another question about brakes....

tamadrummer88 · Jul 27, 2006

Ok, im actually contemplating changing the front drums to disc, or just keeping the front drums and convert it to power ( I MIGHT get a real MII setup from a 77 MII).

What disc setup would be good for using like 14 inch or 15 inch wheels? I have those American Racing rims that have the holes going around the wheels ( have no clue what the hell they are called) and I would like to use those. I wanted to go with MustangSteve's Cobra brake setup, but they require 17" or bigger tires and wheels.

If I decide to just keep the drums or go to disc, either way im gonna make it power. Is there any boosters that is small enough to mount the JMC hydraulic clutch MC? Im gonna be buying that kit soon, and i want to see how much space there was. I saw reen's 67 fastback with a booster, and it looks like there is like next to no space. My 68 is pretty much the same. Sorry for the always repetitive questions, I just want to be sure of what I want to buy before I spend my money. Im excited to be working on my car because this is the first time im actually gonna work on it in TWO YEARS of ownership! I finally have the time and money, haha.

John

ultrastang · Jul 27, 2006

Here are some photos of when I was adapting a 5.0L Fox Mustang brake booster in my '68 with a JMC hydraulic clutch master cylinder mounted next to it;

1. http://www.ultrastang.com/Images/Scanned/Jan2003/007t.jpg

2. http://www.ultrastang.com/Images/Scanned/Jan2003/008t.jpg

http://www.ultrastang.com/Ultrainfo.asp?Page_ID=16

tamadrummer88 · Jul 27, 2006

Holy crap! That master is REALLY CLOSE to the booster! wow, there is auite a lot of mods to do just to fit a fox booster and MC. what kind of booster would you reccommend for my 68 with drums? And, would the 68 booster have enough space for a JMC MC?

John

5.0ina66 · Jul 27, 2006

For 11" brakes: Scarebird
For 13": Cobra swap.
I'd use the 5.0 booster and flip the end of the rod so the pedal hooks up. Not really THAT much modding needed IIRC

tamadrummer88 · Jul 28, 2006

haha, thanks. Guess ill go look in a junkyard this weekend for a 5.0 booster. It would fit behind my 68 MC?

John

Stangboy67 · Jul 29, 2006

84 booster??

I guess question this would be for Ultrastang. I have only seen the 87-93 5.0 booster mentioned. I have a chance to grab an '84 booster, would this work or is it different somehow. I have not seen it as of yet.

TIA
Carl

rebel65 · Jul 29, 2006

why get booster? i bet you discs will make you happy enough. trust me, drums just plain suck. i have two cars with all wheel manual brakes. a 1974 Porsche 914, and a 1965 289 Coupe. neither have a booster, but stop better than any car i have with a booster. 2005 Subaru RS, BMW 530 i, 1999 Expedition. the only one that MIGHT stop better, haven't actually done a side by side, is my dad's Porsche Boxter S, it does have 18x10's and huge brakes..so i donno if i can out stop him.

but i digress, discs will make you love your car more than a booster will. just get the front discs atleast, then the clutch, then figure out how to get the booster in there. eh?

tamadrummer88 · Jul 29, 2006

before i even throw that booster in there, i gotta figure out how im gonna set up that hydraulic MC

Jhn

ultrastang · Jul 29, 2006

Stangboy67 said:
I guess question this would be for Ultrastang. I have only seen the 87-93 5.0 booster mentioned. I have a chance to grab an '84 booster, would this work or is it different somehow. I have not seen it as of yet.

TIA
Carl

There are two different power brake boosters that came in the Fox Mustangs; The 9-inch diameter x 4¼" thick 2.3L booster, or the 7-inch diameter x 6¼" thick 5.0L boosters.

The Mustang Fox body platform ran for 14 years --1979-1993. The first factory performance Mustang, in the Fox bodies to re-emerge since 1973, came out with the release of the Mustang GT in 1982.

I'm not sure at what point the 5.0L booster design came out. --It may have been in '82, but for saftey's sake, I know that this booster version was in all 5.0L V-8 Fox body Mustangs produced between 1987-1993.

