Crown Vic Rear Discs

ultrastang · Sep 2, 2007

bnickel said:
http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Ford...ryZ33564QQssPageNameZWDVWQQrdZ1QQcmdZViewItem

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Slot...sPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem#ebayphotohosting

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/2-Re...ryZ33564QQrdZ1QQssPageNameZWD1VQQcmdZViewItem

http://www.used-police-cars.com/2003-police-interceptor.html

basically want you want is rotors for the police package car, from 95-up. i think that will require that you use the 95-rear discs but for the vented rotors, i'm going for that. Ultrastangs competitor (Vintage Venom) sell ready to go CV rear disc kits with the vented rotors as well.

i've also been considering swapping on the 12" front rotors at some point as well, but we'll just have to wait and see

I think the ventilated rear discs, for the Crown Vics, are an aftermarket offering, --unless those rotors come on the Crown Vics after 2002 (??). I have not seen the setup on a C-V later than 2002.

All C-V rear rotors from 1992-2002, whether for civilian cars or for police interceptors/taxis, are of a solid rotor design.

The only differences, I know of, between the '92-'95 and then the '96-'02 C-V police/taxi rear brakes vs. the civilian C-V rear brakes is the fact that the police/taxis have stainless steel caliper pistons and that they use semi-metallic pads. The civillian C-V rear brakes use regular pads and have phenolic caliper pistons --although the phenolic pistons can be swapped out for the stainless ones --they are the same calipers.

Helmantel · Sep 3, 2007

ultrastang said:
The Mk VII and Crown Vic rotors are the same diameter as the Granada front rotors. I've used the Mk VII rear brakes with Granada brakes on the front with no problems. The Crown Vic would probably be ok too if the rears are regulated down with a manually adjustable proportioning valve to balance out the bias. I don't know if there would be enough adjustment to regulate the much larger Cobra 11.65" rear rotors with Granada front brakes (??).

Just a FYI:

(theoretical) brake capacity is a combination of rotor diameter, piston area and pad friction coefficient.

Granadas use 2.60" front caliper pistons and 11" rotors: 2.6^2 * 11 = 74

MkVII rear brakes use 2.125" caliper pistons and 11.3" rotors: 2.125^2 * 11.3 = 51

Cobra rear brakes use 1.5" caliper pistons and 11.65" rotors: 2.125^2 * 11.65 = 26

(I used the rotor diameter in the calculation, but actually you should use the distance from the center of the pad to the axle center)

Granada-MkVII front/rear: 74/51 = 59%/41%
Granada-Cobra front/rear: 74/26 = 74%/26%

So, the Cobra brakes provide less braking power and would therefore need more line pressure.

bnickel · Sep 3, 2007

ultrastang said:
I think the ventilated rear discs, for the Crown Vics, are an aftermarket offering, --unless those rotors come on the Crown Vics after 2002 (??). I have not seen the setup on a C-V later than 2002.

All C-V rear rotors from 1992-2002, whether for civilian cars or for police interceptors/taxis, are of a solid rotor design.

The only differences, I know of, between the '92-'95 and then the '96-'02 C-V police/taxi rear brakes vs. the civilian C-V rear brakes is the fact that the police/taxis have stainless steel caliper pistons and that they use semi-metallic pads. The civillian C-V rear brakes use regular pads and have phenolic caliper pistons --although the phenolic pistons can be swapped out for the stainless ones --they are the same calipers.

i did some more checking and the vented rotors i found are indeed aftermarket however, the '03 and up CV's have a vented rotor from the factory, at least on the cop cars, not sure about the regular civi cars though.

i'm going to try and find an 03-up CV rear disc setup and see what the regular civi cars have and possib;y get a set for a future conversion. if you start making the adapter pieces i'm in for a set and if i do find an 03 setup i'll send you all the sritical dimensions so we can find out if one of the earlier kits will work with them.

ultrastang · Sep 3, 2007

bnickel said:
i did some more checking and the vented rotors i found are indeed aftermarket however, the '03 and up CV's have a vented rotor from the factory, at least on the cop cars, not sure about the regular civi cars though.

i'm going to try and find an 03-up CV rear disc setup and see what the regular civi cars have and possib;y get a set for a future conversion. if you start making the adapter pieces i'm in for a set and if i do find an 03 setup i'll send you all the sritical dimensions so we can find out if one of the earlier kits will work with them.

