no spark no fuel

[Dennia845]

ok i have read the no spark sticky but still cant find the problem
i have a 88 gt that just died the other day like the title says no spark no fuel press. i have checked all fuses, fuesable links , they are all good .
i have power to both fuel pump relay and eec relay also cdecked eec ground
near batt. and ground strap on firewall .
any help would be much apprecated

 

[jrichker]

Cranks OK, but No Start Checklist for Fuel Injected Mustangs

A word about this checklist before you start: it is arranged in a specific order to put the most likely failure items first. That will save you time, energy and money. Start at the top of the list and work your way down. Jumping around will possibly cause you to miss just what you need to see to find and fix the problem. Don’t skip any steps because the next step depends on the last step working correctly.

Revised 19-Jun-2009 to clarify ignition switch & coil power states.

All text applies to all models unless stated otherwise.

Note: 94-95 specific changes are in red

1.) Remove push on connector (small red/blue wire) from starter solenoid and turn ignition switch to the Run position. Place car in neutral or Park and set the parking brake. Remove the coil wire from distributor & and hold it 3/8” away from the engine block. Jumper the screw to the big bolt on the starter solenoid that has the battery wire connected to it. You should get a nice fat blue spark.
Most of the items are electrical in nature, so a test light, or even better, a voltmeter, is helpful to be sure they have power to them.

No spark, possible failed items in order of their probability:
A.) MSD or Crane ignition box if so equipped
B.) PIP sensor in distributor. The PIP sensor supplies the timing pulse to trigger the TFI and injectors. A failing PIP sensor will sometimes let the engine start if the SPOUT is removed. See paragraph 5A - a noid light will tell if the pip is working by flashing when the engine is cranking.
C.) TFI module: use a test light to check the TFI module. Place one lead of the test light on the red/green wire on the ignition coil connector and the other lead on the dark green/yellow wire on the ignition coil connector. If the TFI is working properly, the test light will flash when the engine is cranked using the ignition switch.
D.) Coil
E.) No ECC or computer power - ECC or computer relay failure
86-93 models only: ECC relay next to computer - look for 12 volts at the fuel injector red wires
94-95 models only: EEC or PCM power relay in the constant control relay module. Look for 12 volts at the fuel injector red wires.
F.) No ECC or computer power - fuse or fuse link failure
86-93 models only: Fuse links in wiring harness - look for 12 volts at the fuel injector red wires. All the fuse links live in a bundle up near the starter solenoid.
94-95 models only: 20 amp EEC fuse in the engine compartment fuse box. Look for 12 volts at the fuel injector red wires.
G.) Ignition switch - look for 12 volts at the ignition coil red/lt green wire. No 12 volts, blown fuse link or faulty ignition switch. Remove the plastic from around the ignition switch and look for 12 volts on the red/green wire with the switch in the Run position. No 12 volts and the ignition switch is faulty. If 12 volts is present in the Run position at the ignition switch but not at the coil, then the fuse or fuse link is blown.
Note: fuses or fuse links blow for a reason. Don’t replace either a fuse or fuse link with one with a larger rating than stock. Doing so invites an electrical fire.
Ignition fuse links may be replaced with an inline fuse holder and 5 amp fuse for troubleshooting purposes.
94-95 models only: Check inside fuse panel for fuse #18 blown – 20 amp fuse
H.) Missing or loose computer power ground. The computer has its own dedicated power ground that comes off the ground pigtail on the battery ground wire. Due to it's proximity to the battery, it may become corroded by acid fumes from the battery. It is a black cylinder about 2 1/2" long by 1" diameter with a black/lt green wire. You'll find it up next to the starter solenoid where the wire goes into the wiring harness
I.) Computer.
J.) Bad or missing secondary power ground. It is located between the back of the intake manifold and the driver's side firewall. It supplies ground for the alternator, A/C compressor clutch and other electrical accessories such as the gauges.
K.) Engine fires briefly, but dies immediately when the key is released to the Run position. Crank the engine & when it fires off, pull the small push on connector (red wire) off the starter relay (Looks like it is stuck on a screw). Hold the switch in the crank position: if it continues to run there is a problem with either the ignition switch or TFI module. Check for 12 volts at the red/green wire on the coil with the switch in the Run position. Good 12 volts, then replace the TFI. No 12 volts, replace the ignition switch.

