Distributor Won't Seat ?

Dougsters · Mar 17, 2017

My 66 C-code was recently rebuilt but not happy with Pertronix 3 so went back to stock Distributor with igniter module. Tried stabbing dizzy numerous times but a 1/2" short. Engine on top dead center as I pulled #1 plug etc. Oil pump hex 1/4" drive is 1/2 " below the (opening)casting. But since the bottom of distributor goes in 1" it would still engage a 1/2".Tried 1/4" nut driver to rotate shaft a few degrees but no luck .I tapped on end of shaft lightly and it sounds like it's seated in oil pump. Have had distributor in and out numerous times never had this B.S. Question is how far is your drive rod below opening? Or any suggestions thanks for any help in advance as might have to flat bed to shop.

horse sence · Mar 17, 2017

It is sometimes hard to get the oil pump shaft to line up ,put a socket on the front crank bolt and turn the crank while someone pushes down on the distributor and it will drop in ...Make sure the key is out of the ignition switch .

Dougsters · Mar 17, 2017

Thanks much for reply. I did run small rod along oil pump shaft and don't feel retaining clip! Talked engine builder today and he said clip could of slipped down. I thought star clip would synch up on shaft so hard to drop. I borrowed a modified distributor shaft with out gear but it won't seat either on hex drive. Think I'll give it some time off as my wife is ready to commit my to mental health facility.lol

horse sence said:
It is sometimes hard to get the oil pump shaft to line up ,put a socket on the front crank bolt and turn the crank while someone pushes down on the distributor and it will drop in ...Make sure the key is out of the ignition switch .

horse sence · Mar 17, 2017

I have had the drive key come out and drop to the side of the oil pump ,make sure it is in the pump or you will start it up with no oil pressure .

horse sence · Mar 17, 2017

If you have an old distributor you can pull the shaft out of it and use that to make sure the pump turns ,a socket can get stuck and come off the extension ,then you are just a little bit screwed .

Dougsters · Mar 17, 2017

horse sence said:
I have had the drive key come out and drop to the side of the oil pump ,make sure it is in the pump or you will start it up with no oil pressure .

So horse sence on a 289 would the oil pump drive shaft be 1/2" below the hole or is possible it's like you described above. Will try my bore scope to see if I can see below at pump. Tried my modified distributor shaft but would not seat will try over weekend .Thanks Much

horse sence · Mar 17, 2017

The shaft is below the hole at the bottom but i am not sure how far below ,if another shaft will not go in there may be something wrong .Can you see if it looks like it is in an angle or straight in the hole ?

horse sence · Mar 17, 2017

I had one pull out and drop back in before i could catch it ,it went of to the side of the hole in the pump and wedged in .I had to remove the timing cover to get it out .Some one had left the retaining clip off .

Dougsters · Mar 17, 2017

horse sence said:
The shaft is below the hole at the bottom but i am not sure how far below ,if another shaft will not go in there may be something wrong .Can you see if it looks like it is in an angle or straight in the hole ?

It's sitting at angle,l but can center it with nutdriver. .It could be at slight angle thus not in aligned with distributor female hex opening.tx

horse sence · Mar 18, 2017

Were you able to turn the shaft with the socket ,and feel the oil pump turning ? You may just have a bent shaft

Dougsters · Mar 18, 2017

horse sence said:
Were you able to turn the shaft with the socket ,and feel the oil pump turning ? You may just have a bent shaft

With me engine before rebuilt you could feel the pump turn.This rebuilt it won't rotate or let me say the drive moves but I don't feel like it's turning a lobe type oil pump. Have to see what my bore light can see. Builder says maybe star retainer dropped down!! I think they forgot to install .will let you know what I find. I'm paranoid to lift up on shaft as like you said could be sitting at slight angle. when I tap on top of rod it sounds seated against something!! Lol

Dougsters · Mar 19, 2017

horse sence said:
Were you able to turn the shaft with the socket ,and feel the oil pump turning ? You may just have a bent shaft

Well it's what you thought I used my bore scope(not the best Harbor freight) and saw shaft sitting 1/2" from pump hex hole to the right .Its sitting on what must be the pump housing or crank. Lighting was not the best but could see hex opening on pump .So if scope screen is showing it to the right is that right or is what your seeing reversed? Anyway what's next straw or hose on end and try to seat?Any tips? Thanks much.

horse sence · Mar 19, 2017

If you can get it into the pump you would be alright ,but ...if you ever pulled the distributor there is a very good chance it would come out again and could fall in the pan ...Ask me how i know this You may be able to remove the timing cover and see it the retainer is actually on the shaft and if it is ,slip the shaft in the pump and slide the retainer clip up the shaft ,not going to be fun what ever you do .

