What do YOU guys think my car is worth?

[Power Surge]

Well I hate to say it, but I may be selling my 76. Not that I want to, but I am currently moving my performance shop into a larger building, and money is getting a little tight. So if need be, I'll have to sell the 76.

I want to know what YOU guys think the car is worth. I want fellow enthusiasts opinions on the issue. I value what you guys have to say here in this forum.

Most of you know my car, but just to recap... 1976 Cobra II, 302/4 speed. Being restored to as close to OEM original as possible. I have spent over 4k alone accumulating NOS parts for this car. The car is mechanically sound and runs great. The interior is completely restored. The engine bay is about 75% restored. The body is what would need to be done next. While the car is very good looking and may seem perfect on the outside, it does have some paint issues from the previous owner's paintjob. It will need to be repainted to be "proper", and the only rust on the car is the very bottom of the doors and a TINY bubbled spot on one of the quarters. Included with the sale of the car, would be tons of NOS and mint original parts that I have not yet put on the car. These parts include: front and rear NOS bumpers and bumper inserts, NOS carb, nice V8 exhaust manifolds with all shields and heat riser lines, NOS heat riser tube, NOS carbon canister tube, NOS motor mount, NOS EGR valve, NOS P/S dipstick, NOS heater hoses, NOS V8 dual exhaust system from manifolds to rear end (heat valve, H-pipe, mid pipes, resonators, clamps, gaskets), NOS fuel pump, NOS gas cap, nice lower valance, few sets of NOS spark plugs, NOS belts, and some other parts I can't remember right now.

Would I be out of line to ask 6-7k for the car and parts? I'd think the NOS bumpers, exhaust, and other parts has to be worth well over $1500 or so, not to mention the thousands of dollars worth of NOS parts that have put IN the car so far. Please give your thoughts.

Here are a few pics of the car to get an idea:

Engine bay 1

Engine bay 2

Dash

Front

Side 1

Side 2

Rear

 

[perce111]

My opinion is probably slanted but....I would start a about $10,000.
The condition that the car appears to be in and the spares included its worth it.
Mine is not a resto but if I couldn't get $6000 I wouldn't sell it. [not close to half of the investment].
I'm sorry that you've had to come to this decision as I followed you work all the time. But things change.

Good luck however it turns out and congratulations on getting bigger.

Later

 

[Power Surge]

My opinion is probably slanted but....I would start a about $10,000.
The condition that the car appears to be in and the spares included its worth it.
Mine is not a resto but if I couldn't get $6000 I wouldn't sell it. [not close to half of the investment].
I'm sorry that you've had to come to this decision as I followed you work all the time. But things change.

Good luck however it turns out and congratulations on getting bigger.

Later

Thanks for the reply. This is exactly why I asked, to get honest responses. I have WAY more than 6-7k into this car, but we all know you never get what you put in. But I don't want to short change myself either. I guess if I decide to sell it, maybe I'll start at a higher price and see if anyone goes for it. After all, a car is only worth what someone is willing to pay for it.

 

[cobraii74x]

I'm with perce111 in sayin 10k is a good start not only do you have tons of money invested in it you also have the time in it... also the love.. and sometimes hate you put into it.. and you cant forget the fact that all of those NOS parts are included.. and we all know how much of a b***** ( female dog ) it can be to find those ( due to recent belief i know that NOS means new original/old stock ) thats just my .02 and if it means anything if i had the money id buy it

 

[Project 77]

I'll add my .02 cents here..and i'm sure i'll get blasted. I've bought and sold alot of Mustang II's...some by choice, others out of need. Here's the problem I have, and i'll use Sal's car as an example (sorry). If you use the VMR's priceguide, a 1976 CObra II with the optional 302 2V and 4 speed , in a number 1 condition, which to them is a trailer queen, full resto job, they quote a price of $6300. Random Mustang II price guide websites seem to range from the $6300 to the $7000 range. Now I KNOW these figures vary, and I also know how rare these cars are in that condition.

Believe me when i say i'm not trying to be an ass here, and i know NOS parts are hard to find, but you yourself said it needs minor bodywork, and paint. I guess i didn't really have a point other than what I see. I see what things sell for on ebay, I watch traderonline, I know what sells and what has been sitting there for months. Good luck if you decide to sell, I PMed what I believed to be a fair offer

 

[THE COBRAMAN]

Some good points have been made.

