'99 Cobra engine replacement

[Jimmy King]

Well, it's been a few years since I've been here, apparently with a different username. Good to be back... sort of. I always liked this place. Unfortunately, what has driven me back is the news that the engine in my '99 Cobra is hosed.

I haven't gotten all of the details yet, but Ford says $6451 for a new motor. Any recommendations on a better route to go for getting it replaced? Other places to buy from? Anyone in the Richmond, Va area able to recommend a different place to get the work done? Anything I should have them do while the motor is being replaced anyway that only $100-$200?

This is all assuming I will have the work done, of course. I may get something else or just let the car sit for awhile since I've got my wife's Focus that I can drive to work.

 

[eliteJAE]

For that type of money you can get an 03/04 motor put together and go blown man

 

[32ValveRom]

^I agree

 

[joshjwc9]

Yeah, ^+1, but what happened to the stock motor? If the heads are still good, you can build a shortblock for the heads and get a nice ported Eaton put together for $4k to $5k or so installed and tuned...I am sure we have a couple guys in your area that can recommend a shop too.

 

[Jimmy King]

Yeah, I figured for that kind of money I could do better. I talked to Performance Auto here in Richmond yesterday, too. They are a Mustang-centric performance place. They're supposed to call and e-mail me with some quotes today.

Are there any concerns with tearing up the tranny, etc. doing something that significantly increases the power? It seems like the stock torque on these was awfully close to the max these trannies are rated for.

As to what happened, one of the rods is knocking like crazy.

 

[Jimmy King]

I've been doing some research. I need to call the ford guy back and verify, but I suspect he was talking about using one of the frpp Aluminator short blocks and the upper half of my motor at that $6500 price (and was also talking out his ass to try to make me feel like I was getting a deal).

He said they had knocked $2k off the price and I believe he said it was a salvage motor (I was a bit distracted that day, given my bad news). That falls right in line with the price difference between the long block and short block Aluminators. Overall not a bad motor, although I would like to get more power out of the box. They are based on the '03-'04 Cobra motor, but with an aluminum block and stronger internals, and of course higher compression for the naturally aspirated version that I'd be getting.

The price seems to be more or less in line with other places. Sean Hyland is asking $4500 for the Aluminator and right in the same price range for other 4.6L 4v short blocks.

For these signficantly more powerful, built motors you guys are talking about in that price range, are you assuming pulling the motor from a junkyard and building it up?

These MMR shortblocks are looking pretty nice, too. The thought of getting a 5.0 Stroker makes me feel funny in the pants. Would using all of the parts from my car not included with a shortblock work with that? The MMR Aluminum shotblock 5.0 Stroker is only a couple hundred bucks more than the stock Aluminator 4.6L shortblock.

 

[joshjwc9]

Not to be nosy, but what is your price range or budget?
If you like the stroker route, buying a prepped 4v shortblock from MMR is the best way and a big timesaver and cost saver because of the quick turnaround MMR has. Upgrade to their oil pump (they have an aluminum block option too), and they have some other recommendations too. Add your heads after they have been gone through (ported maybe?) and either a blower or your intake.

Your can also most definitely use your block, crank and bore over the block to get a couple ci's, add forged rods and pistons and put a blower on top of the rebuild for even cheaper I would guess...

What are your goals for the car in the long run too?

 

[Jimmy King]

Nothing nosy about those questions. They are definitely important in picking the right option.

Goals for the engine replacement itself are as follows, with 1 and 2 being more or less tied.
1) Inexpensive (relatively... it is an engine replacement, after all) - looking to be in the $6k to $8k range including labor (I have neither the knowledge nor tools to try this on my own), trying to keep as close to the $6k range as possible. I'd love to spend less, but that doesn't look terribly likely to happen.

2) Reliability. I can't afford to be replacing/rebuilding engines on a yearly basis. I'd love to get another 10 years out of this car.

3) More power. As long as I'm going to spend way more money on this car than I had been planning on, I might as well do some upgrades that I couldn't justify previously and make it more fun to drive.

Longer term, this is mostly a street car. It may see track use once or twice a year (and I've been saying that for years now and haven't made it happen). It's not driven daily, but it is driven at least 3 days/week. Currently that's just a commute to/from work which is only about 15 miles with very occasional longer trips. That could change, of course.

The MMR Aluminum 5.0L Stroker shortblock, possibly with the higher compression option (I'm assuming it's 11:1, but have e-mailed them to find out... that's safe on pump gas, right?) is looking really tempting as long as I can find a place I'm comfortable having do the work. It'll be a nice improvement over the stock motor power-wise, but nothing too ridiculous.

Is MMR reliable? For every forum post (across several forums) I see recommending them, it seems like I see one saying there are quality problems and/or customer service problems when something goes wrong. Of course, it's the internet, which usually means there's 100 people with no issues for every one reporting a problem. I have seen Livernois recommended over MMR a couple of places. They appear to have a similar product available in the same price range.

 

[Jimmy King]

What about buying the rotating assembly from MMR or Livernois and just rebuilding? The Ford dealership wanted to replace it, but I can see that, they probably don't do a whole lot of full engine rebuild type stuff. I also talked to Performance Autosport here in Richmond and they said that they have found rebuilding these motors once they start knocking badly to result in a much less reliable motor. The guys over at the svtperformance forums say there's no reason a rebuild shouldn't be just fine and I agree with them. If you replace all the parts that went bad and properly correct any damage to the cylinder walls and whatever caused it to go bad, I don't see why that wouldn't be the case, but I don't do this stuff every day.

 

[joshjwc9]

If you can salvage the parts (bascially your block and heads) clean them up, buy a rotating assembly and install everything with new hardware and gaskets, I don't see why a motor could save you money compared to Ford and make more power. I would just shop around and try to find another shop that is trustworthy enough to rebuild your motor. If you were to bring them all of the parts/gaskets/misc stuff, a shop probably wouldn't charge you much for the assembly, they probably will charge more for the removal and installation of the motor...

I would start pricing some things out after you find a shop that you like to do the work. Luckily for me there are at least 3 that I would trust in the immediate area...

 

[Jimmy King]

Yeah, there's a surprising lack of performance/engine builder type places here for a city this size, multiple tracks in town/within 45 minutes drive, etc. It's starting to look like Performance Autosport is the only game in town, so I'll probably give them another call now that I've had time to do some research, clear my head from the initial "oh, ****", etc.

 

[Jimmy King]

Talked to Performance Autosport again. Much more helpful this time and not so quick to jump to the "let's replace the whole motor" solution, so I'm having the car towed up there tomorrow. They're going to check to make sure Ford didn't jump the gun on that rod knock diagnosis, although that's probably what it is. Then we'll talk money and rebuild parts. Depending on what they say I'm leaning heavily towards a Livernois 298ci stroker kit for the rebuild and maybe a basic bolt on or two like pullies. Shorty headers are real tempting, but I probably won't do it unless I get one hell of a deal.