Wiring Diagrams:…

Sorry, the AutoZone wiring diagram links no longer work. You can navigate to the diagrams yourself via Repair Info | AutoZone.com and select the car year, make, model and engine. That will enable you to bring up the wiring diagram for your particular car.

See the following website for some help from Tmoss (diagram designer) & Stang&2Birds (website host) for help on 88-95 wiring Mustang FAQ - Engine Information Everyone should bookmark this site.


Ignition switch wiring
http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/IgnitionSwitchWiring.gif

Fuel, alternator, A/C and ignition wiring
http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/fuel-alt-links-ign-ac.gif

Complete computer, actuator & sensor wiring diagram for 88-91 Mass Air Mustangs
http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/88-91_5.0_EEC_Wiring_Diagram.gif

Complete computer, actuator & sensor wiring diagram for 91-93 Mass Air Mustangs
http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/91-93_5.0_EEC_Wiring_Diagram.gif

Complete computer, actuator & sensor wiring diagram for 94-95 Mass Air Mustangs
http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/94-95_5.0_EEC_Wiring_Diagram.gif

2.) Spark at coil wire, pull #1 plug wire off at the spark plug and check to see spark. No spark, possible failed items in order of their probability: [/b]
A.) Moisture inside distributor – remove cap, dry off & spray with WD40
B.) Distributor cap
C.) Rotor
D.) Spark Plug wires
E.) Coil weak or intermittent - you should see 3/8" fat blue spark with a good coil

3.) Spark at spark plug, but no start.
Next, get a can of starting fluid (ether) from your local auto parts store: costs a $1.30 or so. Then pull the air duct off at the throttle body elbow, open the throttle, and spray the ether in it. Reconnect the air duct and try to start the car. Do not try to start the car without reconnecting the air duct.

Two reasons:
1.) If it backfires, the chance for a serious fire is increased.
2.) On Mass Air cars, the computer needs to measure the MAF flow once the engine starts.
If it starts then, you have a fuel management issue. Continue the checklist with emphasis of fuel related items that follow. If it doesn’t, then it is a computer or timing issue: see Step 4.

Clue – listen for the fuel pump to prime when you first turn the ignition switch on. It should run for 5-20 seconds and shut off. To trick the fuel pump into running, find the EEC test connector and jump the connector in the Upper RH corner to ground. The EEC connector is near the wiper motor and LH hood hinge.

If the relay & inertia switch are OK, you will have power to the pump. Check fuel pressure – remove the cap from the Schrader valve behind the alternator and depress the core. Fuel should squirt out, catch it in a rag. Beware of fire hazard when you do this. In a pinch, you can use a tire pressure gauge to measure the fuel pressure. It may not be completely accurate, but you will have some clue as to how much pressure you have. If you have any doubts about having sufficient fuel flow/pressure, rent a fuel pressure test gauge from the auto parts store. That will tell you for sure if you have adequate fuel pressure.


