Need a tuner, What to go with?

moneypit94 · Apr 2, 2004

My car seems to be running really rich right now. I fouled a plug today and every sparkpug was black black with carbon.

Anyways My local dyno shop went out of business recently So my chip is stuck where its at for the time being. So i figure its about time to buy a tuner...

Now I AFM is only like 2 hours away so it would be logical to get a PMS system and have them tune the car good once..

The only problem is the price on that.. starting price of $1000

So should i grit my teeth and buy a PMS or should i trying something else? Im not even sure where i can take my car to get it wideband tuned besides AFM. I think there are some places by chicago but i don't know where.

Joes95GT · Apr 2, 2004

I believe Robin Lawrence is a Chicago local who has some type of Mustang shop in the area. He's got a 9 second Vortech ride in R/S. He'd probably work out to be a huge help if he does indeed dyno tune cars.

Joe

5.0 from 95 · Apr 2, 2004

Try Modulardepot.com and look at the SCT stuff. Those guys start you off with a tune on the four bank chip that is pretty close to what you need and then you can fine tune it from there. I am getting one in about a month. I have been reading alot about them. Price is right too.

Paul

rel3rd · Apr 2, 2004

moneypit94 said:
Now I AFM is only like 2 hours away so it would be logical to get a PMS system and have them tune the car good once..

The only problem is the price on that.. starting price of $1000

So should i grit my teeth and buy a PMS or should i trying something else?

Are you saying the PMS is $1000, or the tune???
The PMS alone is only $858

It's the best money I've spent on my car in a while...I had a FordChip "tune" and the car was never right...An hour's worth of PMS tweaking and I fixed all the quirks they couldn't fix. It's arguably the easiest, most user friendly tuning device out there, and the new one is pretty sweet. I've had the older PMS, and now the new one...Tons of tuning help and info at www.stangtuning.com also...

Personally, I won't use anything else to tune my own cars with ever again...

moneypit94 · Apr 2, 2004

Joes95GT said:
I believe Robin Lawrence is a Chicago local who has some type of Mustang shop in the area. He's got a 9 second Vortech ride in R/S. He'd probably work out to be a huge help if he does indeed dyno tune cars.

Joe

Actually Robin Lawrence lives less then 30 miles from me. He doesn't have a dyno shop of his own and usually uses AFM or Cerra to do his tuning... Cerra is the shop i went to that closed down.

I would love to pick robbin's brain but he has closed his home shop doors to the public. He has too much going on between racing and his actual job...

Rel3rd: Well after you get some of the other stuff that they recomend for a blower setup it ends up being over 1000 dollars. Im seriously thinking about it now though..

rel3rd · Apr 3, 2004

FWIW, I'm no stranger to blower cars
Here's a link to my first PMS tuned ride...sold a year and a half ago.
With absolutely nothing but PMS tuning, it went from 11.1's@120, to 10.53@129...That's what sold me.
With a head unit swap (S trim to YS trim), it went a best of 10.24@133.
That car is missed, and it was the most docile street cruiser I've ever owned...even had an AOD tranny.

You can see the older PMS keypad on the dash in the interior pic...

http://www.ezshots.com/album.cgi?ysbarney/Barney

Good Luck in whatever you choose...
Bob

moneypit94 · Apr 3, 2004

Here is another question. Do you think a tuner will help me raise my rpm band? After i installed the blower my rpm band like dropped and peaked at 5200 instead of 55-5600 ish?

http://www.homepage.macomb.com/~dlb1982/images/blower dyno.JPG

Im sure it wouldn't hurt but if it would correct this i would deffenetly buy it. Also my A/F is a little screwy anyway... The richer we ran it the better it liked it.. The best run of the day the car was running with an A/F with which was trying to go below 10... something screwy me thinks.

9150ho · Apr 3, 2004

whats the difference in the pms and the tweecer. meaning, what can one do that the other cant?

moneypit94 · Apr 3, 2004

9150ho said:
whats the difference in the pms and the tweecer. meaning, what can one do that the other cant?

That is something I would like to know also...

But i just broke down and ordered a PMS system from AFM. Got the Map bar sensor to go with. cost me 857 + 85 + SALES TAX and shipping. So roughly 1000 dollars...

Wonder if i can get some money back on my chip? hmm...

Also i figure if this tuner will help my rich idling and low rpm condition it may pay for itself by saving on gas. (especially with the rumors about gas prices going way up) Right now i get about 12.5 mpg even mix of intown and highway miles... Im guessing like 8-9 in town and 20 on the highway..

DavidF · Apr 3, 2004

rel3rd said:
FWIW, I'm no stranger to blower cars
Here's a link to my first PMS tuned ride...sold a year and a half ago.
With absolutely nothing but PMS tuning, it went from 11.1's@120, to 10.53@129...That's what sold me.
With a head unit swap (S trim to YS trim), it went a best of 10.24@133.
That car is missed, and it was the most docile street cruiser I've ever owned...even had an AOD tranny.