Awite. (that's southern, of course, for "all right")

bnickel · Sep 3, 2007

ultrastang said:
Awite. (that's southern, of course, for "all right")

uh-huh, that's Texan for yessir or just plain ol' yes. BTW, Baer apparently makes a vented rotor for the early models as well in the Decelarotor line.

Rusty67 · Sep 4, 2007

OMG, vented rear rotors for my crown vic setup. This is GREAT ! I've been waiting for this forever. I was actually going to bring the entire assembly down to my brake shop and test fit stuff until I found one that fits but I guess I don't have to now.

I've been waiting to install these rear brakes on my Mustang forever. Knowing me, I'll be waiting a lot longer before I get the chance to install them. Too many projects/hobbies/actual needs and not enough funding

If anyone is interested in having custom parking brake cables made I have found a place here in Southern California that makes custom parking brake cables. They are going to make me a set when I get around to it.

Helmantel · Sep 4, 2007

Vented rotors must be quite a bit wider. Can the calipers be spread far enough to fit them?

ultrastang · Sep 4, 2007

Helmantel said:
Vented rotors must be quite a bit wider. Can the calipers be spread far enough to fit them?

I would immagine the later C-V may be a lot like the SN95 rear brakes; On the SN95 Mustangs, you have a solid rotor design (V6/GT), and a ventilated design (Cobra), but the V6/GT & the Cobras use the very same Varga rear caliper.

I'm not sure if the 2003-up C-V calipers are identicle to the 2002-earlier C-V calipers, but if they are they may have thinner pads like the Cobras do compared to the V6/GT Mustangs, to accommodate the ventilated rotor design.

--The air gap between the Cobra rotor's friction surfaces is MUCH narrower when compared to that of the Mk VII's. The Crown Vic ventillated rotor is probably very similar in design to the (narrow) ventilated Cobra rotor.

Rusty67 · Sep 4, 2007

I'll tell you, with fresh pads in the calipers there is a TON of room for a thicker rotor if you completely compress the piston back in. I doubt it makes a difference.

88gt · Sep 4, 2007

In trying to better understand how all of this goes together, can you tell me the thicknesses of the drum brake backing plate and the C-V disc backing plate. I want to understand why the bearing retainer spacer is needed if you are replacing one backing plate for the other. I realize I may have just answered my own question, but, I don't have the C-V backing plates yet as I am studying all of this prior to gathering parts.

Thanks,
Jim

Rusty67 · Sep 4, 2007

It has to do with the length of the axle in relation to the position that the new backing plate wants everything to be mounted up on.

ultrastang · Sep 7, 2007

Rusty67 said:
OMG, vented rear rotors for my crown vic setup. This is GREAT ! I've been waiting for this forever. I was actually going to bring the entire assembly down to my brake shop and test fit stuff until I found one that fits but I guess I don't have to now.

I've been waiting to install these rear brakes on my Mustang forever. Knowing me, I'll be waiting a lot longer before I get the chance to install them. Too many projects/hobbies/actual needs and not enough funding

If anyone is interested in having custom parking brake cables made I have found a place here in Southern California that makes custom parking brake cables. They are going to make me a set when I get around to it.

I got to leave work right after lunch today, (that's always nice on a Friday ) and I did a little more checking on the Crown Vic rear rotors.

There are three different rear brake designs for the Crown Vics:

1. 1992-1995, 11.415" diameter soild rotor, .500" thick (nominal). http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/4784/1992crownvicreardisc114rl5.jpg

2. 1996-2002, 11.215" diameter solid rotor, .550" thick (nominal). http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/148/1996crownvicreardisc112jg2.jpg

3. 2003-present, 11.615" diameter ventilated, .750" thick (nominal). http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/9720/2003crownvicreardisc116hp5.jpg

These specs are for stock-configured rear rotors, and shows that the '2003-present C-V rear discs do come with vented rotors. However, being that the '03-up C-V rotors are fairly large in diameter 11.615" (nearly as big as the Cobra's 11.650" rear rotors), they would probably not interchange with the '92-'95 or '96-'2002 setups, due to the limitations of the C-V's caliper mounting brackets.

