06/07 Mustang SVT

Hoyt Clagwell · Nov 28, 2004

I'm hoping there will be a high-hp Boss version to compete with the C6 Z06 Vette. I'd like to see rear window slats, blacked-out hood, with either a shaker or attached hood scoop. As if you can't tell, I have a soft spot for the Boss. If Ford comes out with one, there will be marital discord in my house.

pyro_la · Nov 28, 2004

Scot_94GT said:
If it is $39,000, or even $45,000...same argument. The next cheapest 500hp car is still a good $15,000 or so more expensive.

QUOTE]

you have to understand with the corvette and so on you are paying for the name, is a ferrari really worth 300K? and it wouldend make sence for ford to go backwards in the hp range esspecially with other manufactuers plans for near future cars. so i can deffinatly see a 500hp SVT also alot of ppl have been hearing rumors of a 500hp car and theres always some truth to every rumor

03 SVT VERT · Nov 29, 2004

jmk97GT said:
The magic number is 450.

That is what I think too, Ford will do fine if the next base cobra is about/around 450hp (and I bet sales will increase for every 10hp over that, if it is not crazy to insure.) That way they can say they are more powerfull then a base Corvette and base GTO, less expensive, and with 4 seats. Which is the Cobra's big selling point. They know if the base GTO becomes faster and more powerfull they will lose a lot of sales, so much it would probibly kill the program, so it is a guarentee the next Cobra will be more powerfull and/or faster then the base GTO (400hp) and atleast close to the Judge in speed if not hp (500hp).

I'm thinking if they go from an understated 390hp to an understated 490hp in some Cobra model it will make a lot of people happy.

Scot_94GT · Nov 29, 2004

03 SVT VERT said:
I'm thinking if they go from an understated 390hp to an understated 490hp in some Cobra model it will make a lot of people happy.

It would definitely make ME happy....too bad it will never happen.

Mach428 · Nov 29, 2004

Sorry, but I don't believe that Ford is going to jump into the 450-500HP range right away. The last Cobra was 420hp, yet you couldn't even get it all to the ground. I for one believe Ford is going to work on puting all 400hp to the ground through a N/A 5.4 Think about it, why would Ford jump right on a 500HP Cobra when the current Cobra, for most drivers not all, had trouble getting it's power to the ground through first and second gear. I have first hand experience with a 2004 Mach and a 2004 Cobra. Due to IRS the Cobra does not feel the slightest bit diffrent then my Mach in a 0-60 run due to a lack of traction, after 60 is where i feel the diffrence. Ford is definitly going to save the big 500 number for the years to come. Ford would also save 500hp in order to draw sales in for years to come. Ford wants to stick with the go fast cheap crowd, we definitly won't see 500hp by 2007. Reamember everyone, it's not all about the power, more power doen't mean acceleration, it's getting it to the ground and around turns.

XJeep · Nov 30, 2004

The rumor I heard is that it will be something that will be marketed on a different scale than other before it...its main inspiration is the said to be the BMW M3...

Ford has its eyes on the M3 and plan on taking it out with the new Cobra... Rumor is taken from one of the guys in charge of the mustang design. I believe I read it on the Car and Driver web page

I can tell you this much to the guy wanting to know if he should wait for it......If you got the dollars and if I WAS YOU... THEN I WOULD DEF WAIT... But I got a feeling this will be among one of the most outragesly sick mustangs to date, and im almost certain it will have a price tag to match... $40- 50,000 grand anyone... to rich for my blood....im going to be more than happy with my GT and as the money comes in, trust me I will have plenty of mods under the hood to put the cobra to bed..lol.. JUST MIGHT TAKE A FEW YEARS TO DO SO....but by then the new cobra would not be that old, and in the mean time im already having fun in my modified GT.....Good night all