The 2.3L booster dates back to 1978 with the Ford Fairmont/Fairmont Futura and its sister car, the Mercury Zephyr. These cars are also based on the Fox body, and they used the very same 2.3L designed booster as the '79-'93 2.3L 4-cylinder Mustangs. --There is one exception with the booster design in the Fox Mustangs with a 4-cylinder. If the Fox Mustang is a convertible with a 2.3L engine, then it will have the same type booster as the 5.0L V-8 Mustangs (at least '87-'93 models).

If you are adpating a Fox booster into a '67-'70 Mustang, the 2.3L version will give you much more clearance out in front of the booster to mount the MC of your choice. If you have an automatic transmission, the 2.3L booster poses no problems. However, if you have a standard transmission, you cannot use the stock mechanical clutch linkages nor can you use a JMC-type hydraulic clutch MC with the 2.3L booster. --It's too large in diameter, and covers up the hole in the firewall where the mechanical linkage passes through or where the JMC hyd. clutch MC would need to mount. Your only option here, with a manual transmission with a 2.3L booster, would be to use a cable-operated clutch.

If you are using the 5.0L Fox booster in a '67-'70 model, you will have room for a mechanical clutch linkage to pass through the firewall or to mount a JMC hyd. clutch MC, but you have to watch the length of the brake MC you plan to use with the thicker 5.0L booster, because you could possibly run into problems with the brake MC hitting the back of the driver's side shock tower.

On a '65/'66 model Mustang, it doesn't matter which type Fox booster (2.3L or 5.0L) is installed, you will NOT have enough room beside either booster type for a mechanical clutch linkage to pass through or to mount a hydraulic clutch MC. If you have an automatic, it's no problem, but if you have a standard, your only option is to use a cable-operated clutch.

Dimensionally, the distance from the firewall to the back of the shock tower of a '65/'66 Mustang is ~ the same as the distance on a '67-'70 model Mustang -- ~14¼". The overall total combined length of the booster with MC installed should be kept at a length of no more than ~14" in order for everything to mount up without touching the shock tower.

http://www.ultrastang.com/Ultrainfo.asp?Page_ID=20

www.ultrastang.com

ultrastang · Jul 29, 2006

Hmmm...

something went wrong when I attached the link from my previous post. It should have been the link to the Fox booster page from my site...

...this link; http://www.ultrastang.com/Ultrainfo.asp?Page_ID=20

ultrastang · Jul 29, 2006

What the?!!!

Ok. I give up trying to post the link. Gremlins are running amok here (???)

CarFreakGT · Jul 29, 2006

5.0ina66 said:
For 11" brakes: Scarebird
For 13": Cobra swap.

This is off-topic, and I apologize if it is a stupid question. If I go w/ the Scarebird set-up, or something similar, can I go w/ 15x8 wheels? Or will I need 16's?

Stangboy67 · Jul 30, 2006

ultrastang said:
There are two different power brake boosters that came in the Fox Mustangs; The 9-inch diameter x 4¼" thick 2.3L booster, or the 7-inch diameter x 6¼" thick 5.0L boosters.

The Mustang Fox body platform ran for 14 years --1979-1993. The first factory performance Mustang, in the Fox bodies to re-emerge since 1973, came out with the release of the Mustang GT in 1982.

I'm not sure at what point the 5.0L booster design came out. --It may have been in '82, but for saftey's sake, I know that this booster version was in all 5.0L V-8 Fox body Mustangs produced between 1987-1993.

The 2.3L booster dates back to 1978 with the Ford Fairmont/Fairmont Futura and its sister car, the Mercury Zephyr. These cars are also based on the Fox body, and they used the very same 2.3L designed booster as the '79-'93 2.3L 4-cylinder Mustangs. --There is one exception with the booster design in the Fox Mustangs with a 4-cylinder. If the Fox Mustang is a convertible with a 2.3L engine, then it will have the same type booster as the 5.0L V-8 Mustangs (at least '87-'93 models).

If you are adpating a Fox booster into a '67-'70 Mustang, the 2.3L version will give you much more clearance out in front of the booster to mount the MC of your choice. If you have an automatic transmission, the 2.3L booster poses no problems. However, if you have a standard transmission, you cannot use the stock mechanical clutch linkages nor can you use a JMC-type hydraulic clutch MC with the 2.3L booster. --It's too large in diameter, and covers up the hole in the firewall where the mechanical linkage passes through or where the JMC hyd. clutch MC would need to mount. Your only option here, with a manual transmission with a 2.3L booster, would be to use a cable-operated clutch.

