Larocca's doesn't know how to fix my 93. WTF????

Ranchero5.0 · Oct 25, 2003

What do I make of all this??? I agree with the former poster that you almost deserve what happened by adding aftermarket parts to fix an aftermarket part induced problem. And to top it all off with a blower on a hyper motor... Call me crazy, but stupid is as stupid does. Your motor's probally been dying for a long time and nothing that's been done has helped that fact. Rick has a twisted bit of logic saying hypers will live on a blower with a good tune. What happens when the tunes goes to crap?

For Larocca's, I think it's in their best interest to write the car off and let you take it somewhere else or be rid of it yourself. Or at the very least pull all the aftermarket stuff off the car and drop a Autozone motor in until you can afford a decent shortblock to put the blower on.

The bottom line is your 'good deal' motor turned into a turd and took down larocca's name with it.

Jamie

TheUser · Oct 25, 2003

just curious...do you have an idea of how much you've spent on this whole thing total? Sounds like a lot...way too much to think about. LaRocca's prob. isn't cheap, so all this "changing this" and "doing this" is costing you prob. $50 or more an hour. Also, Just kinda wondering how they know for sure the smog delete would not make the cats hott...that's the whole purpose of the smog is to blow oxygen into the cats...I think most w/ no smog have an o/r mid pipe.

bmo37 · Oct 26, 2003

sidthing said:
First off maybe you should stop being a punk and fix your own car. You people need to stop paying people stupid amounts of money to have your car fixed for you. Maybe you should get off your lazy American buttocks, and buy some tools and figure your car out in your garage. Buy a tool and use it. Your probably the same guy I'll see at a car show bragging about your car you didnt even touch except to drive. LaRocca's is laughing at you for spending a grand for not even fixing the problem. I wouldnt have paid them but you did, but I guess you have money to burn. Do me a favor and trade in your car for a Civic. Anyone who runs 42lb injectors and no O2 sensors and complains about bad gas mileage and burning cats should be shot for being an idiot. Have a nice day.

dude get a life, if all your going to do is bash people for trying to get stuff done to their car than go join an import forum.

I personally don't understang how people can say you deserve this, you didn't ask for a problem, your just trying to do what it took to have it fixed. So like most of us if a mechanic says he thinks it might be a certain thing, you go and replace it. Its alot easier to monday morning quater back and say no I would have done this or that.

slvr302 · Oct 26, 2003

sidthing said:
First off maybe you should stop being a punk and fix your own car. You people need to stop paying people stupid amounts of money to have your car fixed for you. Maybe you should get off your lazy American buttocks, and buy some tools and figure your car out in your garage. Buy a tool and use it. Your probably the same guy I'll see at a car show bragging about your car you didnt even touch except to drive. LaRocca's is laughing at you for spending a grand for not even fixing the problem. I wouldnt have paid them but you did, but I guess you have money to burn. Do me a favor and trade in your car for a Civic. Anyone who runs 42lb injectors and no O2 sensors and complains about bad gas mileage and burning cats should be shot for being an idiot. Have a nice day.

I take it you are Gods gift to cars
Dude, you have no idea how much work I have or haven't done to my car so don't come on here trying to bash me. If you had actually read the post and comprehended it for that matter, you would see that even when I had 24# injectors, with O2 sensors, and no blower, before even going to Laroccas, the converters were glowing. I take it you missed all of that because you were too busy getting ready to bad mouth someone. And who ever mentioned anything about bad gas mileage??? I beleive I have responded more than enough to your undignified comments.

Ranchero5.0:
Plenty of people run blowers on motors with hypereutectic pistons. People throw them on stock motors all of the time. When my motor was built I had no intentions of putting a blower on...but you make it sound as if its unheard of.
There were two parts added to try and fix my converter issue...that being the cam (which was my choice in changing since Larocca was going in to verify cam timing) and the heads which looks like it fixed the converter issue.

"Good deal motor" Where does this come from??? As if it was some sub-standard motor that I got from the bargain store. And take Larocca's name down with it??? Give me a break dude!! Come off that

TheUser:
All of my smog stuff was hooked back up and the converters were still glowing.

91FoxBodyStang · Oct 26, 2003

slvr302 have you ever heard of JDM engineering? Its a mustang and lightning shop based in Freehold, New Jersey. I have heard nothing but good things about them. You should look into stopping by them and seeing if they could locate the problem...It seems like Laroccas is just milking you for money right now.

slvr302 · Oct 26, 2003

91FoxBodyStang said:
slvr302 have you ever heard of JDM engineering? Its a mustang and lightning shop based in Freehold, New Jersey. I have heard nothing but good things about them. You should look into stopping by them and seeing if they could locate the problem...It seems like Laroccas is just milking you for money right now.

