Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (1975)

01mgvert · Oct 7, 2004

As many of you know, my engine seized due to broken oil pump gears. My warranty company refuses to pay for the work because my car has headers. When I quoted from the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, they didn't seem to care. This Act is a broad-ranging federal law that protects consumer rights on warranty issues. Numerous automative sities, including SEMA, appeal to this law as protection for consumers who install aftermarket parts on their cars. They argue that one the basis of this law warranty companies should not be able to void warranties simply due to the presence of aftermarket parts. This, of course, does not mean that warranty companies should be expected to pay for failed aftermarket parts or any failure due to aftermarket parts. When I searched the net, I only found places where the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act have been successfully applied to computer printers. It seems that some printer companies were voiding their warranties if consumers did not use their particular brand of printer cartridges. The courts ruled that this was a violation of the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act. Does anyone know of specific court cases where this Warranty Act has been successfully applied to aftermarket automotive parts? Any help would be greatly appreciated.

GT-03 · Oct 7, 2004

01mgvert said:
When I quoted from the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act, they didn't seem to care. This Act is a broad-ranging federal law that protects consumer rights on warranty issues.

Just be careful. As you mention, the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act is rather broad.

It has basically two parts. A "pro-consumer" part and a "pro-manufacturer" part. Many, many aftermarket companies like to quote to their customers just the "pro-consumer" part and forget the rest.

The "pro-manufacturer" part allows manufacturers to completely void the warranty if there is any signs or evidence of abuse.

What has been happening these past few years, is that some auto makers are taking the installation of some aftermarket parts as evidence of abuse. Specifically, performance parts could be signs of "racing" and "racing" is widely accepted as a form of abuse. Basically, their legal theory is that if you installed performance parts, you must be making use of them.

And it is not just performance parts. Some off-roading parts on SUV's can do the same thing. "Off-road" use is an accepted form of abuse, and if you installed some of the more extreme off-road parts, you must be doing some rather serious off-roading. There are some rather upset Jeep owners since D-Chrysler started to enforce this.

I would be cautious about going to court and using the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act unless you are very sure you can defend against any counter-claim of abuse.

jstreet0204 · Oct 7, 2004

GT-03 said:
What has been happening these past few years, is that some auto makers are taking the installation of some aftermarket parts as evidence of abuse. Specifically, performance parts could be signs of "racing" and "racing" is widely accepted as a form of abuse. Basically, their legal theory is that if you installed performance parts, you must be making use of them.

He could say he got the headers to improve gas mileage...

I'd be more concerned about them bringing up the underdrive pulleys, since an off balanced crank pulley, or a bad installation could have caused the oil pump failure. Not saying that is the case, but they could argue that.

GT-03 · Oct 7, 2004

jstreet0204 said:
He could say he got the headers to improve gas mileage...

Absolutely true.

One would just need to be able to prove it in court, if it ever got to that point.

DTMach1 · Oct 7, 2004

here's the deal man...you were running underdrive pulleys correct??? Those more than likely are what caused your oil pump gears to fail.

But keep in mind...our stock oil pump gears are stamped crap...if you run underdrive pulleys and are constantly running high RPMs...such as hot lapping at the dragstrip or running an autoxoss event. Those types of situations cause the stock oil pump gears to fail.

Now as it comes to your warranty, the burden is on the company to prove your aftermarket parts caused the failure, not you.

edit: I would highly suggest to anyone who is drag racing constantly or autoxossing a lot that is running UD pulleys to get an oil pump with billit internals. Otherwise when you spin a bearing or something like that you can't complain.

rjstaaf · Oct 7, 2004

Mention Magnuson-Moss and most dealers and warranty companies will just laugh at you as you have already seen. Can anyone here name a single person who has ever had a denied warranty claim reversed due to Magnuson-Moss? It is a joke! It would cost you more to fight it than it would just to pay for the new motor yourself. This is exactly why I don't fork over the bucks for an extended warranty unless it is a car that I do not intend to mod. Who in their right mind can ever leave their car stock

As much as we don't like the warranty situation you can't blame "just" the auto makers. Warranty fraud is rampant, you don't just expect them to bend over and take it in the end do you? Both sides are equally responsible for the current situation. Granted not all consumers perpetuate fraud but, how do they determine who is trying to rip them off?

01mgvert · Oct 7, 2004

Thanks for the feedback on the Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act. In Arbitration, I intend to focus primarily on the wording of the warranty contract. In a section entitled, "Events which are not covered," point nine reads: "A breakdown caused by non-manufacturer recommended alterations to the vehicle done before or after the contract effective date, that affects the operation of a covered part. This includes, but is not limited to, exhaust headers, oversized tires, and body or suspension lift kits." What stands out in this provision are the words "caused" and "affects." Doesn't this put the burden on the warranty company to demonstrate that headers caused the gears on the oil pump to break? How could they do this?

rjstaaf · Oct 7, 2004

They may not be so concerned about the headers themselves but, the fact that they are on the car. To them it indicates that the car is used for racing or is abused. Check your contract for any clauses about racing the car and if that affects the warranty.

JonJon · Oct 7, 2004

Our justice system is superb

DTMach1 · Oct 7, 2004

01mgvert said:
...Doesn't this put the burden on the warranty company to demonstrate that headers caused the gears on the oil pump to break? How could they do this?

like I said before, the burden is always on the company to prove you caused the failure, not the other way around. You have nothing to prove, just to sit back and wait. All you did was drive the car and make a claim. If they deny your warranty they have to prove something YOU did caused it.

