A new three-link by Lateral-Dynamics

[CochinoFilipino]

I see that Lateral-Dynamics finally got a website, www.lateral-dynamics.com . So I checked it out. Holy crap! Looks like they completed the design for their three-link for 65-73 Mustangs.

Awhile back the maker posted up their design for early camaros over on laterel-g.net. Someone started asking all the tech stuff (cc.com style) and they seemed to answer all the questions like they know their stuff.

Just thought I'd share since I've never seen anyone mention them over here. There may be one one or two big dollar guys looking for the good stuff. Then there's others like me that just like to be aware of whats out there.

Happy 4th

 

[rbohm]

RRS also has a three link suspension out for the early mustangs as well.

 

[85 Turbo Bird]

that looks rather nice...

 

[Bullitt]

good looking parts. i was kind of confused about why they required a custom housing until i saw the pics where the watts link mounts! that's a lot of fab work!

i wish they had an option for a spring loaded upper.... (not that i can afford any of the kits as they sit now though)

 

[70vert]

I think I'll still go with Evolution Motorsports' kit

Thanks for the info. I'm on the waiting (and waiting, and waiting, and waiting) list for the EvM Watt's link and 3-link system. I think I'll stay with EvM for a few reasons; if anybody has any feedback, let me know:

1. Cost and modularity. Full price should be under $3k, and the Watt's link to the axle does not have to be welded, nor does the entire unit. This lets me use my old rear axle setup until I can afford the dream setup. I can lay out $600 for the Watt's now, then the rest for the 3-link when they get it done, etc. That's all I can afford this summer . . .

2. Better packaging of the Watt's Link:

they swear you'll have no problem with over-the-axle exhaust systems, and I'm inclined to believe them with this design. Plus, it looks much more elegant than the Lateral Dynamics or the RRS version.

3. RRS system is not intended for convertibles, and dat's what I got.

4. Lateral-Dynamics requires pretty extensive modification to the rear of the floor pan, and it looks like it requires a custom rear seat . . . I'm not sure what the final EvM design will look like, but we'll see how they do it . . .

 

[stangonline]

Wow, I really like everything I see there...except..
$200 for custom length axle housings? I mean, don't they have to cut it anyways during fabrication - whats the issue making it a specified length? I could see $50 or so for special order paperwork, or something like that, but jeeez.

 

[CochinoFilipino]

4. Lateral-Dynamics requires pretty extensive modification to the rear of the floor pan, and it looks like it requires a custom rear seat . . . I'm not sure what the final EvM design will look like, but we'll see how they do it . . .

If I remember, They didn't want to sacrifice proper geometry for packaging.

Here's an old thread from laterel-g.net http://www.lateral-g.net/forums/showthread.php4?t=2180&highlight=mustang It has some good info in it if you can sort through the BS and drama (just read the posts by Mean 69).

 

[180 Out]

Looking at the Evo setup

they need to define what they mean by "no problem" with an over-the-axle exhaust. The upper lateral link is definitely going to interfere with any off-the-shelf over-the-axle tailpipe, and the diagonal bracing looks like it will interfere with a tailpipe running between the frame rail and the gas tank, as you can do with a Fays 2 Watts link. It looks like the tailpipe will have to make hard turn toward the center, then another hard turn back toward that frame/gas tank channel.

 

[stangonline]

The EvM kit was supposed to be done for a while now... I was actually a little surprised by how fast they initially said it would be completed....especially as a bolt-in kit...while from reading about the lateral dynamics part, it sounds like they have been working on the basic design for a long time and insist that welding it in is required..

On CC - there were a handful of people who liked the idea of a bolt in system, so that it could be removed later, if needed. I wonder if that is a a good idea. Sometimes you just have to bite the bullet... Yeah, it would be nice to have my cylinder heads held on by hood-pins too, but it's just not going to happen. It has always been my understanding that these types of systems had to be welded in.