I've heard of them. My buddy just picked up his 99 Cobra w/Vortech from them last week from getting it tuned. I've looked into having them take a look at my car months back. Unfortunately, without even explaining any problems I had to them, they were not interested in taking on a pushrod motor. They said they primarily deal with modular motors now. This was conveyed to me on two occasions by JDM.

silrossi46 · Oct 26, 2003

sidthing said:
First off maybe you should stop being a punk and fix your own car. You people need to stop paying people stupid amounts of money to have your car fixed for you. Maybe you should get off your lazy American buttocks, and buy some tools and figure your car out in your garage. Buy a tool and use it. Your probably the same guy I'll see at a car show bragging about your car you didnt even touch except to drive. LaRocca's is laughing at you for spending a grand for not even fixing the problem. I wouldnt have paid them but you did, but I guess you have money to burn. Do me a favor and trade in your car for a Civic. Anyone who runs 42lb injectors and no O2 sensors and complains about bad gas mileage and burning cats should be shot for being an idiot. Have a nice day.

sidthing i dont know where you come off saying the things you said about how people should "do things" but i dont really think it is any of your business how he chooses to produce the car that he wants. He has been through numerous issues with that car and the last thing he needs is some squid tough guy tellin him to buy a tool box........get a clue man and go work on your civic.

sidthing · Oct 27, 2003

Well first off I'm not the idiot who put a supercharger on my car while my exhaust is about to catch fire. Where was the logic in that one. And if your not smog legal or even running O2 sensors then take the friggin cats out and run an off road. If the fumes are obnoxious then you are running too rich. I have an off road with dumps and I dont smell crap. Next time get a second opinion before someone suckers you into buying a cam for a grand. Who ever thought changing a cam would stop melting cats. In anycase ditch the cats since they are toast anyways from the abuse.

bmo37 · Oct 27, 2003

sidthing said:
Well first off I'm not the idiot who put a supercharger on my car while my exhaust is about to catch fire. Where was the logic in that one. And if your not smog legal or even running O2 sensors then take the friggin cats out and run an off road. If the fumes are obnoxious then you are running too rich. I have an off road with dumps and I dont smell crap. Next time get a second opinion before someone suckers you into buying a cam for a grand. Who ever thought changing a cam would stop melting cats. In anycase ditch the cats since they are toast anyways from the abuse.

do us all a favor and please go jump off a bridge

slvr302 · Oct 27, 2003

sidthing said:
Well first off I'm not the idiot who put a supercharger on my car while my exhaust is about to catch fire. Where was the logic in that one. And if your not smog legal or even running O2 sensors then take the friggin cats out and run an off road. If the fumes are obnoxious then you are running too rich. I have an off road with dumps and I dont smell crap. Next time get a second opinion before someone suckers you into buying a cam for a grand. Who ever thought changing a cam would stop melting cats. In anycase ditch the cats since they are toast anyways from the abuse.

Again with this......Listen dude, enough with your derogatory remarks. How old are we?? If you are going to continue posting replies of that nature, please don't. They are of no help if you haven't noticed.

silrossi46 · Oct 27, 2003

he hasnt gotten it yet...........hes too busy sitting on his shifter

j.speed · Oct 27, 2003

Have you decided to go for the DSS shortblock yet?

slvr302 · Oct 27, 2003

j.speed said:
Have you decided to go for the DSS shortblock yet?

Yes...I believe I have. I haven't ordered it yet because I am in the process of freeing up some room on the credit card. Hopefully by the end of the week.

GAU89LXStang · Oct 27, 2003

OK maybe I did come off as a jerk. What I was mainly asking was if you were having those problems, how would adding a cam, heads, bigger injectors, and a blower solve it? Really I might be able to see the cam, head idea, but adding a blower, and bigger injectors? It was already getting too much fuel, so Larocca's decides that adding more fuel will solve it?! I don't know what the original problem was but I hope you get it figured out, or that it doesn't happen on the new short block. And you really shouldn't run the cats without the smog gear. Like someone stated before, you can run the smog crap without the cats, but not vice versa.

Good luck!!

Mo' Town

slvr302 · Oct 27, 2003

GAU89LXStang said:
OK maybe I did come off as a jerk. What I was mainly asking was if you were having those problems, how would adding a cam, heads, bigger injectors, and a blower solve it? Really I might be able to see the cam, head idea, but adding a blower, and bigger injectors? It was already getting too much fuel, so Larocca's decides that adding more fuel will solve it?! I don't know what the original problem was but I hope you get it figured out, or that it doesn't happen on the new short block. And you really shouldn't run the cats without the smog gear. Like someone stated before, you can run the smog crap without the cats, but not vice versa.

