Why high power V8's are better.

Nosfurato · Nov 23, 2004

texaco said:
wow, that must be a hell of a powerband to feel past 6500 rpm or so by the looks of it. notice its only making 200hp at 6000rpm, thats silly.

useless power. Id guess a stock 03/04 cobra would take car of that car?

Dont get me wrong, im a die hard FORD guy.. I own two Mustangs. but, I will give fair warning.. do NOT underestimate these cars. (STI's)

As far as the dyno chart goes,.. you need to take into consideration.. (when the hammer was drop'd). the car could have verry easily been babied to that rpm.. and then stood on.

Also, keep in mind that this is a four.. read 4!! cylinder that we are talking about here.

I understand the whole competition idea,.. blablabla.. but still.. you must respect this kind of car. 501 hp AT the wheels.. 4 of them no less. from a 4 banger??

And no, a stock 03-04 cobra has nothing for a car like this.

I love Love ford,.. I would DIE to have an 03-04 cobra.. but this car would hand it its arse.

i4power · Nov 23, 2004

stkdidy said:
it wouldn really be TOO hard to do a twin turbo setup that spools way faster and gets same or more boost...just some y-piping

Twin turbos would suck on a small engine with only one exhaust manifold.

Route666 · Nov 23, 2004

texaco said:
wow, that must be a hell of a powerband to feel past 6500 rpm or so by the looks of it. notice its only making 200hp at 6000rpm, thats silly.

useless power. Id guess a stock 03/04 cobra would take car of that car?

It's actually a fair bit over 280hp at 6000rpm, the 8 looks like a zero though, but it's still much too steep of a curve.

rhumbline · Nov 23, 2004

I agree with SixFivePony, a very different means to power to be sure, but as many STis have shown, a devastatingly effective means nonetheless. Obviously such a car has to be driven very differently and more actively than a big cube V8, but then, that can be half the fun too -- aren't performance cars all about driver involvement anyway? And remember, this motor is lashed to a tight six speed in an extremely capable AWD chassis, so it is very effective in putting every horse to the ground and using them to their upmost in a wide range of driving situations. Dead stop, straight line excelleration is merely one single aspect of a cars overall performance envelope. Optimising a car for this narrow aspect, as many Stangers seem to do, can quite compromise the cars overall performance capabilities. These STis take a more well rounded approach resulting in real world, over a varied road result that is second to few cars of any displacement.

Now don't get me wrong, I love a big ol' thumping V8 as much as the next guy, but I also have enormous respect success of the STi's very different approach too.

Midnight · Nov 23, 2004

Glad to see there are those among us that can appreciate badass cars, regardless of who made them

Razinhell · Nov 23, 2004

Hey i never said that this car sucks. In fact just 2 months before he hit 12.2 1/4 mile. That was before he replaced the factory turbo with a Garret to produce the power shown in the chart. The car is no slouch. I was really trying to point out how different the highend V8's can be to the highpowered 4's. Obviously this car isn't geared for the street anymore and in fact the owner no longer uses it as a daily driver. The chart really shows how much harder the 4 cylinder must work to get the most out of its power. While the V8 can lumber with low rpms and make great power even before it hits the powerband. I'd say that if you drove this car it would almost be like hitting the turbo button in the old nightrider show when you hit the gas hard.

tjm73 · Nov 23, 2004

i4power said:
Twin turbos would suck on a small engine with only one exhaust manifold.

Maybe you are not aware, but the Subaru 4 cylinder is a "boxer" engine kinda like a Porsche/VW engine...only better cause it's water cooled. So 2 turbo's would be possible since their are left and right exhaust banks.

And yes they do have one exhaust manifold shaped kinda like a Y, but two individual turbo headers would fix that easy enough.

wrx-no-mo · Nov 24, 2004

I follow the WRX forums pretty closely (as a WRX owner, soon to be 2005 Mustang GT owner!) and I seem to recall that one or two guys have tried a twin turbo setup. *Very* pricey since it is all custom work. Seems like lately there has been more of a push for the twin scroll setup (single turbo, but insanely fast spool).

I just don't get the WRX guys who put the huge turbos on the car. My setup (see attached) produces about as little lag as possible and I still don't like the power band.

Mach428 · Nov 24, 2004

Man this 2005 mustang is doing down the craper fast, a STI stock would rip an 05 GT in every single way. How is it just a POS ricer?? Give me a break. Don't get me wrong, there's nothin better then N/A V8 muscle but guys, give a car credit when it deserves it come on now

spidermaxx300 · Nov 25, 2004

as a former 2k1 gt owner and now 03 wrx owner...some of you guys call cars like these (wrx, sti, and evo's) ricers cause the exhaust is big....there are reasons for this. just cause the car is made in japan doesnt mean that us scooby owners live the "ricer" life. infact go to www.nasioc.com and see for yourself.

since most mustang owners are more concerned with power and 1/4 times, a 250 hp wrx(or 500 hp) seems like week sauce to some of you guys. the only thing that i can tell you is my car dynoed around 245 hp and tq, and runs 13.2-13.4's (for those uneducated thats about 1200$ in power mods). thats with full interior and about 60 lbs of speaker stuff in the trunk. a 500 horse scooby with a good driver should be in the mid 10's. but you know thats nothing to write home about cause he makes his horsepower at the top of the rpm range.

some people are so upset at the fact a foreign car might be a little faster than their "american" made car that they have pick at every little thing just to justify their said ownership of their "american" car. give respect where its due.

long live the mustang!

laters
shaun h.

