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At a TOTAL Loss Here, HELP!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Swarzkopf
  • Start date Start date May 21, 2006

Swarzkopf

Member
Sep 23, 2004
973
0
16
Pittsburgh
May 21, 2006
#1
  • May 21, 2006
  • #1
Summary:

Recently replaced waterpump and ignition control module. Car won't start. Car has fuel pressure, car has no spark.


Long, with details:

Last week the waterpump on my wife's 93 LX 2.3L/automatic went bad. I do no often drive this car. She reported it running rough, I checked it and immediately noticed the bad waterpump. I replaced the waterpump and changed the engine oil at the same time. Before changing the waterpump, I noticed that the engine was idling low and somewhat rough, but assumed it could be due to the shot waterpump bearings stressing the accessory belt.

After changing the waterpump and oil, I started the car to take it for a test drive. I noticed right away that the low, rough idle was still there. I put the car in reverse, and it stalled and would not start back up. I called a buddy to help me push it back in to the garage, and before he arrived I tried it one my time and it started. It was still idling rough and low. I took it for a drive, and the tachometer was not functioning correctly. It would not display above 1500, even when I knew the engine was closer to 5000. The car also felt somewhat down on power, especially down low.

I did some research on these forums and decided to replace the ignition control module based on the erratic tachometer, rough idle, stall issue, and power loss. I bought a GP Sorensen ICM from Advance-Auto, installed it, and the car would not start. I returned said ICM and bought a Borg-Warner ICM from Pep-Boys and installed it. The car STILL will not start.

When turning the key, the RPMs shoot to 500 for a split second and then immediately fall to zero, and remain at zero while the engine is cranking.

The car has fuel pressure, 30 PSI/vacuum on with the fuel pump primed.

The car does NOT have spark. The coil packs pass a visual examination and at night while cranking emit no tell tale blue light.

The timing belt is intact and installed correctly.


PLEASE help me here, I'm really completely lost.
Thanks in advance.
 

Dr_EluSivE

Founding Member
Apr 24, 2002
2,155
0
56
Central Illinois
May 21, 2006
#2
  • May 21, 2006
  • #2
my money is on the Crank Trigger. I had one go bad in my car and it refused to start. Not sure of any way to test them, but its a Hall effect sensor on the crank hub. Not the easiest thing the change, but not Super hard either, You have to remove the front crank pulley, and the sensor is under it. Wouldnt hurt to change the timing belt while you are in there too.

Dr.
 

Swarzkopf

Member
Sep 23, 2004
973
0
16
Pittsburgh
May 21, 2006
#3
  • May 21, 2006
  • #3
Dr. Elusive, thanks for the the response. I will definitely look into the crank trigger sensor...being that I just changed the waterpump, there is a good chance that some coolant got onto it and fried it.

Anyone care to comment on the fact that my tachometer reads zero while cranking? Would a bad crank trigger sensor cause this also?
 

Swarzkopf

Member
Sep 23, 2004
973
0
16
Pittsburgh
May 22, 2006
#4
  • May 22, 2006
  • #4
Anyone else care to add here?
 

Dr_EluSivE

Founding Member
Apr 24, 2002
2,155
0
56
Central Illinois
May 22, 2006
#5
  • May 22, 2006
  • #5
i would imagine it could, without the trigger, the engine doesnt even know its turning, so it doesnt spark. No spark, no tach.

Dr.
 

Swarzkopf

Member
Sep 23, 2004
973
0
16
Pittsburgh
May 22, 2006
#6
  • May 22, 2006
  • #6
Will change the sensor tommorow and report back. Thanks again.
 

Swarzkopf

Member
Sep 23, 2004
973
0
16
Pittsburgh
May 23, 2006
#7
  • May 23, 2006
  • #7
I changed the crank trigger sensor. What an absolute bitch that was for something so minor. The car still won't start and is still displaying the same symptoms.

I returned the second ICM I bought and have another one on order which I'll install tommorow.

If the car still doesn't start, I'll have to have it towed. This is mind blowing, and reinforces my preference for good old distributor based ignition systems.
 

16vstang

New Member
Oct 8, 2004
100
0
0
Way up in Maine
May 23, 2006
#8
  • May 23, 2006
  • #8
Does sound like an icm, did you check the wiring for the trigger and icm? Ive had a short it the trigger wire before and car wouldnt run. Hope all gos well, Nick
 

Swarzkopf

Member
Sep 23, 2004
973
0
16
Pittsburgh
May 23, 2006
#9
  • May 23, 2006
  • #9
The wiring...without taking apart every wire in the main engine wire group...appears okay. The crank trigger sensor wiring is definitely okay as it was replaced with the crank sensor today.

Gonna try this third new ICM tommorow when it comes in. If that doesn't do it, it's getting towed to the Ford dealership (only because my wife is real attached to the car. At this point, I think I'd rather blow the ****ing thing up. ).
 

Swarzkopf

Member
Sep 23, 2004
973
0
16
Pittsburgh
May 25, 2006
#10
  • May 25, 2006
  • #10
Third time was a charm! Car fired right up and the tachometer even works now.

For future searchers:
-It really, trully might take several new ICMs to find one that works.
-The Advanced Auto brand (GP Sorensen) ICM didn't work right out of the box.
-The Pep Boys brand (Borg-Warner) ICM didn't work right out of the box.
-The CarQuest brand ICM DID WORK and fixed the car.

Now I have to fix another problem with the car- the shraeder valve on the fuel rail is leaking. argh
 

Dr_EluSivE

Founding Member
Apr 24, 2002
2,155
0
56
Central Illinois
May 25, 2006
#11
  • May 25, 2006
  • #11
I am gald to see you finally got it running, Those ICM's are strange things. When my car wouldnt start i figured it was the module too, but i had mine tested and it failed, so we got a new one and tested it before i left the store... It failed too. The had 3 in stock, ALL failed the tests.. So i went to a different store, Different brand of testing machine.. Same thing, both mine, and the new one they had in stock Failed. Thats when i bought the Trigger and after replacing that the car ran great, With the original "FAILED" moduile There is something not quite right about the way these modules test. I am glad you got it sorted out though!

Dr.
 
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