4.) No fuel pressure, possible failed items in order of their probability:
A.) Tripped inertia switch – Coupe & hatch cars hide it under the plastic trim covering the driver's side taillight. Use the voltmeter or test light to make sure you have power to both sides of the switch
B.) Fuel pump power relay – located under the driver’s seat in most stangs built before 92. On 92 and later model cars it is located below the Mass Air Flow meter. Look for 12 volts at the Pink/Black wire on the fuel pump relay.
C.) Clogged fuel filter
D.) Failed fuel pump
E.) 86-90 models only: Blown fuse link in wiring harness. Look for 12 volts at the Orange/Lt Blue wire on the fuel pump relay.
91-93 models only Blown fuse link in wiring harness. Look for 12 volts at the Pink/Black wire on the fuel pump relay.
The fuse links for all model years 86-93 live in the wiring harness near the starter solenoid.
94-95 models only: 20 amp fuel pump fuse in the engine compartment fuse box. Look for 12 volts at the Dark green/yellow wire on the constant control relay module.
F.) Engine seem to load up on fuel and may have black smoke at the tailpipe. Fuel pressure regulator failed. Remove the vacuum line from the regulator and inspect for fuel escaping while the pump is running. If fuel is coming out the vacuum port, the regulator has failed. Check the regulator vacuum line for fuel too. Disconnect it from the engine and blow air though it. If you find gas, the regulator has failed.

5.) Fuel pressure OK, the injectors are not firing.
A.) The PIP sensor in the distributor tells the computer when to fire the injectors. A failing PIP sensor will sometimes let the engine start if the SPOUT is removed.
A noid light available from any auto parts store, is one way to test the injector circuit to see if the injectors are firing. The noid light plugs into the fuel injector harness in place of any easily accessible injector. Plug it in and try to start the engine: it will flash if the injector is firing.
B.) I like to use an old injector with compressed air applied to the injector where the fuel rail would normally connect. I hook the whole thing up, apply compressed air to the injector and stick it in a paper cup of soapy water. When the engine cranks with the ignition switch on, if the injector fires, it makes bubbles. Cheap if you have the stuff laying around, and works good too.
D.) Pull an injector wire connector off and look for 12 volts on the red wire when the ignition switch is on.
E.) No power, then look for problems with the 10 pin connecter (salt & pepper shakers at the rear of the upper manifold).
F.) No power and the 10 pin connections are good: look for broken wiring between the orange/black wire on the ECC relay and the red wire for the 10 pin connectors.
G.) TPS voltage exceeds 3.7 volts with the throttle closed. This will shut off the injectors, since the computer uses this strategy to clear a flooded engine. Use a DVM, a pair of safety pins, and probe the black/white and green wires to measure the TPS voltage.
On a 94-95 Mustang, probe the black/white and grey/white wires to measure the TPS voltage.
It should be .5-.1.0 volts with the key on, engine not running. Note that if the black/white wire (signal ground) has a bad connection, you will get some strange readings. Make a second measurement using the battery post as the ground to eliminate any ground problems. If the readings are different by more than 5%, you may have a high resistance condition in the black/white signal ground circuit.

6.) Spark & fuel pressure OK.
A.) Failed IAB or improperly set base idle (no airflow to start engine). Press the throttle ¼ way down and try to start the car. See the "Surging Idle Checklist for help with all your idle/stall problems.
B.) Failed computer (not very likely)
C.) Engine ignition or cam timing off: only likely if the engine has been worked on recently).
D.) Firing order off: HO & 351 use a different firing order from the non HO engines.
HO & 351W 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8
Non HO 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8
E.) No start when hot - Press the throttle to the floor & try starting it if you get this far. If it starts, replace the ECT.
F. ) Engine that has had the heads off or valves adjusted. Do a compression test to make sure the valves are not adjusted too tight. You should have a minimum of 90 PSI on a cold engine.

 

[Dennia845]

i have gone through the list and i think it ts the computer.
i have good power and ground to the computer and power to the fuel pump and eec relay.

 

[jrichker]

Did you do step 1B PIP sensor?
If you jumper the fuel pump test point to ground, do you have fuel pressure?

 

[Dennia845]

yes i have tried pulling the pip spout out no spark no fuel press.
i have also jumped test plug and no fuel press.
i pulled computer and there was a couple drops of water on it.

 

[jrichker]

Evidently you misunderstood what the PIP test does. You use a noid light to determine if the PIP pulse is sufficent enough to trigger the computer to fire the injectors and the TFI.