I was previously looking at the griggs rear setup (still looking at the front), but this LD setup looks promising. I like the idea of buying it with the housing ready to go - even at the $200 charge for custom length tubes...ick. I wonder if the extra weight of the gear on the rear end hurts anything?

What I am after is something that will perform GREAT on the street. Generally, I would like to understand how it works, but not the the degree of being a suspension engineer. I just want it to work. I have a feeling that many others are in the same boat.

 

[70vert]

EvM "packaging", exhaust, bolting vs. welding, etc.

I should say up front that I absolutely plan on welding it in the end but would like to bolt it at first - with my OEM 302-2v, I don't think it's gonna tear anything apart back there.

I could live with having to dump the exhaust in front of the rear wheels, if I have to make that compromise. What I really want to avoid with either setup is having to cut out the floor pan under the rear seat and go with a custom rear seat. For my objectives, that's pretty much unacceptable. I am hoping that EvM's curved 3-link arm keeps it out of the way there, but I could be wrong - we'll see the final result.

Thanks for the link to Mean69's postings. I think they have a great product, and it may even perform better than whatever EvM finally comes out with (IF they come out with it ) I think EvM has some racing experience and a great reputation over on corner-carvers.com, so I'm willing to give them the benefit of the doubt and wait for their design . . . plus the cheaper price and modularity (read: doing it in stages) appeals to my wallet . . .

I'd love to hear a write-up of the first Lateral-Dynamics install, though.
:SNSign:

The EvM kit was supposed to be done for a while now... I was actually a little surprised by how fast they initially said it would be completed....especially as a bolt-in kit...while from reading about the lateral dynamics part, it sounds like they have been working on the basic design for a long time and insist that welding it in is required..

On CC - there were a handful of people who liked the idea of a bolt in system, so that it could be removed later, if needed. I wonder if that is a a good idea. Sometimes you just have to bite the bullet... Yeah, it would be nice to have my cylinder heads held on by hood-pins too, but it's just not going to happen. It has always been my understanding that these types of systems had to be welded in.

I was previously looking at the griggs rear setup (still looking at the front), but this LD setup looks promising. I like the idea of buying it with the housing ready to go - even at the $200 charge for custom length tubes...ick. I wonder if the extra weight of the gear on the rear end hurts anything?

What I am after is something that will perform GREAT on the street. Generally, I would like to understand how it works, but not the the degree of being a suspension engineer. I just want it to work. I have a feeling that many others are in the same boat.

 

[mtbdoc]

Yeah, I saw the interesting difference between your stock 302...and your TKO600 . Having a TKO600 sitting around myself [and realizing it will get torn up by the monster blown motor that is nearing completion], I said "hmmm...bet he's gonna crank up the ponies before he is done!".

I still plan on the EvM setup for my 2+2 [which will get the TKO600...the 'vert is going to get one of the MMR super TKO trannies] and haven't a clue what I will do for the front suspension. I am also a bit puzzled by the delay w/ EvM, but really won't be anywhere near dealing w/ that car for at least a year!

 

[stangonline]

Worth noting that both LD and Griggs require modifications to the rear floorpan...more towards the trunk though.

 

[Jameshar1]

I sent EvM an email about 2 1/2 weeks ago and they were hoping to have the watts links ready to ship in about 3 weeks. That isn't to say they will have it ready to ship in 3 weeks as I'm sure there could be more delays since this is a new product. Mike stated that they were still working on a 3-link and hoped to have that available by the end of summer. He could be giving optomistic estimates on time though.

No big deal to me since I will be lucky to have the front suspension done by the end of the year. =)

 

[70vert]

Thanks for that update . . .

even just the Watt's will help, I'd be happy to get a Watt's in ASAP - the car handles nice and tight, flat and predictably, but the rear end is all over the place, lots of unsettling of the rear end over rough spots in corners. Plus I'd like to see what the exhaust situation looks like with the Watt's installed . . . thanks for the update, I was thinking about bugging them again but I'll just wait a month.