In order to run the (stock) '03-up C-V vented rear rotors, you would probably have to have all the brake mounting components from an '03-later C-V. --This still leaves a mystery of not knowing how thick the '03-up C-V caliper mounting brakets are, to know how thick the axle bearing spacers would have to be, and if the axle flange pattern on the '03-up Crown Vics is even the same as the '92-'02 models?

If there is a ventilated C-V rotor for the '92-'95/'96-'02 rear systems, it likely would have to be an aftermarket offering, since it would seem the stock '03-up rotor would be too large to fit inside the caliper mounting braket ears of the earlier models.

bnickel · Sep 7, 2007

ultrastang said:
I got to leave work right after lunch today, (that's always nice on a Friday ) and I did a little more checking on the Crown Vic rear rotors.

There are three different rear brake designs for the Crown Vics:

1. 1992-1995, 11.415" diameter soild rotor, .500" thick (nominal). http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/4784/1992crownvicreardisc114rl5.jpg

2. 1996-2002, 11.215" diameter solid rotor, .550" thick (nominal). http://img402.imageshack.us/img402/148/1996crownvicreardisc112jg2.jpg

3. 2003-present, 11.615" diameter ventilated, .750" thick (nominal). http://img410.imageshack.us/img410/9720/2003crownvicreardisc116hp5.jpg

These specs are for stock-configured rear rotors, and shows that the '2003-present C-V rear discs do come with vented rotors. However, being that the '03-up C-V rotors are fairly large in diameter 11.615" (nearly as big as the Cobra's 11.650" rear rotors), they would probably not interchange with the '92-'95 or '96-'2002 setups, due to the limitations of the C-V's caliper mounting brackets.

In order to run the (stock) '03-up C-V vented rear rotors, you would probably have to have all the brake mounting components from an '03-later C-V. --This still leaves a mystery of not knowing how thick the '03-up C-V caliper mounting brakets are, to know how thick the axle bearing spacers would have to be, and if the axle flange pattern on the '03-up Crown Vics is even the same as the '92-'02 models?

If there is a ventilated C-V rotor for the '92-'95/'96-'02 rear systems, it likely would have to be an aftermarket offering, since it would seem the stock '03-up rotor would be too large to fit inside the caliper mounting braket ears of the earlier models.

well they are aftermarket then i guess.

Gailahan · Sep 7, 2007

I'm looking for vented rear rotors for a 1992 Crown Vic that aren't slotted or drilled b/c that's all just a gimmic with no actual performance gain if anyone knows where they can be found. The drilled rotors actually crack under extreme conditions and the slotted ones are just for looks...

ultrastang · Sep 7, 2007

Gailahan said:
I'm looking for vented rear rotors for a 1992 Crown Vic that aren't slotted or drilled b/c that's all just a gimmic with no actual performance gain if anyone knows where they can be found. The drilled rotors actually crack under extreme conditions and the slotted ones are just for looks...

Check out the 13th picture down:
http://www2.partstrain.com/store/pr...e&subcategory=brake_disc&part_name=brake_disc

I guess you would just have to contact these people and ask is the rear rotor actually ventilated, or if that's just a generic rotor photo shown.

Rusty67 · Sep 7, 2007

Gailahan said:
I'm looking for vented rear rotors for a 1992 Crown Vic that aren't slotted or drilled b/c that's all just a gimmic with no actual performance gain if anyone knows where they can be found. The drilled rotors actually crack under extreme conditions and the slotted ones are just for looks...