O5stang · Nov 25, 2004

Razinhell said:
I thought this would amuse the masses of V8 people on this site. Taken from a heavily modified STi. As you can see Mt. Everest in Dyno format. So much for the low end. Just to decipher this Dyno for you, the solid red line is the HP and the dotted red line is the Torq. It was also done on a AWD dyno.

Ahemm, and where is your dyno graph at.

BlackDrop50 · Nov 25, 2004

Some people actually like the powerband like that....so they can drive their cars around normally but take it up when they want the power. I personally prefer N/A power but that's just me. Maybe when I hop into a turbo or S/C monster I might change my mind.

i4power · Nov 26, 2004

tjm73 said:
Maybe you are not aware, but the Subaru 4 cylinder is a "boxer" engine kinda like a Porsche/VW engine...only better cause it's water cooled. So 2 turbo's would be possible since their are left and right exhaust banks.

And yes they do have one exhaust manifold shaped kinda like a Y, but two individual turbo headers would fix that easy enough.

Of course i'm aware of that, man. The problem here is that it would only be ~1 liter of displacement per turbo. If you were running some really damn tiny turbos, then it would work.

svtguy · Nov 26, 2004

Wow, That car has 500awhp but only has a 1800RPM range where it has more power than a stock 96 GT.

Also the graph starts at 4200rpm but the car still has no power.

racinready300ex · Nov 26, 2004

svtguy said:
Wow, That car has 500awhp but only has a 1800RPM range where it has more power than a stock 96 GT.

Also the graph starts at 4200rpm but the car still has no power.

But the sti would run low 11's high 10's and the GT would run 14's. And the sti driver will make a least one more shift than the GT driver maybe two. I think there 6 speeds really hold them back, if you watch a vid of 500 whp sti you'll see they really row through the low gears like there not there. They have to make the 1-2 shift prior to the 60' and still cut 1.6's on street tires(real street tires not drag radials). They damn near need 6th gear befor the end. The one I saw went 11.2 @ like 128 mph.

If you complain about turbo lag your not driving it wright.

rah rah · Nov 27, 2004

That's why I choose both. I love turbo 4's and v8's. In fact, I owned a notchback 5.0 for about 2 weeks....long story. The 4's and 8's powerbands are so completely different, especially when the 4's start using bigger turbos. In my setup, the turbo is not that big that the low/mid range suffers. The car is still VERY fun to drive--and the turbo is capable of 400+ hp.
She makes 260 whp, 250 torque, for now... . The power rockets up after 3500-4000 and pulls strong past redline. Doesn't sound like much, but it's in a 2500 lb. integra. Anyway, the ultimate is big displacement + turbo. I'm seriously, seriously, seriously considering the new stang for '06-07. Then I"ll have the the best of both worlds.

zinn · Nov 27, 2004

peaky motors with the right gearbox work great. i have driven enough two-stroke street bikes to know what they are capable of. i used to ride a yamaha RZ350 (very modified) and i would smoke liter bikes on most twisty roads. it had the power to keep up or close to them in the straights, but once that corner came up i could out brake them coner faster and power out earlier. the liter bikes did have a atvatage on slower corners becuase i had two much power or not enough depending on the gear, but they could just dump on tourqe. i personally like both styles of preformance but they require difrent driving/riding styles to get the most out of them.

dannygat · Nov 28, 2004

with all due respect my brotherrs 05 sti is faster then my 05 Mustang GT.... but mine is more fun and cheeper to make faster

dannygat · Nov 28, 2004

spidermaxx300 said:
as a former 2k1 gt owner and now 03 wrx owner...some of you guys call cars like these (wrx, sti, and evo's) ricers cause the exhaust is big....there are reasons for this. just cause the car is made in japan doesnt mean that us scooby owners live the "ricer" life. infact go to www.nasioc.com and see for yourself.

since most mustang owners are more concerned with power and 1/4 times, a 250 hp wrx(or 500 hp) seems like week sauce to some of you guys. the only thing that i can tell you is my car dynoed around 245 hp and tq, and runs 13.2-13.4's (for those uneducated thats about 1200$ in power mods). thats with full interior and about 60 lbs of speaker stuff in the trunk. a 500 horse scooby with a good driver should be in the mid 10's. but you know thats nothing to write home about cause he makes his horsepower at the top of the rpm range.

some people are so upset at the fact a foreign car might be a little faster than their "american" made car that they have pick at every little thing just to justify their said ownership of their "american" car. give respect where its due.

long live the mustang!

laters
shaun h.

BS on your low 13's my brother has the 300hp 05 sti and he gets 13.3's
Oh and to the faster japanese cars... find one for 25k that can beat a mustang GT that is new and sold in america... lets see 25k+wrx which is slower or for 32k you can get a sti or a 04 cobra, sti still slower

rah rah · Nov 28, 2004

dannygat said:
BS on your low 13's my brother has the 300hp 05 sti and he gets 13.3's
Oh and to the faster japanese cars... find one for 25k that can beat a mustang GT that is new and sold in america... lets see 25k+wrx which is slower or for 32k you can get a sti or a 04 cobra, sti still slower

He clearly stated low 13's with $1200 worth of mods.

I'm a regular at Raceway Park and I"ve seen guys run anyting from 12's to 15's in WRX's. Sure, completely stock they are mid/high 14 second cars with a decent driver, but turbo cars are very versatile and easy to mod--and so are v8's.

We can sit here and post for days about how domestics blah, blah, blah and japanese fart cans, blah, blah, blah. Keep it technical and mature guys, the "my $1500 5.0 can runs 5's vs. with my MaD VtEc toP End Skillz yo can kill you in a 5 mile race" argument has been beaten to death.

I'm an import guy at heart, but the truth is that big displacement + forced induction, rules--period!

Why high power V8's are better.

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