cable or hyd. clutch? what do you prefer?

Nosboss · Jan 1, 2009

Just like the title says. What type of clutch do you have and what do you like better? I am converting to a T5 and was looking at the options as far as the clutch goes. I have some skills and have no problem fabricating some stuff. I like the mustang steve setup for the cable. If you like hydraulic would you use the slave cylinder or would you go with the hyd. throwout bearing?

GT-350 69 · Jan 1, 2009

Hello,
I recently upgraded from my stock 351w to a Ford Racing 392 stroker. I never liked the feel or the sloppy linkage of the "Z" bar. I wanted a clean look under the hood, so I stayed away from a cable conversion. I was one of the many persons waiting for a hydraulic clutch kit from JMC motorsports. They shut down their shop and left me looking for other options. I wanted to keep it external, so if there were any problems or leaks,it would be easy to access it. I bought a CNC 7/8" hydraulic push slave and a 3/4" master for the firewall/pedal. It was about $150. for them. I fabricated this bracket and installed it on my Tremec 3550 to a Ford Racing king cobra clutch. I havent driven the car much yet, but the pedal is smooth works great so far.
Good luck with your project,
Tom

wicked93gs · Jan 1, 2009

I've never been a fan of hydraulic clutches....while they are easier to operate I am one for simplifying wherever possible....I like cable clutches simply for the fact that less can go wrong with them....a cable clutch will never spring a leak and leave you stranded....I will only use a hydraulic clutch when I have no other choice.....that being said....hydraulic clutches are cleaner and smoother(Hell, I refuse to upgrade to hydraulic in the neon too)

GT-350 69 · Jan 1, 2009

Forgot attachment...

BarnStang · Jan 1, 2009

A lot of people use the cable clutches. To be fair, the cables can break and leave you stranded too. Usually the sheath melts and the cable jams. If you have the right headers ( a whole nother discussion...) you won't have any problems with a cable at all and can last a long time.
Our shop has done a few hyd clutches. We did the Dazecars hyd clutch bracket and got the parts he avised from Speedway motors. Worked great. THe last one we did (since JMC left us all hanging....) was the McLeod kit with hyd TOB. Was royal B**** to get bled, but it finaly came around and works great. Note: Call McLeod with the depth from the face of the bell to the tines on the pressure plate. We needed two spacers nd had to use a floating TOB. We initially ordered a bolt in TOB, but the depth was too much and we had to order the floating one. McLeod tech was easy to reach and very helpful.

rbohm · Jan 1, 2009

wicked93gs said:
I've never been a fan of hydraulic clutches....while they are easier to operate I am one for simplifying wherever possible....I like cable clutches simply for the fact that less can go wrong with them....a cable clutch will never spring a leak and leave you stranded....I will only use a hydraulic clutch when I have no other choice.....that being said....hydraulic clutches are cleaner and smoother(Hell, I refuse to upgrade to hydraulic in the neon too)

cables also break. i had one break in my 80 pinto many years ago, but it didnt keep me from driving the car.

i prefer the hydraulic clutch over the cable, but both are very good setups when properly designed. the hydraulic system does allow for a bit more freedom of design than the cable does.

wicked93gs · Jan 1, 2009

this is true, cables do break sometimes....however I have always had more trouble out of hydraulic systems, just personal experience though(talking about a variety of cars, not mustangs in particular)

Edster · Jan 2, 2009

Z bar, cables break and hydraulics have leaks and reduce the pedal feel. I've been stranded by a cable.

Decurion · Jan 2, 2009

I would say it depends how you want to drive the car. If youre drag racing where you want the absolute quickest shifts possible (assuming you even use the clutch), you want a cable. Faster action than waiting for fluid to return through a small orifice. If you want a silky smooth clutch with a little less engagement feel, especially if youre trying to get around using an existing set of headers, go hydraulic. Unless you spend a bunch of money on upgrading an original Z-bar with bearings and heim joints, I wouldnt bother with it.