Do you have 12 volts at red/lt green wire on the ignition coil?

 

[Dennia845]

new computer and eec relay and now i have spark .
no fuel press. no power to test connector, have power to fuel pump relay
no power to inertha switch

 

[jrichker]

Fuel Pump Troubleshooting for 87-90 Mustangs

Clue – listen for the fuel pump to prime when you first turn the ignition switch on.
It should run for 2-5 seconds and shut off. This on and off again cycle helps to prevent
flooding the engine when cranking. To trick the fuel pump into running, find the ECC
test connector and jump the connector in the upper RH corner to ground.

If the fuse links are OK, you will have power to the pump. Check fuel pressure –
remove the cap from the Schrader valve behind the alternator and depress the
core. Fuel should squirt out, catch it in a rag. A tire pressure gauge can also be
used if you have one - look for 37-40 PSI. Beware of fire hazard when you do this.

No fuel pressure, possible failed items in order of their probability:
A.) Tripped inertia switch – press reset button on the inertia switch. The hatch
cars hide it under the plastic trim covering the driver's side taillight. Use the
voltmeter or test light to make sure you have power to both sides of the switch

B.) Fuel pump power relay – located under the driver’s seat in most stangs built
before 92.
C.) Clogged fuel filter
D.) Failed fuel pump
E.) Blown fuse link in wiring harness.
F.) Fuel pressure regulator failed. Remove vacuum line from regulator and inspect
for fuel escaping while pump is running.

The electrical circuit for the fuel pump has two paths, a control path and a power
path.

The control path consists of the inertia switch, the computer, and the fuel pump
relay coil. It turns the fuel pump relay on or off under computer control. The
switched power (red wire) from the ECC relay goes to the inertia switch
(red/black wire) then from the inertia switch to the relay coil and then from the
relay coil to the computer (tan/ Lt green wire). The computer provides the ground
path to complete the circuit. This ground causes the relay coil to energize and
close the contacts for the power path. Keep in mind that you can have voltage
to all the right places, but the computer must provide a ground. If there is no
ground, the relay will not close the power contacts.

The power path picks up from a fuse link near the starter relay. Fuse links are like
fuses, except they are pieces of wire and are made right into the wiring harness.
The feed wire from the fuse link (orange/ light blue wire) goes to the fuel pump
relay contacts. When the contacts close because the relay energizes, the power
flows through the contacts to the fuel pump (light pink/black wire). Notice that
pin 19 on the computer is the monitor to make sure the pump has power.
The fuel pump has a black wire that supplies the ground to complete the circuit.

Remember that the computer does not source any power to actuators, relays
or injectors, but provides the ground necessary to complete the circuit. That
means one side of the circuit will always be hot, and the other side will go to
ground or below 1 volt as the computer switches on that circuit.

Diagram courtesy of AutoZone

Now that you have the theory of how it works, it’s time to go digging.

Look for 12 volts at the Orange/Lt. Blue wire (power source for fuel pump relay).
No voltage or low voltage, bad fuse link, bad wiring, bad ignition switch or ignition
switch wiring or connections. There is a mystery connector somewhere under the
driver’s side kick panel, between the fuel pump relay and the fuse link.

Turn on the key and jumper the fuel pump test connector to ground as previously
described. Look for 12 volts at the Light Pink/Black wire (relay controlled power
for the fuel pump). No voltage there means that the relay has failed, or there is a
broken wire in the relay control circuit.

Check the Red/black wire, it should have 12 volts. No 12 volts there, either the
inertia switch is open or has no power to it. Check both sides of the inertia
switch: there should be power on the Red wire and Red/Black wire. Power on the
Red wire and not on the Red/Black wire means the inertia switch is open.

Make sure that the power is off the circuit before making any resistance checks.
If the circuit is powered up, your resistance measurements will be inaccurate.