ga01blkgt · Nov 30, 2004

OK here is where I think that Ford has a slight problem with the new Cobra. For the price range that it will more than likely be in 40K and above, it will have more PERFORMANCE competition (I magnify that comment because of the different types of cars available then) than it ever has. You will and currently have the C6 Vette, you will presumably have the new Skyline GTR and the new Supra, the GTO and upgraded Judge, presumably another new F body, Dodge Charger, Dodge Magnum SRT (425HP), presumably a new Turbo 350Z, as well as updated versions of the Evolution and STI and the new 400 HP V8 M3. Now I say presumbly on some of the cars because they may or may not be produced but giving the benefit of the doubt on them. Now, performance wise, they will either be in the HP realm of 400 or the 0-60 and 1/4 mile of the Cobra. (Evolution, STI and Turbo Z will have less HP but in the same performance ballpark) All others will have a minimum of 400 HP. For 40K, you will be looking at a different buyer demographic than the Cobra has today. No longer will average Joe's (I say that with all due respect since I am one) and more importantly, the under 30 years of age crowd, be able to just go and buy a Cobra in 2007. A more discerning consumer who wants more than just straight line acceleration is in that demographic. Example, I personally don't think the CTS-V Cadillac will be around more than 5 years because it is right in the range of an M3 BMW and even though it is on par performance wise with an M3, someone who is looking to spend that kind of money will 4 out of 5 times buy the M3 over the CTS-V. To sum it up, for 40K it BETTER be an all around performer and not just a straight line car, as well as have some nice amenities to go along with it. GM listened on the new C6 , will Ford on the new Cobra???

03 SVT VERT · Dec 1, 2004

Exactly, 400hp is not as impressive as it used to be, especially by 2007.

Lets count the 400-500 hp cars by 2007 that won't be crazy expensive:

1. GTO (400hp)
2. GTO Judge (500hp)
3. C6 Corvette (400hp)
4. C6 Z06 Corvette (500hp) (Too Expensive?)
5. M3 (400hp)
6. Nissan/Infiniti Skyline GTR (400hp) (Too Expensive?)
7. Dodge Charger (425hp)
8. Dodge Magnum SRT (425hp)
9. Chrysler 300C SRT-8 (425hp)
10. Chrysler "Firepower" (425hp) (Rumored)
10. Supra/4500GT (400hp) (Rumored)
11. Camaro/Chevelle (400hp) (Rumored)
12. 2006 Mitsubishi Eclipse (470hp) (Concept/Rumored production)

Cars that will be just as fast, faster, or almost as fast as those cars for about the same price or less:
1. Subaru WRX STi
2. Mitsubishi Lancer evo
3. Lotus Elise
4. Pontiac Solstice (with rumored larger motor)
5. Mitsubishi Langer evo MR
6. Mazda RX-7/ RX-8

And that is just what is known/rumored (off the top of my head), there may be even more. Lets face it, 400hp is not enough and every magazine/guy in the know/ and Shelby himself has said this will be a Cobra for the history books. I am betting it will be atleast 450hp (maybe state it as 430, but it will actually be around 450) and actually be able to handle, lets say it will handle like an M3, maybe like a base Vette. As to the suspension not hooking up, the Cobra IRS is a lot better then the GTO irs at drag racing (less wheel hop) and handles about the same, if not better there too. I'm sure they will improve on it (which is one of the big things on the to-do list when the '05 v6/GT stangs were designed) which will still put them ahead of their competition. Lets face it, for the Cobra to survive into 2007 it needs atleast 425hp, that is a given, to be succesfull it needs 450hp or more.

pyro_la · Dec 1, 2004

03 SVT VERT said:
Exactly, 400hp is not as impressive as it used to be, especially by 2007.

Lets count the 400-500 hp cars by 2007 that won't be crazy expensive:

1. GTO (400hp)
2. GTO Judge (500hp)
3. C6 Corvette (400hp)
4. C6 Z06 Corvette (500hp) (Too Expensive?)
5. M3 (400hp)
6. Nissan/Infiniti Skyline GTR (400hp) (Too Expensive?)
7. Dodge Charger (425hp)
8. Dodge Magnum SRT (425hp)
9. Chrysler 300C SRT-8 (425hp)
10. Chrysler "Firepower" (425hp) (Rumored)
10. Supra/4500GT (400hp) (Rumored)
11. Camaro/Chevelle (400hp) (Rumored)
12. 2006 Mitsubishi Eclipse (470hp) (Concept/Rumored production)

Cars that will be just as fast, faster, or almost as fast as those cars for about the same price or less:
1. Subaru WRX STi
2. Mitsubishi Lancer evo
3. Lotus Elise
4. Pontiac Solstice (with rumored larger motor)
5. Mitsubishi Langer evo MR
6. Mazda RX-7/ RX-8