In respect to the price guides: you're right about the values shown. The problem with those types of guides are that they are very slow to recognize cars that are not overwhelmingly popular, especially if they use auction values. As we all know, very few IIs ever see the "big" auctions.

As to the question... It's my opinion that selling the car with the NOS parts is going to mean that you are basiclly giving the parts away. You are far more likely to recover more dollars by selling them seperately, either to the car buyer if they are interested, or on the open market after the car sells.

It's a fine looking car, and I'd be proud to own it. I'd guess it would bring in the $5000-6500 range, depending on how badly someone wanted it. Remember, that's just the car.

I don't think it will bring 10K, not because the package isn't worth it, but because most non-II owners have no idea of the value of the additional parts.

Hope you don't have to sell.....

Brian

 

[Power Surge]

Good points from all so far. Project77 made me an offer already that's reasonable, for the car only. I think I'd rather sell it that way anyway. You're right that I'd get more $$ for the extra parts seperately.

Keep the input coming.

 

[LXXVICOBRA]

Good points from all so far. Project77 made me an offer already that's reasonable, for the car only. I think I'd rather sell it that way anyway. You're right that I'd get more $$ for the extra parts seperately.

Keep the input coming.

Hey Sal...
I'll post my thoughts on this a little later tonite. In any case, I'd be really interested in those bumpers should you deceide to sell the parts off.
I sure hope that this wouldn't mean the end of your involvement with the II's altogether.

 

[Power Surge]

Hey Sal...
I'll post my thoughts on this a little later tonite. In any case, I'd be really interested in those bumpers should you deceide to sell the parts off.
I sure hope that this wouldn't mean the end of your involvement with the II's altogether.

Mike, I'd like to hear your opinion, especially being the original owner of the same car. As for me getting out of IIs, don't forget I have the Thundersnake .

 

[LXXVICOBRA]

OK, I just reread all the reponses so far...

I'm not sure that I can offer a additional viewpoint to what's aready been mentioned, but will offer my opinion for what it's worth. Actually, I can agree with parts of all the responses so far...but think the points Cobraman has made are most valid under the circumstances.

I don't think a 5-6K asking price for this car is out of line at all...and probably most realistic. A serious and knowledgeable II buyer would/should see and understand the effort, workmanship and new materials already put into this car, compared to other offerings in a similar price range that may be available. For such buyers, it would probably be considered a fair value, and
(fairly quick sale for you)as they would be heavily weighing the additional costs associated with finishing the restoration. No doubt too, they would be happy not having to do all the work you have already done.

Certainly, you might try asking another 1 or 2 K though...after all, you never know if you don't try. I would tend to think however, that the buyers willing to pay much more than 7000, would be those less aware of the true cost of restoration on such a car. It's sad in a way, that because of this, the enthusiasts most knowelegable or interested in a II are also the ones that are least likely to pay more. So, it's also my guess that the pool of potential knowledgeable buyers for a 10K II still needing some bodywork could be quite limited.

Lets face it...the cost of bringing even an original low mileage II to #1 show condition could likely easily approach 10K....(not even including initial cost of car)...with much of that figure determined by the quality and amount of bodywork/paint necessary or desired, in addition to the cost of obtaining all the other correct parts that are so hard to find...as you well know.

Clearly, (as you implied) you may be rapidly approaching that neighborhood of overall cash outlay already, (initial cost plus parts) without yet addressing this aspect of your restoration. If you were to put even just a couple thousand more into the body, and include the other parts in the sale for reaching the upper limit 10K figure, you would in essence be giving them away then as Cobraman said... on top of losing that certain undetermined amount of money that we all know becomes lost in most any restoration anyway. Remember too, once you exceed that rather unfair but published market value, the pool of potential buyers shrinks rapidly, it takes longer to sell, and you are likely to get less return on each additional dollar you put into it.

As it stands, by my thinking, you appear to be in a posistion to at least recover your NOS parts expenses and perhaps some of your initial investment in the car, with a sale of around 6K...with extra money to be made of the sale of the individual parts seperately. I would hope any money lost from there would be considered (and in line)with what one usually loses in such an extensive restoration of a car that doesn't command premium money in the market. Certainly, I'd be hard pressed to sell for any less in any case.