You will have to drop the tank to inspect the pump power and ground connector
and the pump wiring chassis ground.

Pump wiring: Anytime the ignition switch is in the Run position and the test
point is jumpered to ground, there should be at least 12 volts present on the
black/pink wire. You should see less than 1 Ohm between the black wire(s)
and ground. The chassis ground is up near the spare tire shell. To get some
idea of what a good reading is, short the two meter leads together and
observe the reading. It should only be slightly higher when you measure
the black wire to ground resistance.

The Tan/Lt Green wire provides a ground path for the relay power. With the test
connector jumpered to ground, there should be less than .75 volts. Use a test
lamp with one side connected to battery power and the other side to the
Tan/Lt Green wire. The test light should glow brightly. No glow and you have a
broken wire or bad connection between the test connector and the relay. To test
the wiring from the computer, remove the passenger side kick panel and
disconnect the computer connector. It has a 10 MM bolt that holds it in place.
With the test lamp connected to power, jumper pin 22 to ground and the test
lamp should glow. No glow and the wiring between the computer and the fuel
pump relay is bad.

Computer: If you got this far and everything else checked out good, the computer is suspect.
Remove the test jumper from the ECC test connector located under the hood.
Probe computer pin 22 with a safety pin and ground it to chassis. Make sure the computer
and everything else is connected. Turn the ignition switch to the Run position and observe
the fuel pressure. The pump should run at full pressure.
If it doesn't, the wiring between pin 22 on the computer and the fuel pump relay is bad.
If it does run at full pressure, the computer may have failed.

Keep in mind that the computer only runs the fuel pump for about 2-3 seconds when you turn
the key to the Run position. This can sometimes fool you into thinking the computer has died.
Connect one lead of the test light to power and the other lead to computer pin 22 with a safety pin.
With the ignition switch Off, jumper the computer into self test mode like you are going to dump
the codes. Turn the ignition switch to the Run position. The light will flicker when the computer
does the self test routine. A flickering light is a good computer. No flickering light is a bad computer.
Remove the test jumper from the ECC test connector located under the hood.

Fuel pump runs continuously: The fuel pump relay contacts are stuck together or the Tan/Lt Green wire
has shorted to ground. Remove the fuel pump relay from its socket. Then disconnect the computer and use
an ohmmeter to check out the resistance between the Tan/Lt Green wire and ground. You should see
more than 10 K Ohms (10,000 ohms) or an infinite open circuit. Be sure that the test connector isn’t
jumpered to ground.
If the wiring checks out good, then the computer is the likely culprit.

Prior to replacing the computer, check the computer power ground. The computer has its own
dedicated power ground that comes off the ground pigtail on the battery ground wire. Due to
it's proximity to the battery, it may become corroded by acid fumes from the battery. It is a
black cylinder about 2 1/2" long by 1" diameter with a black/lt green wire. You'll find it up
next to the starter solenoid where the wire goes into the wiring harness

If all of the checks have worked OK to this point, then the computer is bad. The
computers are very reliable and not prone to failure unless there has been
significant electrical trauma to the car. Things like lightning strikes and putting
the battery in backwards or connecting jumper cables backwards are about the
only thing that kills the computer.

See the following website for some help from Tmoss (diagram designer) &
Stang&2Birds (website host)

http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/IgnitionSwitchWiring.gif

http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/fuel-alt-links-ign-ac.gif

http://www.veryuseful.com/mustang/tech/engine/images/88-91eecPinout.gif

 

[Dennia845]

ok , up date the car is running it was a combo computer and eec relay being defective. now the car is running extreamly rich i did not change any thing else. timing is at stock 10 btc. it seams to run alright except when you hit the gas hard and i get alot of black smoke i pulled the plugs and they are all carbon fouled . any advice? thanks

 

[jrichker]

Dumping the computer diagnostic codes on 86-95 Mustangs

Revised 19-May-2009 to update drawing for dumping the codes on 86-88 Mustangs with no check engine light.

