Cleavland In a II?

Josmen · Feb 6, 2004

Anyone know if it has ever been done? I might possibly be able to get a good deal on a 351 cleavland and I already have a T-5. Just curious if anyone here has ever tried this or even know if it is possible(I guess anything is possible.) Do you think it would be worth it or would I be better of stroking a 302 to a 347 and all the good stuff that goes along with it, or just a plain 351? Any imput would be great!

Josmen

Gael · Feb 6, 2004

I felt that doing my 351w was a huge headache, I can't imagine even trying to stuff something even bigger into a II.

Personally, I say stay with the 302 block, and work with that, depending on what you're going to be using for. You can always gain a good bit of power by sticking a nice blower on top of it.

1badII · Feb 6, 2004

It can be done, but I imagine it would be a pain in the ass. It would be cool if you did it, though. And I don't think a T-5 will bolt up to a Cleveland. I think they use a big block bolt pattern.

Power Surge · Feb 6, 2004

1badII said:
It can be done, but I imagine it would be a pain in the ass. It would be cool if you did it, though. And I don't think a T-5 will bolt up to a Cleveland. I think they use a big block bolt pattern.

The 351C uses the standard small block bolt pattern. The 351/400M uses the 385 series big block pattern.

I've seen some Cleveland powered IIs; there was a green one for sale on ebay recently. In all honesty, I'd go with a 347 with some good heads over a 351C swap. The 302 based 347 is lighter, bolts right in, and there are plenty of Windsor heads out there that rival stock Cleveland heads. Plus Windors like to wind, Clevelands have heavy rotating assemblies and require some good balancing and crank work to spin high.

1badII · Feb 7, 2004

CobraIILover said:
The 351C uses the standard small block bolt pattern. The 351/400M uses the 385 series big block pattern.

I've seen some Cleveland powered IIs; there was a green one for sale on ebay recently. In all honesty, I'd go with a 347 with some good heads over a 351C swap. The 302 based 347 is lighter, bolts right in, and there are plenty of Windsor heads out there that rival stock Cleveland heads. Plus Windors like to wind, Clevelands have heavy rotating assemblies and require some good balancing and crank work to spin high.

I've heard that Clevelands could spin to 7000 RPM's stock.

chromehorse11 · Feb 8, 2004

I put a Cleveland in a Cobra i used to have. It was a ROYAL PAIN IN THE ARSE to install. A lot of fabbing had to be done, headers were way too expensive and it totally changed the driving characteristic of the car. On the plus side, it went like stink!!

75stang302 · Feb 8, 2004

i wouldnt do it unless the car had a complete tube frame. the engine bay is way to tight and the suspension couldnt handle the power

Dano78 · Feb 8, 2004

I saw one in a wrecking yard way back when that had a 351C and it had cast iron manifolds on it aswell. Looked like it fit in there real nice and tight, but did fit. I remember looking over the engine bay real well, just to see what was done to get it in there. There was no hammering, cutting, heating, or anything. I was amazed! Later that week, I was headed back to pull some parts off if it and i saw the engine out (torched the motormounts) and in the showroom floor and the car was gutted of the interior and headed to the crush pile. Damn, if i'd only known then....

Wart · Feb 8, 2004

Dano78 said:
I saw one in a wrecking yard way back when that had a 351C and it had cast iron manifolds on it aswell. Looked like it fit in there real nice and tight, but did fit. I remember looking over the engine bay real well, just to see what was done to get it in there. There was no hammering, cutting, heating, or anything. I was amazed! .....

I would bet money something was done to make it fit.

Theres a saying that when somethings done well people are unaware anythings been done at all. Or something like that.

74ProII · Feb 8, 2004

Mine is 351C4V powered. Being that it is a 74 presents the first problem- the radiator support. You can use 302 mounts, which allows the stock pan to just fit. The c-4 bellhousing is avery close fit. I originally used a monarch bellhousing. The exhaust is the really fun part. I would not recommend doing it. To easy to get 347's these days putting out 350-400hp with less weight.

Dano78 · Feb 9, 2004

Yeah but has anyone put in a Cleveland with STOCK manifolds??? Not headers. The one I saw at the yard had regular car-style non-ribbed manifolds in it. They were smooth which would lead me to believe that they were earlier Cleveland. I think the last year or two the manifolds had support ribbing on them.

1badII · Feb 9, 2004

Dano78 said:
Yeah but has anyone put in a Cleveland with STOCK manifolds??? Not headers. The one I saw at the yard had regular car-style non-ribbed manifolds in it. They were smooth which would lead me to believe that they were earlier Cleveland. I think the last year or two the manifolds had support ribbing on them.

But why would you go through the trouble of putting a Cleveland in if you're going to choke it off with manifolds?