Good luck!!

Mo' Town

I know there is alot to read and maybe you got confused some. When I wanted to get the blower put on, I had to run with bigger injectors and maf. I wasn't putting them on to fix my glowing converter issue which is my original problem. At the time of the blower install I asked Larocca to look into the converter issue. Running rich is the common cause of converters glowing...aside from them being clogged. We knew they werent clogged because they were new.

The motor proved to be getting the proper amount of fuel, proper spark, and correct ignition timing...They even confirmed it with the EPEC (stand alone computer). Valve timing was now the question so they wanted to see if the cam was degreed properly because if not, I could experience this issue with the converters. Somehow they said a leakdown test was not enough to verify this. So in they went and I opted to change the cam while they were down there since I wanted to in the future. That did not fix the glowing converter issue. That's when they said it has got to be something with the heads that I had machined (milled and bowl work). They said the fuel is not burning properly in the chamber thus causing the converters to glow. That's when I changed to the Edelbrock heads that they say has fixed my glowing converter issue. Unfortunately now, my motor has broken. Hope this makes things a little clearer on when and why certain parts were changed.

And that whole thing about if you are running cats, you need to run the smog equipment just isn't true. There is plenty of controversy on this topic if you do a search. I appreciate your input THX

Ranchero5.0 · Oct 27, 2003

slvr302 said:
I will try and make this as short as possible. Larocca's still has, and have had my car for almost the entire summer. My problem being glowing catalytic converters.
I bought a used 306 shortblock without cam, Pro-M 75MAF, and 24# injectors from a dude in my town. Block had approx. 13,000 miles at the time. About a month later I bought his used Comp Cam that he had in the block before selling it to me. I bought a bare set of Roush 200 cylinder heads and had a machine shop assemble them to complete with all Manley parts. They ported/blended the bowls and chambers and milled them .040". They also assembled and installed the motor.
Prior to having this motor dropped in my 93 which was basically stock at the time, I put on MSD and a CAI. Keep in mind I had the stock converters on at the time. So far so good (no problems). Shortly before bringing my car to get the motor dropped in I swapped the the Hpipe for an offroad one.
I finally get the motor put in and eliminated the smog pump. My car exhaust smelled so bad that something had to be done. Timing was set at 14* and all tune up stuff was brand new. TPS voltage was good as well. So I decided to order a Mac 2 1/2" catted Hpipe. This cleaned up my smell alot but I then noticed massive amounts of heat being generated inside my car as well as underhood. I didn't know what to make of it so I left it until one night I saw my converters glowing. I knew I had a problem then. Not too long afterwards I brought my car to Larocca's to have my blower installed and I told them about the converters. They said it could be a number of things like MAF, injectors, CAI, improper A/F, ect. All of which will be eliminated when I go to the 42# injectors, Pro-M 80 MAF, eliminate the CAI, and have them tune it.
Needless to say all of that was done in February. I hardly drove the car at all but the time I did was enough to lift the heads (thus needing my head gasket replaced) and burn my clutch. After that was taken care of it brought me to about May and my glowing converters was still an issue.
At this time my EGR valve and O2 sensors were eliminated and I am tuned without needing a chip.
Please keep in mind that when I was naturally aspirated and after getting blown, the car drove fine. I decreased fuel pressure by 10# and also increased fuel pressure by 10# having no affect on my problem with the cats.

Back to Larocca's again to have them check it out. After about a month of it being there they said they have a gut feeling that my camshaft may not be installed correctly and they would like to swap it out with a "blower" grind. Before I decided to go with that expensive job I had Larocca hook the smog pump up to blow air downstream to the converters in hopes of fixing the problem. Let me tell you that only made it worse. Cats glowed faster and hotter by doing this.

Larocca's said they are about 90% sure the cam swap will fix my problem so I had them order one for me and have it installed by them. They replaced the cam along with timing chain and distributor. The cam that was already in there they said was installed "straight up" and after degreeing it saw it was in at a 105* as opposed to 108*. I called Comp Cams and asked if that would create my glowing coverter problem and they said "NO". If it were retarded too much maybe but not by being advanced and extra 3*. Needless to say, converters and now headers were glowing and I had lost 60 RWHP. They then proceeded to swap that cam with a known good cam that was smaller, which they had lying around the shop. Everything still glowing and horsepower was still down alot. They pulled my coverters off and put an offroad hpipe on an the headers were still glowing. They then did a "leak down" test and found one cylinder to be leaking a little through the intake valve and another to be leaking down from who knows where but not even nearly enough to explain the 60 RWHP loss. They tried another stock computer with no resolve. Then they install a stand alone computer. The EPEC. They got my horsepower back up to where it should be said somewhere between my stock wiring harness and EEC there is a problem and they don't know what it is. Larocca claimed they got a great tune and data logged everything and I should be all set with this EPEC ($1200). My headers were no longer glowing but now it was time to put the converters back on to see. Sure enough after putting the converters back on cats glowed again. They played with timing and bypassed my MSD and boost retard with no resolve. They through a set of stock converters on too see if it was a problem with my MAC converters, but they too got extremly hot so they assumed they were glowing as well. They also had dynoed the car with the offroad and with my MAC converters and the cats showed a 15 rwhp loss which they say was normal and not indicative of clogged converters.