 

[Northern J II]

To me it worth $20000 and you could get $10000 for it!
DO NOT SELL IT!!!!!! I was just in a situation like yours, where I just needed a few grand, and everybody was saying sell the Mark 7, sell the Mark 7. I said hell with that, pry the keys out of my cold dead hands!! I just recently fell flat on my ass, and clawed my way back up, I kept the II and the VII. I see it time and time again, people sell off their toys for pennies on the dollar and they ALWAYS regret it. Tighten your belt, suffer and keep the II!!!! The older you get the harder it is to justify buying new toys, kids need boots, the roof has a leak blah blah blah.... I will get off my soap box now.

 

[dmoody]

First it is a beautiful car and I hope it goes to a good home if you do decide to sell. Unfortunately due to the relatively low value brought by IIs on the market, it is all to easy for a car like this to fall into the hands of someone who won't take care of it. Have you thought about asking Bill Blackburn if he knows of anyone that would like a well restored Cobra II? I'm sure you've seen his car before and it is one of the best restored II's in the world. I know he has gotten offers on his car so he would know of others interested in buying Mustangs from this era.

That said, I think the car would bring 5-7k on the open market. One thing that hurts the value of your II is that it doesn't have A/C. Most people looking to spend a lot of money on an old car want all of the options. Well those are my thoughts on the subject. I hope I have been of some help.

d

 

[danimaltheanima]

Well guy, I'm sorry but I think your a head case for even leting selling that car cross your mind. That is one sweet ride man, and I know how much work/money is takes to do that. Let alone the time you spend trying to hunt those NOS parts down. Its not impossible but its the next thing closest to it I'll tell you that right now. Your starting up a shop and you think that the money from your MII is really going to make that big of a differance. I've seen the pics of this car your wanting to sell. I've seen pics of the Thundersnake. You obviously have money. I don't think selling this car will make the differance between you having a shop and not having a shop. Somone that puts that much effort into a car doesn't just let it go. They hold on to it for dear life and wouldn't give it up for nothing. There is only a few true loves in ones life and when putting that much into a car it becomes one of them. Figure something else out if you need the $ man, dear god don't do it.

Lil story about myself,
Dec 4th 2002 I had a serious back injury on the job. Work Comp jerked me around as they usually would anyone and fought the case. I've been off work for a long long time now living with my P's and having zero money to go anywhere and do anything. 3 epidurals and back surgery later I am finally going to be able to work again in a few months after therapy. My #1 favorite thing to do is to go fishing. I currently have a 99' Chevy Tahoe LT, Bayliner boat, and my 78 Mustang Cobra. To make ends meet and pay bills I've had to cash in my 401K and am now looking at filing for bankruptsy. I am selling the Tahoe and I am selling my #1 favorite thing to do in life, my boat. I don't know if you have seen the pics of my car but I have put so much time, money, pain, anguish, stress, heart, love into that car and I will not sell that Mustang no matter how bad it gets. It hasn't even crossed my mind. There is always another way my friend. Find it.

 

[Power Surge]

Thanks for the replies so far. I knew that some of you would think I was nuts for wanting to sell it. Remember, I said I "may" be selling it, I haven't decided yes or no yet. I do not WANT to sell it, but there are good reasons for me to do so if the need arises. I have already had several offers made privately for the car just from this post. I have not said yes to any of them yet. The car is not for sale yet. I am just asking for thoughts on if I did decide to let it go. I apprecaite everyones opinions so far .

 

[HaveII]

It still blows my mind how cheaply II's are priced. I have had several people ask me what my II is worth. Keep in mind that my car is not original, not a Cobra, not even a fastback, but a Ghia. I usually respond to the question with the question 'what do they think?" I have been surprised by the answers I have gotten. Now realize that these are from people who have no idea of a II's value. I have not had anyone say less than $7500 and suggested values have been as much as 12 and 15k! When I tell them that I would be VERY lucky to get 5K and might even have to part it out to do that they have been shocked and in total disbelief. Now I realize that these people are not buyers with cash in hand, but it sure seems to me that most people are not aware of the II values and have no idea. Now all you have to do is find one with cash and likes your car.

If you decide to sell and someone gets that car for 6 or 7k they got a great deal. Definetly sell the NOS part seperately. I still think that II's are a great investment and that the values can only go up. There are not many good ones left out there so even if the demand does not increase, the supply will surely dry up. Tell anyone who wants to buy it that you want 12k. If they counter with anything less than 10K ask them if they really had their heart set on a clean no rust Cobra II or a bucket of rust that will cost 15K to restore and still not be as nice.