Now, it will be very hard to prove headers caused the stamped gears to fail..but with more investigating they will see you have UD pullies installed and THAT they can prove caused your oil pump failure.

01mgvert · Oct 7, 2004

rjstaaf said:
They may not be so concerned about the headers themselves but, the fact that they are on the car. To them it indicates that the car is used for racing or is abused. Check your contract for any clauses about racing the car and if that affects the warranty.

The only related provision I could find in the contract is this: "A breakdown caused by negligence, misuse, improper servicing..." This provision occus in the section entitled, "Events which are not covered." It seems to me that this still puts the burden on the warranty company to demonstrate that these events have actually taken place. The mere presence of headers hardly makes this case.

rjstaaf · Oct 7, 2004

DTMach1 said:
like I said before, the burden is always on the company to prove you caused the failure, not the other way around. You have nothing to prove, just to sit back and wait. All you did was drive the car and make a claim. If they deny your warranty they have to prove something YOU did caused it.

Now, it will be very hard to prove headers caused the stamped gears to fail..but with more investigating they will see you have UD pullies installed and THAT they can prove caused your oil pump failure.

Have you every filed a warranty claim and had it denied? If only the real world worked like they say it should on paper but, the reallity is that it doesn't. They don't have to prove anything unless you try and fight it and even then they have more money and lawyers. The reallity is that most people won't go through the hassle.

01mgvert · Oct 7, 2004

DTMach1 said:
like I said before, the burden is always on the company to prove you caused the failure, not the other way around. You have nothing to prove, just to sit back and wait. All you did was drive the car and make a claim. If they deny your warranty they have to prove something YOU did caused it.

Now, it will be very hard to prove headers caused the stamped gears to fail..but with more investigating they will see you have UD pullies installed and THAT they can prove caused your oil pump failure.

For good or bad, my engine will be sent to Ford when I receive my rebuilt engine. This is necessary to avoid a core charge. The warranty company had their opportunity to inspect the engine. Their primary concern was the presence of headers. Interestingly, they also pointed to my Plasma Booster as a reason for denying my warranty claim. When I talked with the service rep, he did not even know what a Plasma Booster was.

01mgvert · Oct 7, 2004

rjstaaf said:
Have you every filed a warranty claim and had it denied? If only the real world worked like they say it should on paper but, the reallity is that it doesn't. They don't have to prove anything unless you try and fight it and even then they have more money and lawyers.

The warranty requires that I go through arbitration rather than litigation. I will be filing a complaint form with the National Arbitration Forum. There is an initial filing fee of $35 and then I will need to pay for half of the participatory hearing fee, which is $300. I don't plan to hire a lawyer, so my expense should be kept to a minimum. At this point, I don't have much to lose but a lot to gain, namely, $6,000.

stang976 · Oct 7, 2004

that sucks!! are they ford racing headers??? if so i think thats legit for warranties

rjstaaf · Oct 7, 2004

01mgvert said:
The warranty requires that I go through arbitration rather than litigation. I will be filing a complaint form with the National Arbitration Forum. There is an initial filing fee of $35 and then I will need to pay for half of the participatory hearing fee, which is $300. I don't plan to hire a lawyer, so my expense should be kept to a minimum. At this point, I don't have much to lose but a lot to gain, namely, $6,000.

Good luck to you, I hope you win. The reallity though is that most people will not bother to do what you are doing.

01mgvert · Oct 7, 2004

stang976 said:
that sucks!! are they ford racing headers??? if so i think thats legit for warranties

I actually have Hooker headers. I am curious though. Haven't cars come stock with factory headers? I thought that some of the 5.0s actually came with LT headers. Anyone know for sure? Also, if car manufacturers put headers on their cars, doesn't this indicate that they are safe for stock motors?

GT-03 · Oct 7, 2004

DTMach1 said:
like I said before, the burden is always on the company to prove you caused the failure, not the other way around. You have nothing to prove, just to sit back and wait.

Well, actually, all the company has to show that you added performance mods (that's fairly easy for them to do), and then make the claim that these indicate you abused the car by "racing".

Then, the table gets turned, and you have to prove you never used the car in that manor. Just think of having to prove, you never slammed the gas pedal to the floor (not even once), and exactly how do you go about proving that?

GT-03 · Oct 7, 2004

stang976 said:
that sucks!! are they ford racing headers??? if so i think thats legit for warranties

I don't know. Are Ford Racing parts for use only on vehicles not covered under a warranty???? I mean, if you are actually using a vehicle for true racing (not just street stuff), isn't the warranty void anyway?

"Ford Racing parts are sold "as is" without any warranty whatsoever. The entire risk as to the quality and performance of such parts is with the buyer. The buyer, and not the manufacturer, distributor, or retailer assumes the entire cost of all necessary servicing or repair."

JonJon · Oct 7, 2004

GT-03 said:
I don't know. Are Ford Racing parts for use only on vehicles not covered under a warranty???? I mean, if you are actually using a vehicle for true racing (not just street stuff), isn't the warranty void anyway?

"Ford Racing parts are sold "as is" without any warranty whatsoever. The entire risk as to the quality and performance of such parts is with the buyer. The buyer, and not the manufacturer, distributor, or retailer assumes the entire cost of all necessary servicing or repair."

That just means if the FRPP part you bought breaks or whatever, you can't goto Ford and expect them to warranty that SPECIFIC part.

Magnuson-Moss Warranty Act (1975)

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