And that is just what is known/rumored (off the top of my head), there may be even more. Lets face it, 400hp is not enough and every magazine/guy in the know/ and Shelby himself has said this will be a Cobra for the history books. I am betting it will be atleast 450hp (maybe state it as 430, but it will actually be around 450) and actually be able to handle, lets say it will handle like an M3, maybe like a base Vette. As to the suspension not hooking up, the Cobra IRS is a lot better then the GTO irs at drag racing (less wheel hop) and handles about the same, if not better there too. I'm sure they will improve on it (which is one of the big things on the to-do list when the '05 v6/GT stangs were designed) which will still put them ahead of their competition. Lets face it, for the Cobra to survive into 2007 it needs atleast 425hp, that is a given, to be succesfull it needs 450hp or more.

so like ive been sayin all along it will prob be pushin 500hp which would be mint!

blackonblack05 · Dec 1, 2004

OK #1. I think everyone (including myself) just expects Ford(cobra) to be less horsepower than the Z06. It is no secret that the corvette is one fast mother. Not until 2003 is when SVT finally did something about getting their A**es beat by General Motors and threw a supercharger on a somewhat bulletproof motor. Must you forget, that was there first REAL stab at general motors for giving us mustangers a comparible car in performance besides the S/E's that only compare to a Z28. Anyways...I believe SVT has turned a page on performance and finally understands that we Ford lovers need a comparible car in performance for General Motors top line-up(corvette or whatever it may be). I think the engine will be twin cams. I think it will be atleast 500hp, and I am positive I would pay an extra 10,000 dollars or however much it will cost for the performance boost.
Oh and the horsepower numbers are just going to go up as long as they can....until an outside factor causes it to stop like gas prices or emissions. (Think about the 70's).
Just my .02. I am just frustrated because I live in a "General Motors" city where everyone thinks GM is God. I just want to pull up in my 06/07 cobra(with 500 horse) next to whatever camaro or corvette and just laugh at them. I am confident SVT will deliver that car to me.

BlackMissile · Dec 1, 2004

Everyone is extrapolating that horsepower levels will always increase. History clearly shows this is not the case. Keep in mind all the current 400-500hp vehicles were developed when gasoline not so long ago was nearly half the current price. Future development has a tendency to be turned on its head by changing fuel prices.

What killed the muscle car era were fuel prices and tougher emissions standards. Guess what, both of those factors are back with a vengeance. There are new federally mandated emissions standards on tap for 2007, as well as more incentive for automobile makers to produce greater quantities of alternative fuel/hybrid vehicles. It becomes harder and harder for manufactures to meet emissions standards for 400hp+ vehicles, and more importantly it becomes less profitable (desirable) for them to do so.

What I am saying is enjoy it while it lasts because it may not last. There were plenty of young prospective oweners waiting for omnipresent 500hp models in 1968-9. Five years later they were lucky to find 300hp. In 8 years they couldn't buy 200hp.

Wsmatau · Dec 2, 2004

BlackMissile said:
What killed the muscle car era were fuel prices and tougher emissions standards. Guess what, both of those factors are back with a vengeance. There are new federally mandated emissions standards on tap for 2007, as well as more incentive for automobile makers to produce greater quantities of alternative fuel/hybrid vehicles. It becomes harder and harder for manufactures to meet emissions standards for 400hp+ vehicles, and more importantly it becomes less profitable (desirable) for them to do so.

Great post and very true. The most viable "rumors" I have heard parallel what XJeep hit on, that the Cobra is going to compete with the M3. That doesn't require 500hp, but it is going to require big jumps in handling and luxury. Ford has always pushed the Cobra as a "luxury" Mustang. That is why they put softer springs (that actually HURT performance) on the SN95s. I think Colleti has done a lot to help fix the Cobra image, but he is fighting for SVTs mere existance in Dearborne.
That said I do have my own opinions about what will be in the '07 Cobra, but mine are rooted in some supported facts that you can look up for yourselves instead of spouting the competitions numbers. If you go to www.whipplesuperchargers.com and read all of the info they mention that they are working on the '06 Lightning/Cobra. We all know the Lightning is dead, but I spoke to an employee that works there and pressed for answers on the Cobra. He said it would be a S/C 5.4, basically the same engine out of the GT but detuned and minus the heavy duty rods, etc. That is still rumor, but it sounds EXACTLY like something Ford would do to cut costs. As for HP numbers I would guess they would factory rate the car between 450-475 in order to keep from stepping on the toes of the people that paid six figures for the Ford GT. But we also all know what we could tweak out of a supercharged 5.4. There will be some seriously overpowered cars on the roads in the next few years. Good Luck at the stoplight.