One last note. I collected antique beer cans since I was a kid. My best can was the best known example of less than 10 in existance. I had several specialist and experts tell me this can would never get more than $2500 for it and even that would be a pipe dream. It's a foriegn can and not many people want it. It's a crowntainer, not many people collect those. I responded it's one of the beautiful cans ever made, it was likely the nicest can still remaining that was filled in Cuba back in the 40's, and that this is the best one known. I ended up selling it for $4,000....

 

[Project 77]

OK i'll add another .02 cents. I know everyone thinks these cars are super rare, and hard to find, like i said I bought and sold many. right now there is a NICE 48,000 original miled King on ebay and the bidding is at $8300. the car is beautiful and under hood is great, no rust, dent, dings. the bidding, at $8300, is RIGHT about what VMR is listing that car for in that condition. SOmeone, with alot fo money, is just going to go off and buy it for some obscene amount of money. I know all of us love these cars but where do we draw the line? who in there right MIND would pay 7500 for a Ghia? There a damn nice coupe here that the guy can't give away at $3500 and it has a ton of work under the hood. Sorry for the rant but i see it as this way, from a II owners standpoint if you will. If I am spending 10K on a car it BETTER be a damn nice King, either original or some really tasltfull modified car.

 

[dmoody]

I agree with HaveII... I think II's will explode in value someday. However that time hasn't come yet and may not arrive for another couple of decades. I remember seeing a nice II on e-bay just a few weeks ago that wasn't stock but was a very nice Cobra II fastback. The owner even had a custom stainless steel fuel tank made for it. The bidding started at 10k and never got the first bite.

d

 

[LXXVICOBRA]

Sal,
Continued thought about this possible sale has convinced me, that not only is the car worth a 5K minimum, but that you probably should ask more to start. I certainly wouldn't feel any guilt in doing so, if it were mine!

As I stated previously, your best offer may well come from someone that doesn't have a lot of first hand knowledge about II values and associated costs and work involved in restoring one of these cars. Keeping that in mind, you might reasonably assume too, that the offers and estimates given here by forum members, are likewise possibly somewhat lower than you might actually be able to get in the open market.

See, we have pretty much accepted the relatively low previously established II values, from years of negative press and low acceptance from owners of Mustangs of other generations. This doesn't mean that all of the general public feels the same at this point in time. With the cost of so many "classic" cars of the 50's and 60's becoming almost cost prohibitive to many (new) old car enthusiasts, a super clean well restored Mustang II in the 5-10K range should/could still be considered a great buy.

Personally, I feel the only thing keeping your car from hitting the high side of that price range, is the fact it needs the bodywork you described, however minimal that may be. While my car IS quite similar to yours overall in many ways, it too is in need of similar improvement (along with some parts replacement, overall restoration and extra TLC you have already done), in order to justify asking more than the 5-6K I suggested you might also get for yours. However, there's little doubt I'd accept less than 8-10K, if and when that work were ever completed.

Aside from the occasional low mileage original King Cobras that appear for sale and draw interest from the true "collector" car people that study price guides and base offers on them.... it's regular Cobra II's like yours, mine, and some others having lots of the the visual street appeal that the general car buying public desires and relates to, along with being a Mustang II they more likely remember. Because of this, there is often greater differences in actual market value versus selling price...a place where you could come out better off than you might think.

I believe that for II values to rise considerably across the board, it will take examples like yours to begin selling in the 8-10K range. It will take people like you standing more firm in what they will accept, for what they have put into it. Full stripped to shell restorations like Bill Blackburn's will always command mega dollars from those that have it to spend. Price becomes little issue after a certain point of professional restoration to well heeled buyers. Cars like his will bring the Mustang II to new levels of recognition by the general public. Now might be a great time to try and test the market, with a clean Cobra II that could be considered quite affordable by comparison, even if you do ask more than the so called experts say it's worth.

 

[Project 77]

Sal,
Continued thought about this possible sale has convinced me, that not only is the car worth a 5K minimum, but that you probably should ask more to start. I certainly wouldn't feel any guilt in doing so, if it were mine!