That isn't entirely true. It depends on the type of pad you are running. Sloting and cross drilling both have some performance gains, and they have drastic gains when running an organic pad. I agree that a solid vented rotor is provably the way to go for a daily driver.

golf4283 · Sep 8, 2007

ultrastang said:
Check out the 13th picture down:
http://www2.partstrain.com/store/pr...e&subcategory=brake_disc&part_name=brake_disc

I guess you would just have to contact these people and ask is the rear rotor actually ventilated, or if that's just a generic rotor photo shown.

just looking at that rotor, it's a 4 lug rotor so its definitely a generic picture. I'm pretty sure that anything that is going to be ventilated is going to be aftermarket and not replacement. I too have a crown vic setup that I was gonna put on an 8 inch but have since bought a versailles 9 inch. it was too much of a hassle.

Not to steal the thread over here though but if anyone is looking for the setup with the spacers included hit me with a PM. There's a guy on ebay that sells these kits with all the spacers included to get it up and running and I bought a set and don't intend to use it now.

69gmachine · Sep 8, 2007

ratio411 said:
I don't see any copyright info on them.

The fact that they are on the web being passed around, makes them public domain, like it or not. Once on the web, always on the web. Kinda like the genie out of the bottle... no putting it back.

You clearly have no understanding of U.S. copyright law. The fact that it is published on the web does NOT make it public domain. The person who reprinted, copied, or otherwise posted someone else's copyrighted material without consent will remain liable if the owner of the copyright should decide to take legal action so long as the copyright is in effect. Also, regardless of whether the law suit is winable, the owner could choose to name Stangnet as a participant in the copyright violation.

My job requires that I take annual courses in Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Tradesecret law. My company also aggresively pursues copyright infringement and patent violations with a large team of nasty lawyers.

Do yourself and everyone else on Stangnet a favor and don't post something that you didn't create.

ultrastang · Sep 8, 2007

69gmachine said:
You clearly have no understanding of U.S. copyright law. The fact that it is published on the web does NOT make it public domain. The person who reprinted, copied, or otherwise posted someone else's copyrighted material without consent will remain liable if the owner of the copyright should decide to take legal action so long as the copyright is in effect. Also, regardless of whether the law suit is winable, the owner could choose to name Stangnet as a participant in the copyright violation.

My job requires that I take annual courses in Copyright, Patent, Trademark and Tradesecret law. My company also aggresively pursues copyright infringement and patent violations with a large team of nasty lawyers.

Do yourself and everyone else on Stangnet a favor and don't post something that you didn't create.

That's pretty much what I was saying 14 posts down on the 1st page of this thread.

The instant someone puts together any sort of page, --instructional, informational, etc., It is automatically the copyrighted property of the person that created it. If anyone one else takes that information/photos etc., and distributes it in any form (in this case the internet), they are putting themselves into a position of being sued by the original author/owner of those documents.

Every page on my website clearly states at the bottom that the text and photos on those pages are copyrighted and belong to me. Now, as far as a private individual goes, I have absolutely no problem them printing off information from my web pages for their own private use --i.e., if they wanted to print off the rear end third member information to take with them to a wrecking yard to use for decoding the information off a 3rd member tag for a particular rear end or gear ratio they'er looking for. --I have no problem with that.

On the other hand, if you are somebody selling Mustang/Ford/automotive components and you take my information and post on your own website (without prior permission, and without giving credit where the information came from), then I DO HAVE A PROBLEM WITH THAT! --and that has happened to me before by a professional company that builds custom 9-inch rear ends.

If it is your information and you don't mind sharing it with others, then that is your perogative, but something being posted on the internet does not automatically make it public domain, especially if that information is not posted by the person that authored it.

88gt · Sep 12, 2007

I'm begining to mock-up my C-V rear disc's and have found out that the center hole for the axle bearing to pass through is just small enough for the bearing to not clear. It appears that I will have to clearance the center hole slightly for it to work. In measuring, there's .050" difference.

It also looks as though I will need to use the C-V backing plate bolts/nuts as well.

---food for thought for those contemplating this swap---these are some things I've run across while in the mock-up stage. My rear disc's are from a 2000 model, others may differ...

Steve...thanks for the ideas on this swap, looks like it will work well.

Jim

Crown Vic Rear Discs

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