84 SVO: Any advantage to go with Mass Air Flow system instead Speed Density ?

mpcv2000 · Jun 19, 2007

1984 SVO: LA3 & 35Lbs inj. swap info needed. ( New Edited title )

My friend has a 84 SVO and after unpgrading a few parts , he's now running with 17PSI of boost but we think we are maxed out with the stock injectors , we are wondering what we should do ? Can we just swap for 30lbs injectors ? Someone told us to change the speed density system because there is not much to do with it.

The only way for us to get information about this is the web and I think here we should be able to get some advice. He owns the car for over 17 years , it's a long term project..

The boost controler is not installed yet , we want to make sure will have enough fuel before rising the boost.

On top of my head he has Ford Racing Pistons , freshly done head and Ford Racing camshaft ( don't know the spec tho ) . We'll really appreciate some help from you guys or contact person where we can good tips.

He wants to run 20 PSI , I don't think it is that much but on the other end I know nothing about the SVO's and turbo set up so this is why I'm asking you guys what you think.

AvalancheSVT · Jun 19, 2007

man i always had a special place in my heart for the SVO fox.

Red_LX · Jun 19, 2007

He has a Vane Air Meter system, not speed density. A VAM works kinda like a crude MAF sensor.

You could convert TO a speed density system with a standalone, and then you could run any injectors you wanted to.

I'm no expert on SVO's but I believe the car should have 30 lb injectors already. What color are the tops of the injectors? If they're green, you have 30 pounders.

An easy swap is to swap to a later model ECU (LA3), along with the big VAM, and brown top injectors (35 lb).

Go here: www.turboford.net

mpcv2000 · Jun 19, 2007

Red_LX said:
He has a Vane Air Meter system, not speed density.

Yeah my bad... I know he doesn't have the 30 lbs injectors for sure. It's a learning experince for us this project.

I'll go take a look at the link you gave me.

(&) · Jun 19, 2007

mpcv2000 said:
Yeah my bad... I know he doesn't have the 30 lbs injectors for sure. It's a learning experince for us this project.

Stock injectors for that car are 30lbs, and 35lbs for the '85.5/'86 SVOs. If you know they are not 30s, what are they?

Your question seems to have 2 unrelated parts: injectors, and air metering. Your injectors might be maxed out, but you'd have to tell us what the mods are before we can even guess. You probably don't need to switch to MAF or speed density yet.

mpcv2000 · Jun 19, 2007

I just called my friend and he said the injectors are blue so I'm guessing they are 24lbs..

Basicly the mods are :

-3" custom made exhaust .

-I'm guessing for the camshaft , for sure it's Ford racing but hopefully there is not tons of models , here's what I think it is : Ford Racing (PN# M-6250-A327) camshaft that features .420-inch lift and 274/282 degrees of advertised duration.

-Ford Racing SVO piston kit.

-Front mount intercooler.

-Blow-off valve

-Boost controller ( not installed yet ).

-Exhaust manifold has been change and turbo relocated ( kit was bought from a member here ) Stinger-Performance

I may be missing some stuff but it should be close to what listed above.

mpcv2000 · Jun 19, 2007

(&) said:
You probably don't need to switch to MAF or speed density yet.

I was saying that because I ask a friend of mine about the SVO ( he's a SCT Dealer ) and he suggested me to switch to MAF system . Like I said we just trying to get the best of his SVO without destroying anything.

I think we should put the car on the dyno with the A/F pluged in to get a base line to start with.

On the other side I'm pretty sure you guys know a lot more then us on the 84-86 SVO.

Keep all the suggestion comming I'll show this thread to my friend later this week ( he has no internet access )

(&) · Jun 19, 2007

Why would someone swap in lower capacity injectors? It seems like you would be having trouble with them if that were the case.

The car is still essentially stock, so I see no need to switch to MAF or do any software tuning, unless you want to upgrade to the stock '85.5/'86 electronics/injectors. I've never warmed up to the idea of a MAF anyway. MegaSquirt is a good option if you want to ditch the VAM.

I also think that some of the money could have been spent better, so I would do plenty of research before buying anything else. That cam is not all that impressive, and the header is probably not necessary yet (an E6 would work well until you're making big numbers). And what's the deal with the pistons?

Red_LX · Jun 19, 2007

I like my A237, but I wouldn't run it on a stock head.

mpcv2000 · Jun 19, 2007

(&) said:
Why would someone swap in lower capacity injectors? It seems like you would be having trouble with them if that were the case.

From my knowledge he bought the car like that , he's the 2nd owner and when he got the car is was bone stock.