So NOW they say that it is something with my motor and they don't know what it is. They lost confidence after the cam swap didn't fix my problem. I still have to pay for the cam and install anyway (approx $1000). They are leaning on it being something with my Roush 200 heads but are not positive. They are basically leaving it up to me to decide now if I want to swap my heads in hopes to fix the problem because they can't gauranty it will. THEY DON'T KNOW. WTF DO I DO???

I am already in the hole for 1G. Edelbrock heads will be approx $1100 plus installation and I don't even know if my problem will be fixed. SOMEBODY HELP ME PLEASE. THX

Don't want to start a fight here, but your 'good deal motor' is listed in your first post of this thread. USED, and you added parts to a questionable base motor. I just finished a '88 GT T top car that the owner insisted on using used heads, cam and intake. We ended up investing $500 to restore the performer RPM heads he paid $900 for even though the heads only had 1000 miles on them. They were on a 351 that shifted at 7600 rpm and were beat. Overall it took about twenty extra hours of labor and $1000 extra in machine shop and parts to make it work.

As for the hypers with blowers, I don't see any advertisers in MMFF offering blower shortblocks with hypers in. Are you so sure that they belong there that you'll order your next motor with the same hypers in it?

Sorry isn't the right word to use, but I do feel sorry that you're having such a horrible time. No one 'deserves' this much grief.

Jamie

slvr302 · Oct 27, 2003

Ranchero5.0 said:
Don't want to start a fight here, but your 'good deal motor' is listed in your first post of this thread. USED, and you added parts to a questionable base motor. I just finished a '88 GT T top car that the owner insisted on using used heads, cam and intake. We ended up investing $500 to restore the performer RPM heads he paid $900 for even though the heads only had 1000 miles on them. They were on a 351 that shifted at 7600 rpm and were beat. Overall it took about twenty extra hours of labor and $1000 extra in machine shop and parts to make it work.

As for the hypers with blowers, I don't see any advertisers in MMFF offering blower shortblocks with hypers in. Are you so sure that they belong there that you'll order your next motor with the same hypers in it?

Sorry isn't the right word to use, but I do feel sorry that you're having such a horrible time. No one 'deserves' this much grief.

Jamie

I understand you aren't trying to start a fight or nothin. Yes, I did buy my motor used and granted, I was not 100% of how reliable it would be. The guy I bought it from I've known for a good while and don't think he'd sell me something bad. Anyhow, you do make a point to an extent.

Yes, I am aware that you don't see blower motors advertised with hypers, and no I am definitely not going to order them in my next shortblock. That's not to say that they you can't use hypers in a blown set up. I guess I was just running way too much boost for hypers to handle safely. Again, I do understand the point you are trying to make here. THX

tvmango · Nov 10, 2003

I didn't read all the posts here, but you are definately extremely rich for some reason. This happens when the cats are trying to burn excess unburned fuel. get a emisions test done somewhere and it will tell you. Is it running smooth? try a compression test, make sure all you cylinders are up. If you have a exhaust valve hanging it will cause this also.... I hope it helps, sorry brother , I feel really bad.....

Red9250 · Nov 10, 2003

It seems to me like somewhere....either right after you installed the new motor, or shortly thereafter, your cats were ruined by running rich.

Then LRs had you buy a bunch of extra parts to "fix" the problem.

Then they attempted to "tune" the car many ways around those ruined cats. One of these screwy tunes was what they installed the stock cats on but ran into the same type of heat problems.

What I would do is, put a stock, unclogged H-pipe on there and try to get a good tune in with a working H-pipe, ALL you smog equiptment installed, and the stock computer. Hopefully they can set it up the right way before they ruin the stock h-pipe. Then you can buy another H and put it on after the car is tuned correctly.

Hope you get it fixed....Good Luck

slvr302 · Jul 22, 2004

For an update and abbreviated version of this fiasco go here

Larocca's

Larocca's doesn't know how to fix my 93. WTF????

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