If you are using the 5.0L Fox booster in a '67-'70 model, you will have room for a mechanical clutch linkage to pass through the firewall or to mount a JMC hyd. clutch MC, but you have to watch the length of the brake MC you plan to use with the thicker 5.0L booster, because you could possibly run into problems with the brake MC hitting the back of the driver's side shock tower.

On a '65/'66 model Mustang, it doesn't matter which type Fox booster (2.3L or 5.0L) is installed, you will NOT have enough room beside either booster type for a mechanical clutch linkage to pass through or to mount a hydraulic clutch MC. If you have an automatic, it's no problem, but if you have a standard, your only option is to use a cable-operated clutch.

Dimensionally, the distance from the firewall to the back of the shock tower of a '65/'66 Mustang is ~ the same as the distance on a '67-'70 model Mustang -- ~14¼". The overall total combined length of the booster with MC installed should be kept at a length of no more than ~14" in order for everything to mount up without touching the shock tower.

http://www.ultrastang.com/Ultrainfo.asp?Page_ID=20

www.ultrastang.com

Wow, much more information than I asked for! Thank you for the details and the dimensions. I do have a T-5 with the mechanical linkage so I was leaning toward the 5.0 booster since I had not planned on changing the clutch mechanism at this point. I have a better sense of where I will go at this point.

Once again, Thanks.

tamadrummer88 · Jul 31, 2006

Wow! Tons of info than I asked for! thanks guys!

Looks like ill have to do more shopping for brakes ( Now that i actually decided to stay with a modified stock suspension, been doing some reading over on corner-carvers.com ) so now i can actually look forward to front discs.

John

5.0ina66 · Jul 31, 2006

CarFreakGT said:
This is off-topic, and I apologize if it is a stupid question. If I go w/ the Scarebird set-up, or something similar, can I go w/ 15x8 wheels? Or will I need 16's?

On a '68, I bet you could run 14s, as it uses a caliper that seems to be similar to the 68 unit, and stock 68 rotors. You're definatley good with 15s

jcode68 · Jul 31, 2006

I am going through this same update, so I will share my research experience. I have 68 Fastback, currently with 4 wheel manual drums. I have the JMC hydraulic clutch installed. I decided to go with SSBC Force 10 front disc brakes. They are a high perfomance brake system that will work with 15" wheels (I wanted to keep my Tourque Thrusts). I purchased their manual brake setup since the booster they sell would not fit with the JMC unit. From research, the factory Bendix style booster will fit this application, so this is what I am doing. You will also need a new brake pedal for power brake appplication. I haven't installed this setup yet, but probably will in the next couple of weeks. I'll let you know the results and try to take pics along the way.

tamadrummer88 · Jul 31, 2006

jcode68 said:
I am going through this same update, so I will share my research experience. I have 68 Fastback, currently with 4 wheel manual drums. I have the JMC hydraulic clutch installed. I decided to go with SSBC Force 10 front disc brakes. They are a high perfomance brake system that will work with 15" wheels (I wanted to keep my Tourque Thrusts). I purchased their manual brake setup since the booster they sell would not fit with the JMC unit. From research, the factory Bendix style booster will fit this application, so this is what I am doing. You will also need a new brake pedal for power brake appplication. I haven't installed this setup yet, but probably will in the next couple of weeks. I'll let you know the results and try to take pics along the way.

You are now my new best friend! SO the factory style booster will work with the JMC clutch MC? awesome! Ill be anxiously awaiting your updates!

John

jcode68 · Jul 31, 2006

I know what you mean, I feel like Columbus discovering a new world I have posted several times about this subject on the 67/68 model year and nobody has done this combo of parts, so I feel the pressure. I'll document as much as I can and share the experience. Hopefully it all works out, otherwise there will be a new Bendix booster for sale in the classified section...

tamadrummer88 · Jul 31, 2006

So far what I know the bendix booster is the only one that is small enough to mount a JMC MC next to it.

John

bnickel · Jul 31, 2006

68 eclone, i'm glad you decided against the MII swap and i'm also glad you did some more research on the subject. in my earlier posts when you were talking about doing the MII swap i wasn't trying to be a prick or anything and i hope you understand that i just really wanted you to do some more research before you jumped in with both feet. anyway, i hope there are no hard feelings.

another question about brakes....

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