As I stated previously, your best offer may well come from someone that doesn't have a lot of first hand knowledge about II values and associated costs and work involved in restoring one of these cars. Keeping that in mind, you might reasonably assume too, that the offers and estimates given here by forum members, are likewise possibly somewhat lower than you might actually be able to get in the open market.

See, we have pretty much accepted the relatively low previously established II values, from years of negative press and low acceptance from owners of Mustangs of other generations. This doesn't mean that all of the general public feels the same at this point in time. With the cost of so many "classic" cars of the 50's and 60's becoming almost cost prohibitive to many (new) old car enthusiasts, a super clean well restored Mustang II in the 5-10K range should/could still be considered a great buy.

Personally, I feel the only thing keeping your car from hitting the high side of that price range, is the fact it needs the bodywork you described, however minimal that may be. While my car IS quite similar to yours overall in many ways, it too is in need of similar improvement (along with some parts replacement, overall restoration and extra TLC you have already done), in order to justify asking more than the 5-6K I suggested you might also get for yours. However, there's little doubt I'd accept less than 8-10K, if and when that work were ever completed.

Aside from the occasional low mileage original King Cobras that appear for sale and draw interest from the true "collector" car people that study price guides and base offers on them.... it's regular Cobra II's like yours, mine, and some others having lots of the the visual street appeal that the general car buying public desires and relates to, along with being a Mustang II they more likely remember. Because of this, there is often greater differences in actual market value versus selling price...a place where you could come out better off than you might think.

I believe that for II values to rise considerably across the board, it will take examples like yours to begin selling in the 8-10K range. It will take people like you standing more firm in what they will accept, for what they have put into it. Full stripped to shell restorations like Bill Blackburn's will always command mega dollars from those that have it to spend. Price becomes little issue after a certain point of professional restoration to well heeled buyers. Cars like his will bring the Mustang II to new levels of recognition by the general public. Now might be a great time to try and test the market, with a clean Cobra II that could be considered quite affordable by comparison, even if you do ask more than the so called experts say it's worth.

I'll take that post as direct to me as the "so called" expert. WHat you are suggesting will do a lot of things. Sure, try to sell it for $10K,and maybe it does sell, now everyone with a II that needs "restored" figures they can ask more money for a car that was a $1500 car. Then when NOS parts command an even higher price because they are being sought out, and guys like Phil and Gary can really hammer everyone on price, everyone will be up in arms and cry foul. Can ANY of you honestly say that you sought out a $10K car when you bought your II? better yet, how many of you have that kind of cash, or would part with that kind of cash for a II, cobra or King? Sal, your car is very nice, interior and engine compartment are beautiful, this was not intended to get ugly.

 

[THE COBRAMAN]

Project77:

Who put the big chip on your shoulder?

I have never met you and don't know you, but you seem to take all of this very personally. It's just a forum for discussion, nothing more. I don't believe anyone has openly criticized your opinions, and that is not what this post is intended to be about.

When I got serious about IIs again about 9 years ago, you couldn't hardly give a II away. I have bought Cobra IIs as low as $150, missing only the front spoiler/valance.

The average II buyer buys one because they like the look, it's an affordable way to get a cool older Ford, it brings back memories, whatever. I don't believe that the usual II buyer ever really pays any attention to what the "book" value as determined by any of the handful of price guides is. The KC mentioned is probably at the current level because somebody that read about them being a "future collectible" started researching the values, and stopped at that point.

As far as the demand increasing prices for cars and parts, yep, it will. Just like every other car anybody messes with. Looked at station wagons of the '60s lately? Couldn't give them away 20 years ago. The same is true of virtually every special interest car, the more people get interested, the higher the price goes. Same deal as before, more people want in at the entry level, the higher the price gets on increasingly rougher cars, while finished cars tend to stagnate at a certain level.

Would I pay 10 large for a II (yes, I do have it)? Nope, but I wouldn't pay it for a '57 chevy, or '70 Mustang, or any of a multitude of cars that regularly trade at that price.

It almost seems that you want II values to remain low from the tone of the last post. Then people cry about how much effort it takes to build a nice one, but nobody will give them what they think it's worth. It's a vicious circle.

If anybody is into IIs for the possible financial gain, they need their nut examined very closely.

*************************************

The preceding is the opinion of the author, and is not to be construed as an attack on anyone in particular.