You can see the older PMS keypad on the dash in the interior pic...

http://www.ezshots.com/album.cgi?ysbarney/Barney

Good Luck in whatever you choose...
Bob

On your dyno run, why does the torque start so high then makes a nose dive right thru the rpm range? Im used to seeing more of a flat curve then a downward fall, could you explain? Thanks

moneypit94 · Apr 3, 2004

DavidF said:
On your dyno run, why does the torque start so high then makes a nose dive right thru the rpm range? Im used to seeing more of a flat curve then a downward fall, could you explain? Thanks

I don't know for sure but if you look at his run he is winding some serious rpms... I think with that kinda setup its not uncommon to see the torque drop like that...

But that does look more like a 351 type of graph with the torque that high in the beggining.. But the hp numbers don't match up for a 351 based engine with a ys-trim

rel3rd · Apr 3, 2004

Actually, it was a stock blocked 306 that I built in my basement...lol...

The only excuse I can offer is that the evening that dyno run was made, I had just made my first pass with the YS trim, and the car, even though it cracked over 500rwhp, was pretty lean. This was on a mobile dynojet that was setup at the track, and I had just ran a 10.60@130...Adding some fuel and mid range timing, the car went a string 10.30's@132 two weeks later in very similar weather conditions, with a cool-down and a nice 1.51 60foot, launching from 1800 rpm's, the car went the 10.24@133...In fact the launch from that run is the very first picture in that link...As for the graph I have no idea...the car was shut down at 6200, not 7200 rpm's...so I don't know wtf happened there...lol...The torque reads high due to the 3800 stall converter the car had...Hitting the dyno "GO" button at 3000 rpm on one of the runs, the car registered 706lb/ft at the wheels...Not realistic, but I got it documented in black and white

moneypit94: You'll easily be able to fine tune your idle air/fuel ratio, among other things...

Believe it or not, my old car got 17mpg on the highway, and the new owner could not believe how docile it was driving around town. My wife drove it several times to take my youngest boy to school...I also had probably 30 Test & Tunes and countless "street tuning" time on the car, which allowed it to run at it's full potential, yet still be a very enjoyable car to cruise...

Are you going to let AFM dyno tune your car?

Zero Signal · Apr 3, 2004

Wonder if i can get some money back on my chip? hmm...

I wonder if there is a way to read the chip's tune fromt he PMS unit. I guess it would at least give you some kind of a starting point. Just a thought . . .

moneypit94 · Apr 3, 2004

rel3rd said:
Are you going to let AFM dyno tune your car?

I figured i would install it and the first chance i got i would have them do a tune on it... Then i might make minor adjustments here and there after that if any...

That way i know i am getting pretty much everything the car has.

rel3rd · Apr 3, 2004

Zero Signal said:
I wonder if there is a way to read the chip's tune fromt he PMS unit. I guess it would at least give you some kind of a starting point. Just a thought . . .

Nope. The PMS can't do that. Don't know of anything (that a normal person has access to) that does that actually. You simply give Rick @ AFM your mods, and he gives you a start-up tune. You tweak it from there, and visit StangTuning.com to compare tunes and trade information with other PMS users...

rockin_rick · Apr 3, 2004

moneypit94 said:
Cerra is the shop i went to that closed down.

Whoa, Cerra shut down? I'm in Moline, and there is a shop in Port Byron, which is about 4 miles north of I-80 @ the Mississippi. It's called Illinois Dyno Center ( http://www.idc-solutions.net/default.asp )

When I was there, a guy with a 2003 cobra was putting down about 485 RWHP at the time. He was claiming that their tune was putting out about 25 HP more than he got from Cerra's tune. They seemed really cool and easygoing and let you work on your car or whatever. Hell, they (and the owner) let me help with working on his car. They also had a wideband for A/F logging. Since I know nothing about the AFM unit you are planning on running, this may not be useful to you.

Rick

moneypit94 · Apr 3, 2004

rockin_rick said:
Whoa, Cerra shut down? I'm in Moline, and there is a shop in Port Byron, which is about 4 miles north of I-80 @ the Mississippi. It's called Illinois Dyno Center ( http://www.idc-solutions.net/default.asp )

When I was there, a guy with a 2003 cobra was putting down about 485 RWHP at the time. He was claiming that their tune was putting out about 25 HP more than he got from Cerra's tune. They seemed really cool and easygoing and let you work on your car or whatever. Hell, they (and the owner) let me help with working on his car. They also had a wideband for A/F logging. Since I know nothing about the AFM unit you are planning on running, this may not be useful to you.

Rick

Well that sorta sux... I go by there when i go to cordova... I didn't know that they tuned chips... Well if anything they maybe able to help me sell my chip or something... Again i figure i will have my car tuned at AFM but it looks like i have another place to take it for future mods..

Need a tuner, What to go with?

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