers around here are using reverse split camshafts. Mine is 240/236 111 lsa 113 icl .575/.555 lift. while the others are 244/240 108 lsa 110 icl .585/.555 ish lift.

This motor is in a 91 GT which still has A/C and has 03 cobra interior. Drag strip weight is 3200-3250 lbs w/driver and it went 10.98 at 125.9 mph two weeks ago. It my buddies WIFE's car and she went 11.17 at 123-124 with it.

http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2005/10/BuildersNotebook/index.php

This is my buddy Drew's car. It went 10.92 at 123/124 while being limited to 6500 shifts due to electrical issues causing it to cut out after that. He's since fixed it and will have it back out with a few upgrades. Look for it to go 10's on them 18" budniks at about 127-128.

http://www.fordmuscle.com/archives/2005/02/YellowFever/index.php

Lastly here's some pics of my buddies 90 GT. This made 424 rwhp and 416 RWTQ. Ran 11.30-11.40 on nittos at 123/124 in summer heat

http://www.californiafords.com/cgi-bin/album.pl?album=CALIFORNIAFORDS.COM/dyno/06_11_03

Hope this helps with some parts decisions

1991vert · Nov 30, 2005

go fast and have it be street driven. those are my two goals.

so will the nitrous exhaust ports hurt performance if i stay n/a and dont do a blower for some reason?

AaronC · Nov 30, 2005

1991vert said:
go fast and have it be street driven. those are my two goals.

so will the nitrous exhaust ports hurt performance if i stay n/a and dont do a blower for some reason?

You shouldn't need the nitrous exhaust ports. The AFR exhaust ports flow really well. The problem when looking at just head flow #'s is you don't get the big picture. When you stick an efi manifold on the heads, the flow #'s will go down from just head only. You stick a longtube header on an exhaust port and it will flow MORE than a head only on a bench. Now factor in the other variables of the exhaust system on the motor such as using the other cylinders energy to pull more out of a single port. Also the exhaust side is boosted or releasing compressed air which isn't accounted for on the flow bench which is at a steady pressure. EFI stuff is intake resticted which is why they respond so well to boost. That 180 degree turn kills intake flow. Carbuerator setups can get away with a lot less head and cam to make the same power or pull more rpm. This is all stuff I got from talking to Brian at HiTech and is one of the reasons he uses these reverse split cams.

That same red 90 GT had some afr 185's, Holley intake, custom cam 232/227 110 lsa 112 icl .565/.536 lift, 1 5/8 longtubes, 2.5" exhaust etc. It went 11.61 at 119.9 best on Cobra R wheels w/nittos. That's what I'd call more of a daily driven 347 but still ran really hard. Peak power at 5600 shift at 6300.

Since you're thinking of boost you really need to think about the compression ratio. These guys have 11:1 and run 91 octane but with boost you'll need to dial it back. The advantage of boost is stock like driveability and it's easy to step up the power. The builder of the 91 GT 347 has a 93 cobra with twin turbos set at 12lbs. It's a dart block 331 with ported GT40 irons/cobra intake, and custom 219/219 cam. It's amazing to drive because it's quiet, drives like stock, then will come alive like nothing i've ever felt. It's more of a freeway runner but still runs low 11's at 128-129.

Grn92LX · Nov 30, 2005

Aaron, I really want to try one of those hitech motorsports reverse spilt cams on my combo. I see he has lots of good results with afr combo's. Does he have any stroker examples with twisted wedge heads?

90lxcoupe · Nov 30, 2005

whether you use the 185's or the 205's you will make good power with a blower... my car made well over 400 rwhp with just bone stock gt40x heads so even with 185's it will make awesome power. If your not sure about the blower then stick with the 185's cause in my opinion the 205's are a waste on a naturally aspirated motor unless you have a crazy cam; but you want to pass emissions so thats also an issue.

do u know what compression ratio your gonna run?

CoupedUp · Nov 30, 2005

Here's my 2 cents, take it for what it's worth ...

A street car for me is more about throttle response and respectable performance ... to others it's all about numbers potential.
An engine combo that has poor throttle response (too large of ports) down low but pulls like a raped ape up top gets old super quick in a car that is driven on a fairly regular basis.