Dougsters · Mar 19, 2017

horse sence said:
If you can get it into the pump you would be alright ,but ...if you ever pulled the distributor there is a very good chance it would come out again and could fall in the pan ...Ask me how i know this You may be able to remove the timing cover and see it the retainer is actually on the shaft and if it is ,slip the shaft in the pump and slide the retainer clip up the shaft ,not going to be fun what ever you do .

Thanks for the idea,will think about which way to go. I really think builder left retainer off. Will give you update next week or check myself into Betty Ford clinic.

Dougsters · Mar 20, 2017

Dougsters said:
Thanks for the idea,will think about which way to go. I really think builder left retainer off. Will give you update next week or check myself into Betty Ford clinic.

Well with the help of my bore light and a plastic straw I put drive shaft back in oil pump hole!!! But in the stress of the moment I grabbed another 5"straw and the original straw dropped in the pan. So rotated pump big hand to confirm the stabbed in dizzy. Fired up and (psi normal)all is back to normal until next time.lol. So since the straw should float on oil surface and oil pump screen would block it. Should I drain oil and try to retrieve or wait till my next oil change in 200 miles.I cannot believe it flipped and dropped vertically in there. I feel great about resetting drive but now not wanting to over think straw would appreciate your advice horse since.tx

Dougsters · Mar 20, 2017

horse sence said:
If you can get it into the pump you would be alright ,but ...if you ever pulled the distributor there is a very good chance it would come out again and could fall in the pan ...Ask me how i know this You may be able to remove the timing cover and see it the retainer is actually on the shaft and if it is ,slip the shaft in the pump and slide the retainer clip up the shaft ,not going to be fun what ever you do .

See above post.tx

dennis112 · Mar 20, 2017

Dougsters said:
Well with the help of my bore light and a plastic straw I put drive shaft back in oil pump hole!!! But in the stress of the moment I grabbed another 5"straw and the original straw dropped in the pan. So rotated pump big hand to confirm the stabbed in dizzy. Fired up and (psi normal)all is back to normal until next time.lol. So since the straw should float on oil surface and oil pump screen would block it. Should I drain oil and try to retrieve or wait till my next oil change in 200 miles.I cannot believe it flipped and dropped vertically in there. I feel great about resetting drive but now not wanting to over think straw would appreciate your advice horse since.tx

I'd be concerned that the straw is going to get shredded by the rotating assembly and enough small pieces will block the oil pump screen or jam the close tolerance gears of the oil pump and possibly lock it up. The screen doesn't need to be completely blocked to cause damage.

I would suggest dropping the oil pan to remove the straw AND fix the oil pump drive so it will always stay in place. It can be done in 2-3 hours if you unbolt the idler arm from the frame. You would also need to remove the 2 cross member bolts (and maybe the starter) then its clear sailing. If you drain the oil the night before and leave it drip over night its not too messy.

Dougsters · Mar 20, 2017

dennis112 said:
I'd be concerned that the straw is going to get shredded by the rotating assembly and enough small pieces will block the oil pump screen or jam the close tolerance gears of the oil pump and possibly lock it up. The screen doesn't need to be completely blocked to cause damage.

I would suggest dropping the oil pan to remove the straw AND fix the oil pump drive so it will always stay in place. It can be done in 2-3 hours if you unbolt the idler arm from the frame. You would also need to remove the 2 cross member bolts (and maybe the starter) then its clear sailing. If you drain the oil the night before and leave it drip over night its not too messy.

Thanks for your response for sure will address the straw .Drained oil just in case I might get lucky.lol. No such luck but this big adventure was temporary for reseating oil drive shaft. Now I can drive it to shop as will have them handle removal. Dont have room to do so at home. I think if straw does get shredded on rotating assembly, it would take a while so will watch oil pressure.Its a weekender so not an emergency as not driving. Thanks again

zookeeper · Mar 23, 2017

I once dropped the oil pump drive into the pan and while it's probably not optimal, I simply rolled the dice, bought another shaft and left the first one on the pan. It stayed for about 5 years until I rebuilt the motor. My reasoning was, "where's it going to go?" It's not going to bounce up into the crank when it's in a puddle of oil unless I roll it over, at which point I've got bigger problems. As for the straw, ask anyone who's taken apart an original small block and found chunks of plastic from the timing set all over the pickup for the pump. Yet they seem to survive just fine...

horse sence · Mar 23, 2017

Not sure a straw would hurt anything but I would rather not have one in my oil pan

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