 

[70vert]

EvM is shipping their watt's in 2 weeks or so

If anyone is interested. There is a thread on this and their 3-link on the forum, and I'll post my results with 1) just the watt's, and 2) watt's and 3-link, whenever I can afford the 3-link, hopefully late this year.

I think we should post our impressions of installation and performance of both of these units, with pics, so we can all make informed decisions on what to buy. :SNSign: Better yet, install both and give us your feedback!

 

[KiwiGT]

Thanks for the info. I'm on the waiting (and waiting, and waiting, and waiting) list for the EvM Watt's link and 3-link system. I think I'll stay with EvM for a few reasons; if anybody has any feedback, let me know:

1. Cost and modularity. Full price should be under $3k, and the Watt's link to the axle does not have to be welded, nor does the entire unit. This lets me use my old rear axle setup until I can afford the dream setup. I can lay out $600 for the Watt's now, then the rest for the 3-link when they get it done, etc. That's all I can afford this summer . . .

2. Better packaging of the Watt's Link:

they swear you'll have no problem with over-the-axle exhaust systems, and I'm inclined to believe them with this design. Plus, it looks much more elegant than the Lateral Dynamics or the RRS version.

3. RRS system is not intended for convertibles, and dat's what I got.

4. Lateral-Dynamics requires pretty extensive modification to the rear of the floor pan, and it looks like it requires a custom rear seat . . . I'm not sure what the final EvM design will look like, but we'll see how they do it . . .

70' Vert; can you explain please how the watts link to the axle is connected ?. It looks like those brackets can be connected to the diff housing by clamps, or can be welded to the diff housing ?

 

[70vert]

brackets/towers clamp to axle tube

Don't have the kit yet (2 weeks or so) but they clamp to the axle tube - they have two bolt kits, one for 2.75" axle tubes, one for 3". Steel brackets with heim joint one end and bushing the other, or aluminum with heim joints both ends. I went with the aluminum "Competition" 2 heim-joint model.

the whole affair basically causes the rear of the body to rotate around the center of the "football" in the middle of the Watt's as I understand it while still allowing for free suspension travel. If you have leaf springs, it lets the leafs focus on vertical suspension rather than also providing lateral stability. Having the leafs perform lateral roll or sway control induces some binding. I'm referring to the tendency of the body in a turn to go towards the outside of the turn while the axle remains in one place rather than rolling around a center axis.

With the rest of the 3-link installed, it's still the main thing keeping the body centered over the axle since a 3-link with out a Watt's does not have much inherent lateral stability

At least, this is my understanding - someone correct me if I'm wrong.

I don't see why you couldn't weld them. I am clamping them to an 8" and then going to a 9" later and simply getting longer bolts. Hmm, hard to weld aluminum to steel . . . maybe I'll have to switch brackets at that time? We'll see if there is any movement with the clamps, but there wasn't for 36 years with the leafs, so . . .

70' Vert; can you explain please how the watts link to the axle is connected ?. It looks like those brackets can be connected to the diff housing by clamps, or can be welded to the diff housing ?

 

[stangonline]

Is this thing done yet?

 

[samwe]

Why do they all have to use a watts link?
The rear end does not move much so the lateral movement is insignifigant.
My Explorer has a solid axle up front with lots of travel, and the lateral movement is not an issue.
(to clarify, I have swapped in a solid axle, and it is lifted, not stock at all...)

A panhard is simple, and works just fine.

 

[70vert]

re: "A panhard is simple, and works just fine" - this, from Evolution Motorsports' site:

"EvM Watts Link Advantages over Panhard Bars

Watts Link System travels through true vertical motion through full vehicle suspension displacement. A Panhard bar suspension travels on an arc defined by the length of the bar.

Rear roll center height is constant while cornering. Panhard bar rear roll center height will rise in one vehicle turning direction and fall in the opposite turning direction."

and this, posted by 180out recently - search for "panhard" http://www.popularhotrodding.com/tech/0604_rear_suspension_guide/

I feel more comfortable with the Watt's and can tolerate having to re-route an over-the-axle exhaust in a more confined space . . .