GTP2GTO · Dec 2, 2004

CA Lightfoot said:
I agree, but how about this scenario:

-- SVT Cobra: naturally-aspirated 400hp, IRS, etc... blow the GTO into the weeds. I just wonder how Ford can get 400hp from a 5.4 when GM needs 6.0 for their 400hp LS2.

Well, I dont know about blowing the GTO into the weeds with only a 400HP Car. The 04 SC Cobra is running even with the 05 GTO's. And GM doesnt need 6.0 Liters to get 400 HP. I am sure the 400TQ helps too. Actually the number is underated anyways.
And by 2007 the GTO will be redesigned with supposedly even more HP and less weight. So we really shouldnt be comparing 2005 to 2007...

Also lets not forget price point. The cobra is rumored to be near the $50k mark. Putting it well over $15k more than a GTO and making it more Corvette territory.

Spanishfly · Dec 2, 2004

Listen guys, a lot of you are doing a lot of wishful thinking by 'hoping' the Cobra will include an engine out of a 150k dollar car. It's not going to happen..period. Think cheap, and the only way to do this is to include two of the very most mass produced Ford engines out. The 4.6 3V and the 5.4 3V.

Alright, so right now the 4.6 is in the Mustang GT, and there's rumors of specialty (Boss, Mach) Mustangs supposed to premier on the new platform. Then that's exactly what their going to do with these special models. The 4.6 will be tweaked for extra horses and put into these cars. I think somewhere around 350 for a Mach and Boss. Ford isn't going to dramatically increase horses on these cars like they did when the '03 Cobras debuted. Also Ford is known for doing the 'hand-me-down' power. So with that I could guess that the next refresh of the Mustang GT will have 320-350 horses, because this car is a mass produced car and so on.

If the government doesn't regulate car dealers for their extreme power levels for a semi-mass produced car I'm going to say that the next-gen Cobra will have 450-475 underrated horses. It will have 500 possibly more, but their not going to tell anyone that. Also think about the madness that went about when the 03 Cobra debuted, people went crazy with trying to get one. I believe the next Cobra will have a supercharged version of the 5.4 3V because SVT is going elite-performance.

Three things cars have in common when they are made by the 'elite-performance' part of the company. They are either supercharged, turbocharged, have large displacement, or have lots of cylinders. I really think that Ford isn't going to go the 4.6 route, or the 4.6 DOHC route since that engine has been retired, so they say. Another thing is I don't think they're going to deliver N/A, the 03-04 Cobra messed that up.

So it's a S/C 5.4L 3V with 450hp (500) and weigh 3450lbs, IMO

Mr_dcj2001 · Dec 3, 2004

I agree with the 450-475 range for the next Cobra. I do think Ford will make a 500hp Mustang model sometime in the future and probably in a very limited production model( R, BOSS, GT500, etc) just to equal the competition and for being able to claim a 500hp model for under 100k. I cannot wait to see what happens.

BTW.....In a few months, Saleen will have a 05 Mustang style out with 500 horses. http://www.saleen.com/2005_s281.htm

Mr_dcj2001 · Dec 3, 2004

Oops... Almost let this slide without saying an opinion. A 2006 Mitsubishi Eclipse production model with 470hp???

I'd like to see them pull that off. Maybe put two V6's side by side? What a joke.

http://www.acurainspired.com/forums/lofiversion/index.php/t3774.html
Based off the Galant?

sawman70 · Dec 3, 2004

Everything I have read points to a 32valve with close to or at 500HP. The displacement is up in the air. Most readings say the GT's twin screw on the curent 4.6 32valve. 450-500HP.

I wait.......................

RandyB · Dec 3, 2004

sawman70 said:
Everything I have read points to a 32valve with close to or at 500HP. The displacement is up in the air. Most readings say the GT's twin screw on the curent 4.6 32valve. 450-500HP.

I wait.......................

I think it will be some 3V variant.

sawman70 · Dec 3, 2004

We will all wait together then.

I don't care, if it has upwards of 500hp from the factory, I'm in.

Rumors have said $40,000.00 for a hard top but with M3 performance and handling.

RandyB · Dec 3, 2004

'07 Cobra vs. '03-'04 Cobra...

Wonder if we'll have any threads like this?

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