67rcks · Jan 2, 2009

I have recently finished cable clutch from 04GT and if I had to do it again I would go definitely with hydraulic. There is simply very limited space, especially if you have power brakes and headers with exhaust pipe going down, bending around pitman arm.

ron67fb · Jan 2, 2009

After reading about many different issues e.g. leaks, melted cables, improper clearance measurements before ordering, oddball brackets, wrong pedal feel, etc. I'm glad I stuck with the Z-bar. 14 years since my auto-to-manual swap and not a single problem with the bar itself, which was a used unit to begin with. Had to hammer an old generic set of headers at one point to clear the swing but that's it.

chris66dad · Jan 2, 2009

When you get the hydraulic clutch set up and bled properly, it is simple and maintance free. Make sure the SS hose is routed away from the header. We used the speedo cable to tie wrap it to.

bdepedro · Jan 2, 2009

I've been debating between a cable or hyd setup as well. My concern w/ the hyd system is I have an aftermarket power brake booster that I think will create a fit problem for the slave. I also have Heddman long tube headers that may create problems w/ a cable syst. I thought I read a thread where someone used the Modern Driveline cable w/ these headers and it worked. Anybody know?

wicked93gs · Jan 4, 2009

Just out of curiosity, couldnt you use a different clutch cable? maybe lokar makes one? if it was long enough I dont see any problems routing it around whatever headers you use....but then, my T5 swap is still in the process so perhaps there is something I am missing

http://www.maximummotorsports.com/store/images/drivetrn_clutch/MMCL-11.jpg

maximum motorsports sells this one...saying that it allows more room for header clearance...there may be others out there

Nosboss · Jan 4, 2009

Maybe someone that has actually run into the problem can chime in here. I think the issue is one of two things. Either the header tubes are to close and the cable doesn't have enough room to go in between them or the headers are occuping the same space that the cable needs down by the bellhousing. I am not for sure of those but it makes sense to me.

bdepedro · Jan 4, 2009

I'm not sure exactly what the fit issue is either, I just know that there can be problems w/ some long tube headers.

I'm not sure if Lokar makes a conversion cable but if they do, it's too expensive for my budget. Love their stuff but it's pricey.

I'm going to call Modern Driveline tomorrow and get the low-down on everythink I need for my conversion. I seem to get a different opinion from everyone I talk to.

Nosboss · Jan 4, 2009

bdepedro said:
I'm not sure exactly what the fit issue is either, I just know that there can be problems w/ some long tube headers.

I'm not sure if Lokar makes a conversion cable but if they do, it's too expensive for my budget. Love their stuff but it's pricey.

I'm going to call Modern Driveline tomorrow and get the low-down on everythink I need for my conversion. I seem to get a different opinion from everyone I talk to.

Post up what you find out so I can use the info...

bdepedro · Jan 5, 2009

latamud · Jan 6, 2009

I have used both on a T5 car and I like the Hydraulic best. I have never had an issue with the hydraulic. On the othe car, I go through about a cable a year, they add up.

bdepedro · Jan 6, 2009

Nosboss said:
Post up what you find out so I can use the info...

Talked w/ the guys at Modern Driveline today.

Told them what I had ('70 mustang w/ 289, 4 spd toploader and 9" rear) and also what parts for my conversion I already had (trans, late model bellhousing and clutch lever, clutch and pressure plate).

These are the additional parts they said I needed:
Clutch cable kit ($259) since I have an aftermarket brake booster it would make a hyd conversion difficult at best. They also said that the cable kit should work w/ any booster less than 10". In terms of headers, they said that the best way to tell is to bolt up the bellhousing to the engine and hold the clutch lever in place and make sure you have at least 6" from the lever before the cable needs to be bent to avoid headers, etc. They said that if it won't fit and I don't want to modify my headers then I can just keep the mechanical linkage as is.
Clutch lever cover ($48)
Block plate ($55) If not already on the bellhousing.
Crossmember ($149)
Rubber trans mount ($19). They said that if mine was recently replaced then it would be fine.
Speedo cable for automatic ($26) The toploader cable is too long since it attaches to the passenger side of the trans and the T-5 attaches to the driver's side.
Speedo gear ($9.50) Tell them what rear gears and tire diameter you run and they'll send the right gear.
Backup wire harness ($15)
Amsoil ATF fluid ($29.85)
Installation hardware ($30) Bellhousing and trans bolts.

Total $640+/-

They also told me I needed a fulcrum adapter if I use the cable clutch and late model lever but it wasn't on the itemization.

They were very helpful and I would definitely call them before ordering so you know exactly what you need and what to check for.

cable or hyd. clutch? what do you prefer?

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