Drop in engine with headers on?

[nito88stang]

Is it a PITA to try and put the engine in with the headers on? It just seems much easier to just put the headers on while the engine is on the stand. Or is it easier to drop the engine in and then put the headers on?


thx

 

[Fastcat]

put the headers on the engine then install it, UNLESS you have longtubes

 

[00 Red SS]

with my long tubes i dropped them in the engine bay in place then dropped the motor and just had to bolt them up, pretty easy.

 

[nito88stang]

I just have shorties

 

[Michael Yount]

Bolt them on on the stand, then drop it in. Do yourself a favor - take a straight edge, and check the mounting flanges to see if they are flat/true. If they aren't, header leaks can be a pita to solve. A few bucks at the machine shop and they'll mill them flat/true and they'll seal right up the first time.

 

[nito88stang]

Bolt them on on the stand, then drop it in. Do yourself a favor - take a straight edge, and check the mounting flanges to see if they are flat/true. If they aren't, header leaks can be a pita to solve. A few bucks at the machine shop and they'll mill them flat/true and they'll seal right up the first time.

Well they're brand new headers, but i'll go ahead and check Michael. Thanks for the heads up.

 

[Michael Yount]

Most of the 'brand new' ones I've checked haven't been true! I guess there's a reason headers are generally so inexpensive - get it done with low cost, with high quality, or fast. You can have any two, but not all 3.

 

[nito88stang]

Do you mean to check each individual flange for flatness or that all the flanges are flat in relation to each other?

 

[TheUser]

I *think* he means to check and make sure the flange (metal piece the tubes are all mounted to that you bolt to the head) is flat all the way across. If it's not flat, as you know, it will have an exhaust leak when you mount it up. Maybe use a yard stick or something and put it across there real quick and make sure it's flat all the way across.

 

[Michael Yount]

Whether it's a single flange design, or individual flanges, use a straight edge (wooden yardstick isn't straight enough -- use a quality level or a carpenter's metal right angle) and lay it across the all four primary tubes where they bolt up to the head. The surface of the head where the exhaust ports are is perfectly flat. The surface of the header that you're bolting to that should be flat as well. Quite frequently - with single flange or individual flanges - you'll find a portion of the surface that's warped - several hundredths higher or lower than the rest. That's plenty enough to cause leaks depending on the gasket used. It's the main reason there are so many people out there chasing the magic gasket. If the surface were flat in the first place, gasket choice wouldn't be much of an issue.

 

[UMDSmith]

I had to laugh when I read the chasing the magic gasket line.

I'm half tempted to add that into my sig just for s**ts and giggles.

 

[04sleeper]

Really sounds like Mike has had a bad experience with this sort of thing. Making sure others don't have the same issue with their headers. I haven't had the fortune of having trouble with header leaks but I will keep this in mind if I ever do.
Thanks again Mike!

 

[Michael Yount]

Actually - the only leak I've ever had was due to a mis-aligned weld right around a bolt hole. I haven't had leaks because my dad and older brother taught me about checking the flange for true back in, oh, it might've been 1965 or so....

Chasing the Magic Gasket - wasn't that like a Frank Zapa album title or something?

 

[04sleeper]

Chasing the Magic Gasket - wasn't that like a Frank Zapa album title or something?

 

[Michael Yount]

The Ford Racing shorties on mine were flat as Kansas, but I had to 'massage' one to make it fit. Amazing what a 40 ton press will do even to a 1/4" stainless flange when you start trying to bend things. We couldn't re-straighten it any closer than about .03" - so for $20 my local machine shop just milled the surface flat. They didn't have to remove enough to make any difference in thickness/stability. I bought a set of FloTech block huggers off of Ebay for a good price that I'm gonna try to use so I can increase the size of my head pipes. They are brand new and have a single flange joining all the primaries - and both of them are .06-.08" from being true/flat. Amazing to me that ANY gasket could seal them. Problem is most people never check, and when they bolt that on, they're chasing leaks big time. Or stripping out aluminum heads by trying to tighten the header till it seals.