Project 77 · Feb 9, 2004

Theres a 351C powered Mustang II on ebay now...a 78...looks like a hack job

chromehorse11 · Feb 9, 2004

Mine had the cast manifolds on it, and they weren't a good fit. I had to have the outlets cut off and redirected. If any one knows welding, they know cast is a b*tch to weld. Needless to say, the modified manifolds didn't last too long. I didn't go with headers, because i could only find one supplier at the time, and they wanted $883. And that was somewhere close to 13 years ago now.

Wart · Feb 9, 2004

Project 77 said:
Theres a 351C powered Mustang II on ebay now...a 78...looks like a hack job

This one?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2459127330

Looks real rough.

It's listed as a '78 but the door tag has a build date of 12/73 and a '74 VIN.

I believe it is a C, hard to tell in the pictures. A C in a II with NOx and big fat tires? Looks like it would be a Flexi-Flyer.

The seller has no idea what he's selling and distances himself as far as possable, moving all over the country but inspections must be done before auction end, his terms and conditions, and the format of the auction all scream stay away!

74ProII · Feb 10, 2004

Have you ever seen the size of 4v exhaust manifolds! They barely fit in the 71 that was it's former residence. Definetely looks like a hack job big time.

Wart · Feb 10, 2004

74ProII said:
Have you ever seen the size of 4v exhaust manifolds! They barely fit in the 71 that was it's former residence. Definetely looks like a hack job big time.

Yeah, their monsters, aren't they? I'm in awe of the port size. Look at them long en7ough and I feel like their going to pull me in.

I have a set, they came with the engine. I should take a picture.

Something no one has posted yet is, the C has a short deck with huge heads where the W has a tall deck with tiny heads, so overall they aren't that much different in width.

I was talking to a guy with a First Gen Mustang while at a show, he had had a C in the car before the 351W with Edelbrock (sp?) heads. He said fitting the Cleveland was a bit easier.

Our mileage may vary.

Dano78 · Feb 12, 2004

Wart said:
Something no one has posted yet is, the C has a short deck with huge heads where the W has a tall deck with tiny heads, so overall they aren't that much different in width.

I was talking to a guy with a First Gen Mustang while at a show, he had had a C in the car before the 351W with Edelbrock (sp?) heads. He said fitting the Cleveland was a bit easier.

Our mileage may vary.

Glad you pointed that out, Wart. I take that stuff for granted. Yeah we've (the old man and I ) have stuffed a 351C in a couple of 66 and 67 Fairlanes. If anyone knows how much of a PITA those towers are, ask a 60's midsize ford owner! The cleve did fit, without any butchering. I can only imagine that the Cleve would fit just the same in a II, omitting the exh manifolds. At least no damn towner to have to deal with. I wish i knew what manifolds were on that Cleve I saw in the II at the yard...

Dano78 · Feb 12, 2004

A... C??? Boy are we being modest. I'd say it's definately D material and almost an F. I bet that damn thing is equipped with 'exhaust by Schucks' entailing 14 exhaust clamps and 6 feet of flexi-pipe, looks like it's 2" pipe aswell. I'd hate to see the surprieses hidden under that tunnau cover in the hatch area, in the one pic it looks like scraps of steel held together with bird**** welds. I bet if you wipe off the black paint, it might just say Shell or Chevron somewhere! AND you gotta dig that killer scoop and 6ft extension! A scoop for a velocity stack! I REALLY like that PILE of fan spacers he's got goin there with his 6"-7" long fan bolts. Wonder how that's gonna fair at 6500rpms?? And how bout that interior!?! niiiiice
Correct me if I'm wrong... but it seems like to me.... he's got a TRUCK 9" under that puppy. Look at the bolt pattern on the rear wheel pic. Looks like truck pattern to me! -as spaced out as the lugs are. I have no idea what he's got higing under the aluminum panels in the engine bay, but i bet it's scary. This is definately a southern backwoods racecar....
$3500?? no, more like $1500....Maybe...

Wart said:
This one?

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/ws/eBayISAPI.dll?ViewItem&item=2459127330

Looks real rough.

It's listed as a '78 but the door tag has a build date of 12/73 and a '74 VIN.

I believe it is a C, hard to tell in the pictures. A C in a II with NOx and big fat tires? Looks like it would be a Flexi-Flyer.

The seller has no idea what he's selling and distances himself as far as possable, moving all over the country but inspections must be done before auction end, his terms and conditions, and the format of the auction all scream stay away!

Dano78 · Feb 12, 2004

HEY! i found a pic of the guy who built that car... check it out..

WTF?? Why won't it show ANY of my attachments?????????

Cleavland In a II?

Josmen

Gael

1badII

Member

Power Surge

1badII

Member

chromehorse11

75stang302

Dano78

Wart

I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE!

74ProII

Dano78

1badII

Member

Project 77

chromehorse11

Wart

I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE!

74ProII

Wart

I'm Mad as HELL and I'M not Gonna Take it ANYMORE!

Dano78

Dano78

Dano78

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Cleavland In a II?

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