Future competition for mustang

jfischer · Aug 19, 2005

Klay said:
Remember, the camaro used to cost more than the mustang

No, it didn't. My 2002 Z28 had a base price of $22,830 and came fully loaded at $27,245. That's with leather seats, T-Tops and an automatic transmission. OK, yes that was 3 years ago, but GTs were in that exact same ballpark. A 2005 GT with most options (leather seats and an automatic) is pushing $30K.

351CJ · Aug 19, 2005

02LS1 said:
First you said it was 2017, now it's 2010...

GM owns the Camaro nameplate...not the CAW, not Quebec. GM/Chevrolet can use it on whatever they want and whenever they want.

Yes GM owns the trademark, however check your facts. Part of the agreement with the UAW and Quebec government to close the old Camaro / Firebird plant restricts GMs ability to use those nameplates if they are build anywhere other than Quebec. And I NEVER said 2017, may have said 2012 because IIRC the agreement was for 10 years.

02LS1 said:
If the new Mustang was a complete flop, GM wouldn't be working on a 5th gen Camaro. Mustang sales #'s has proved that there is still a pretty big market for RWD performance coupes and GM needs something to compete with the Mustang (and future Challenger)...or at the very least try to compete with the Mustang (sales, not performance).

So you're saying that GM should once again play "Follow the leader"?

stang120gt · Aug 19, 2005

i think my buddy has a couple of pics of the protype camero let me check and ill post pics.

02LS1 · Aug 19, 2005

351CJ said:
Yes GM owns the trademark, however check your facts. Part of the agreement with the UAW and Quebec government to close the old Camaro / Firebird plant restricts GMs ability to use those nameplates if they are build anywhere other than Quebec. And I NEVER said 2017, may have said 2012 because IIRC the agreement was for 10 years.

Did I misread this? http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=551305

351CJ said:
There will not be a new GM car carrying the name "Camaro" any time soon. GM made an agreement with the UAW and the Canadian government that the Camaro & Trans-Am could only be built at GM's plant in Quebec until the year 2017. That plant was closed in 2002 and has now been torn down, so there will NOT be a Camaro or Trans-Am for many years.

Care to post where you're getting your facts from?

I've never seen this agreement posted on the internet so I can't say for sure what the terms of the agreement were but I'd bet the same is true for you too. However, a very reputible source (Guy McCoy. Who wrote this article in PHR) has said (in short) that GM lived up to it's end of the agreement and there are NO restrictions on the Camaro/Firebird nameplates. I'll take his word for it until proven different.

351CJ said:
So you're saying that GM should once again play "Follow the leader"?

If it makes you feel better...yep.

Thank you Ford. Thank you Mustang. Without you, there would've been no Camaro.

knight_rider69 · Aug 19, 2005

I live about 10 minutes from the old Camaro/Firebird plant, it broke my heart when they closed it. GM and Dodge can try all they want (and I can respect a new Challanger (no pun intended) and Camaro) but the mustang is an american icon, that's why it's survived 40+ years throughout gas hikes. Dodge will always have the General Lee, but the Dodge lot near my house has 8 chargers in the parking lot (I pass them everyday on my way to work) and they haven't moved in 3 weeks, wheras the Ford dealer couldn't keep a single mustang on the lot when they came out because everyone was buying them up.

All in all, if GM wants to go for it, I'll be pleased. I liked the 60 & 70 Camaros, I just don't think the Camaros have the "allure" of a mustang that will drive sales way up.

Klay · Aug 19, 2005

Well I sure hope they do make the camaro, it will only help improve the mustang. I actually like camaros so having more options of cars to choose from would be nice.

Now all we need is for dodge/chrysler to break away from mercedes and then maybe the challenger will actually be something worth buying. Considering how they decided to use the charger nameplate I wouldn't be surprised if they somehow screwed up the challenger as well.

Dyoct · Aug 19, 2005

Came After Mustang And Runs Obsolete

merlinsteele · Aug 20, 2005

Dyoct said:
Came After Mustang And Runs Obsolete

The Mustang came after the Edsel, so what? And what does 'Runs Obsolete' mean?

Bowtiesblow · Aug 20, 2005

Dyoct said:
Came After Mustang And Runs Obsolete

Improved upon and preforms better.

GOLDENPONY · Aug 20, 2005

Gas prices aren't stopping Ford from building the Mustang...and a lot of people from buying them. The M6 LS2 GTO's (400hp) EPA rating is the same as the '05 GT's...M6 LS2 Vette (400hp) is 1mpg better city and 3mpg better highway.

Yea, but Ford had the Mustang "in the chute" before the major gas price spiral started. In light of the current situation, I don't think any company, especially one as strapped for money as GM, would begin planning for a new performance platform like a Camaro-especially when the Mustang is sooo far ahead. Just doesn't make good business sense. Just my $.02 worth.

jfischer · Aug 20, 2005

GOLDENPONY said:
In light of the current situation, I don't think any company, especially one as strapped for money as GM, would begin planning for a new performance platform like a Camaro-especially when the Mustang is sooo far ahead. Just doesn't make good business sense. Just my $.02 worth.

GM is going balls out to get their redesigned trucks and SUVs on the market, and they get ****ty mileage too. A lot worse than a Camaro.

The 4th-gen Camaros got very good mileage for a performance car, I would expect the same from a possible 5th gen.

dozlert · Aug 21, 2005

srothfuss said:
Pontiac will have the GTO (they are no longer limited production) The general hopes that wil tie over 'average joe' until they can fix the company.

There were 15,728 2004 GTOs built and there will only be approximately 12K 2005s (production thus far has been very limited). If the plant is moved to the states in 07/08 and they do continue to build GTOs, then production may increase. Lot's of ifs.

351CJ · Aug 21, 2005

02LS1 said:
Did I misread this? Care to post where you're getti...ng future use of the Camaro & Firebird names.

28 · Aug 21, 2005

Are you guys just talking about domestic competition?Cause their is some fair import competition as far as price and performance..

jfischer · Aug 21, 2005

28 said:
Are you guys just talking about domestic competition?Cause their is some fair import competition as far as price and performance..

Good old American V-8 muscle is what I care about, but yes there are non-domestic cars that compete in the same space. Problem is, I don't care for any of them. Although I currently have a Camaro, I've also had my share of Mustangs as well. I love 'em both, and it would take an awful lot to tempt me to the dark side...

Klay · Aug 21, 2005

28 said:
Are you guys just talking about domestic competition?Cause their is some fair import competition as far as price and performance..

Well I agree with you but it is very limited right now so the prospect of more "traditional" competition is the reason why I brought this up. Also, because many feel that there won't be a camaro ever again.

I know the 350z and rx-8 are comparable to it (performance and prise wise) and I personally cross shopped both but a lot of people who buy any of these cars mentioned don't think they are comparable.

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