(&) said:
The car is still essentially stock, so I see no need to switch to MAF or do any software tuning, unless you want to upgrade to the stock '85.5/'86 electronics/injectors.

He doesn't want to mess with that , we're only assuming. When he's floored the car gets lean .

(&) said:
I also think that some of the money could have been spent better, so I would do plenty of research before buying anything else.

He lost his mind..

(&) said:
That cam is not all that impressive,

Not sure if it is the cam he has in it , I know it's Ford Racing for a SVO , this has to be confirm by him later today.

(&) said:
and the header is probably not necessary yet

Can't tell you why he did that , I think he wanted to move the turbo ( I'm guessing on that one ) .

(&) said:
And what's the deal with the pistons?

He wanted some good piston for big boost down the road , pistons are in since 1999 or so..

fastmonkeywheel · Jun 19, 2007

I have essentially a stock 2.3L out of an 86 T-bird. I'm even running the PC1 computer. I'm running injectors from a 2.2L Turbo Dodge, mainly because I got them for free, at 55psi (the original operating pressure). Anyways I have my boost regulator set a 20psi and have no fueling issues. As soon as I start getting into the boost my A/F gauge goes just slightly rich.

I'm saying this because I'm pretty certain that these injectors are rated less than the SVO should have. How's fuel pressure at WOT? If fuel pressure is good and he's running 24lb injectors I say increase the fuel pressure, all those goodies and he still doesn't have an adjustable fuel pressure regulator?

mpcv2000 · Jun 21, 2007

My friend read the thread ( wednesday ) and he will add info later this week. All I know is the fuel pressure ( 95PSI ) .

fastmonkeywheel · Jun 21, 2007

That looks very much like a stock fuel pressure regulator, 95psi is way too high for stock. I don't recall the exact figures but I think it's around 35-45psi at idle with vacuum disconnected. Bad FPR?

mpcv2000 · Jun 21, 2007

This is why he has to jump in to add or correct the info I'm giving you or answer your questions. We have reached out what I knew about his car.

Stinger · Jun 23, 2007

All he needs to do "for now" is upgrade to the later 35lb injectors which will also require an 87-88 turbo coupe ecu. There is a bit of rewiring required to run that ecu, you can't just plug it in and go but it's pretty simple to do the wiring changes. At that point, he'll have the ability to make up to ~300rwhp before the ecu/injectors/vam are near their max out points.

Considering the parts installed (header, fmic, a237, etc.) you should be able to make it a very strong runner at 20+psi.

mpcv2000 · Jun 24, 2007

Cool.. I'm glad you jumped in , we ( he ) bought some parts from you and everything fit fine. I'll let him know about your post. Any idea where I can find a write up on the Wiring thing ?
Or even better any clue where I can get the parts ?

Sad note for today ( Thursday I should say ) We replace his Exh.Manifold gasket because he had a leak and after putting everything back together it is still leaking..

We think the exh manifold has a crack somewhere , we have to take it apart again...

Thanks again for the tip "stigner" I really appreciate it.

Stinger · Jun 25, 2007

A google search should turn up the wiring info, ebay has the ecu.

Anlushac11 · Jun 27, 2007

Is it just me or does a VAM look alot like the Predator Variable venturi carbs that came out in the 80's?

The idea was the sliding curved thingy (technical term) gives maximum velocity at all opening sizes to mazimize throttle response.

mpcv2000 · Jun 29, 2007

mpcv2000 said:
We think the exh manifold has a crack somewhere , we have to take it apart again...

Finally it was the gasket between the exhaust manifold and the Turbo that was shot..It will be replaced and we have a eye on a LA3 computer we should buy it early July.Slowly but surely we're working on this. Thanks guys for giving us a hand with you tips and knowledge..

mpcv2000 · Jul 3, 2007

Updates:
LA3 is on the way and the Brown 35Lbs injectors too.

I'm scrolling all over the web to find the info about the swap and looks like GT350 had something very interesting but the link is not working anymore.
Since I'm waiting for parts I'd like to do some reading before I start working on this. To be honest all I can find is stuff about Ford Ranger or none SVO mustang with simmilar swap. It's confusing me a bit.
Just to be sure all I have to do is swap something like 4 pins on the connector and I should be ok ?
I thought I read something about adding a ICT ( intake charge temperature sensor ) "what ever the right term is" to make my LA3 swap to work.
I went to Stinger web site but did not find the info I was looking for.
If one of you can direct me on a working link for this swap I will really appreciate it.

84 SVO: Any advantage to go with Mass Air Flow system instead Speed Density ?

mpcv2000

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AvalancheSVT

Red_LX

I’m not much help unless you’re looking for ****!

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