A stroker build that makes true 350-375 tire digits is more than adequate in a light fox body car.
For me a street car is about weighing the pros and cons ...
*Fuel economy (8mpg sux)
*Reliability (a weekly fixin' sux)
*Tickets (get 'em just cleaning out the carbon)
*Emissions (what's emissions?)
*Streetability (low speed bucking makes you look like a jerk in traffic)

Now finding the right balance for you as an individual is the key.
My suggestion is to keep the 3" stroke and boost the air ... plus stuff it with a nice custom cam.

Again, my 2 cents ...

AaronC · Nov 30, 2005

Grn92LX said:
Aaron, I really want to try one of those hitech motorsports reverse spilt cams on my combo. I see he has lots of good results with afr combo's. Does he have any stroker examples with twisted wedge heads?

Jim Langley had a 228/222 112 lsa custom with Ported TW's on his 302. He went 11.90 at 115 at 3200 lbs. He's the only one I know of with TW's. 318 RWHP and 335 tq if I remember on a stock short block with 9.something compression.

I just have the 232/227 110 cam laying around. I'm not sure how'd it'd compare but shoot me the specs of your fti cam (.006 .050, lift, lsa, icl). If you're interested you can give this one a shot. Or just call Brian and see what he thinks. I guarantee it'll haul.

bluevenom867 · Dec 1, 2005

Grn92LX said:
Aaron, I really want to try one of those hitech motorsports reverse spilt cams on my combo. I see he has lots of good results with afr combo's. Does he have any stroker examples with twisted wedge heads?

Our 408 has TEA ported Track Heats on (standard twisted wedge with out heat cross-over holes).

Flowed 308/235 @ .600 on a standard bore (4"),TEA does good work.

Combo:

408 (dart iron eagle block,eagle forged crank with cleveland main and chevy rod journals,eagle h-beams with bolt upgrades,custom JE pistons for 12:1 compression),the heads (mentioned above),cam motion custom hyd. roller (.604In/.585Ex 251*In/264*ex @.050 112* LSA),out of the box super victor,1 1/4" spacer (bust panel),BG 950 annular booster race demon RS.

Only time to the 1/4 mile,N/A it went 10.80 @125mph.That was with an un-tuned carb,un-tuned suspension.

We paln to get into the LOW 9's or more preferably 8's on spray.

Rick 91GT · Dec 1, 2005

If you plan to stay NA stay away from the N2O exhaust ports, you do not need them. On a N2O car it is very important to get the mix/waste out as quikc as you can that is why you see large ports and headers/exhaust on a N2O car. The large port cna also help with a boosted car.

CAM is CRITICAL no matter what. I'm seeing more and more of that reverese split stuff cams I have used recently, they seem to work well as do they others.

Mike, I think Nate's cam is a reverse split if I remember correctly.

FullAuto · Dec 1, 2005

If you are looking to add a blower to your Dart block stroker, I have a similiar combo you can compare to. I'm a little smaller stroke though. 13psi on 93 octane without the meth kit and made just over 600rwhp through the AOD. Car still has a/c, all accessories and even the stock clutch fan. The cam is a .544/.576 224/230 114. It's nothing excessive.

5spd GT · Dec 2, 2005

CoupedUp said:
A street car for me is more about throttle response and respectable performance ... to others it's all about numbers potential.
An engine combo that has poor throttle response (too large of ports) down low but pulls like a raped ape up top gets old super quick in a car that is driven on a fairly regular basis.

A stroker build that makes true 350-375 tire digits is more than adequate in a light fox body car.
For me a street car is about weighing the pros and cons ...
*Fuel economy (8mpg sux)
*Reliability (a weekly fixin' sux)
*Tickets (get 'em just cleaning out the carbon)
*Emissions (what's emissions?)
*Streetability (low speed bucking makes you look like a jerk in traffic)

Now finding the right balance for you as an individual is the key.
My suggestion is to keep the 3" stroke and boost the air ... plus stuff it with a nice custom cam.

Again, my 2 cents ...

I couldn't really agree more...literally.

Some of these "high spinners" do get old when driving around. I mean I love turbo's and all but I don't like "turbo lag" on a N/A car

CoupedUp · Dec 2, 2005

5spd GT said:
I couldn't really agree more...literally.

Some of these "high spinners" do get old when driving around. I mean I love turbo's and all but I don't like "turbo lag" on a N/A car

Shhhhh, we have to whisper around this "bigger is always better" crowd ...

304billet · Dec 2, 2005

AFR 205 or TFS Hi-Port Stage 3 port.

347, which heads?

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