Dump the codes and see what the computer says is wrong…Codes may be present in the computer even if the Check Engine light isn’t on.

Here's the way to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

Be sure to turn off the A/C, and put the transmission in neutral when dumping the codes. Fail to do this and you will generate a code 67 and not be able to dump the Engine Running codes.

Dumping the Engine Running codes: The procedure is the same, you start the engine with the test jumper in place. Be sure the A/C is off and the transmission is in neutral. You'll get an 11, then a 4 and the engine will speed up to do the EGR test. After the engine speed decreases back to idle, it will dump the engine running codes.

Here's the link to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

See Troublcodes.net Trouble Codes OBD & OBD2 Trouble Codes and Technical info & Tool Store. By BAT Auto Technical

If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.

The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.

89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.

The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.


WARNING!!! There is a single dark brown connector with a black/orange wire. It is the 12 volt power to the under the hood light. Do not jumper it to the computer test connector. If you do, you will damage the computer.

What to expect:
You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good. No code 11 and you have some wiring problems.

Codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

Alternate methods:
For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see Actron® for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.

Or for a nicer scanner see Digital Ford Code Reader (3145) – It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $30.

 

[Dennia845]

ok up date car runs but but runs excessively rich (realy bad gas milage and black smoke when i get on it . when i bought the car it was a mess i replaced ecu (water damage) along with eec relay there were no o2 sensors in off road h pipe . i had to get o2 harness and o2 sensors also smog pump delete.
i dumped codes to day and got 98 ? and 22 map sensor koer i have to go to my shop to get my dvm to test wiring . also after i installed new o2 harness and sensors the car will idle fine for about a min. or 2 then die if i dont give it gas?

 

[jrichker]

Code 22 or 126 MAP (vacuum) or BARO signal out of range. The MAP or BARO sensor is pretty much the same sensor for both Mass Air & Speed Density cars. The main difference is where it is connected. Mass Air cars vent it to the atmosphere, while Speed Density cars connect it to the intake manifold vacuum. Its purpose is to help set a baseline for the air/fuel mixture by sensing changes in barometric pressure. The MAP or BAP sensor puts out a 5 volt square wave that changes frequency with variations in atmospheric pressure. The base is 154 HZ at 29.92" of mercury - dry sunny day at sea level, about 68-72 degrees. You need an oscilloscope or frequency meter to measure it. There a very few DVM with a price tag under $40 that will measure frequency, but there are some out there.

The MAP/BARO sensor is mounted on the firewall behind the upper manifold on 86-93 Mustangs.

Baro or MAP test using frequency meter - run the test key on engine off. The noise from the ignition system will likely upset the frequency meter. I used a 10 x oscilloscope probe connected from the frequency meter to the MAP/BAP to reduce the jitter in the meter's readout.

If it is defective, your air/fuel ratio will be off and the car’s performance & emissions will suffer

Some basic checks you can make to be sure that the sensor is getting power & ground:
Note that all resistance tests must be done with power off. Measuring resistance with a circuit powered on will give false readings and possibly damage the meter.
Check the resistance between the black/white wire on the MAP/BARO sensor and then the black/white wire on the EGR and the same wire on the TPS. It should be less than 1 ohm. Next check the resistance between the black/white wire and the negative battery cable. It should be less than 1.5 ohm.

The following power on check requires you to turn the ignition switch to the Run position.
Use a DVM to check for 5 volts on the orange/white wire. If it is missing, look for +5 volts at the orange/white wire on the TPS or EGR sensors. Use the black/white wire for the ground for the DVM.



Code 98 - basic computer internal tests not passed before it started processing the request to dump codes. Do a Key On Engine Off test before starting the engine. Wait until you see the 11 flash before pressing any buttons if you have a hand operated scanner. The computer is operating in Limp mode, so fix any codes it dumps prior to doing anything else.