EFI supply question

66HertzClone · Nov 28, 2005

I have been trying to find different alternatives available to keep the fuel pump supplied with a constant supply of fuel. Since the original tank has no baffling this could become a problem when the tank gets low on fuel. A simple (dummy) method would be never let the tank get below half, but this would indeed become a pain in no time at all.

I came across this today, http://users.ev1.net/~gbuzek/index.htm

While it is not the neatest looking piece I have seen, installation seems to be very simple. I am a little concerned about keeping this full by having the returned fuel dumped in to it.

In the warmer weather the returned fuel from under the hood could probably get quiet warm if not even hot. I have heard of the potential for damage to some aftermarket pumps when the fuel gets too warm. Any opinions on this?

68rustang · Nov 28, 2005

Your link doesn't take you directly to the header tank you are talking about. I think you are meaning to show Glen's header tank. The tank is kept supplied by a low pressure pump between the header and main tanks. Quite a few guys are running this setup without any problems. If you are concerned with return line fuel temperatures use an aluminum hardline as the return line.

I am adding baffles and an in-tank pump to my 68 project for the short term. My long term solution is going to make a completely new tank with integral baffles and an in-tank pump.

bsedwebt70-5.0 · Nov 28, 2005

go to www.ronmorrisperformance.com and look at his stuff - you don't need fancy baffles to make it work - I did an EFI 5.0 conversion to my 70 mustang with the stock tank. Ron Morris sells a sending unit with a fuel return built in, a fuel pump bracket, fuel hoses and external electric fuel pump - all can be bought seperately if needed - works great and I can run the fuel down low.

fastaggie · Nov 29, 2005

I've been running Ron's fuel system for past 3 years with no problems. I put around 3,000 miles per year on her and she has never faltered except the one time I ran her dry. NO baffles on otherwise stock tank and it works fine. I have been extremely pleased plus the one time I had a question on my system Ron answered the phone and spent 15 minutes helping me work out the problem which turned out to be unrelated to any of his parts. Great guy.

reenmachine · Nov 29, 2005

Ron Morris has been a great resource for me for weird EFI fuel system stuff. He knows everything and will give you all the help you need to make your purchase work. Highly recommended!

FORCED2DV8 · Nov 29, 2005

I agree i have purchased rons stuff also, and It has worked exceptionally well, Havent had any problems.

LMan · Nov 29, 2005

All EFI engines have a return line to return excess fuel from the injector rails back to the tank. I don't know of any modern cars having a hot-fuel issue from this, but I am sure each design routes the return fuel slightly differently.

Tubo(2-bo) · Nov 29, 2005

I'm using Glen's headder tank on my EFI.
The EFI high pressure pump(I'm using a 250lph) puts out more fuel than the engine can use. The EFI system needs a constant fuel pressure, for the injectors to properly function(appx. 38psi.) as RPM varies, fuel volume need varies. Thus, the fuel system is designed to put out at all times, more fuel volume than can be consumed, to mantain pressure.
I plumbed my system, to use the old fuel feed line, to be the EFI return line. To the headder tank, then a return line from the headder tank, to the main fuel tank. There is probably enough low pressure pump out put to keep the headder tank full, the return line to the headder tank first, just works as a back up.
I agree, that a main fuel tank w/baffles is a better solution. However no one, up to this point, has developed, offered for sale, or published a how to I can reproduce. I'm not talking about a custom, fuel cell, or tank, read $$$$. Untill a better solution comes along, Glen's headder tank does a good job & works as advertised. The only complaint I have, is a noisy low pressure fuel pump, turn the key on & there is a toka-toka-toka, before the starter is engaged. Not a bad thing, & lets me know the fuel system is working. What I don't like, I can still hear it, after the engine is running. It also works as an audible low fuel warning, if the main fuel tank gets empty, the low pressure pump has nothing to pump, then it gets real noisy. Ya dont have to ask how I know.
This is the same answer, I posted, on VMF to 66Hertzclone's question there. As this isnt previously covered info here, I dont think reposting the anwer here will hurt.

reenmachine · Nov 29, 2005

LMan said:
All EFI engines have a return line to return excess fuel from the injector rails back to the tank. I don't know of any modern cars having a hot-fuel issue from this, but I am sure each design routes the return fuel slightly differently.

Actually, '99 and up mod motors (and others) have a returnless fuel system. There is a pressure sensor on one of the fuel rails and the computer controls the fuel pressure by basically varying the voltage to the pump, thus eliminating the need for a return line. I'm not saying this is better (harder on the pump, more electronics, greater complexity), just that it's out there.

The only time I've concerned myself with return fuel temperature is in real performance applications. Under track-type conditions, the fuel can pick up quite a bit of heat from the engine compartment, so I simply plumb the return to dump back into the fuel cell far from the pickup. I typically use a fuel cell with an internal pump mounted in a surge tank, but as previously mentioned this is pricey.

CochinoFilipino · Nov 30, 2005

I could understand the concern for the fuel getting to warm with the header tank system. With the return line dumping into the small header tank it is basically recycling the warmed fuel over and over. But since no one is having a problem it seems to be a non-issue. I'm thinking the return line is providing enough cooing.

Several people say that they are not using a header tank or baffles. Has anyone experienced problems without them?

red65 · Nov 30, 2005

I ran without a header tank for a few months, but had to be diligent about keeping the fuel tank more than about 3/8 full. Any less and hard corners or acceleration could make the engine burp as it starved for fuel for a fraction of a second. I finally installed a header tank when fuel sloshing cut short my day at the race track, even though I still had almost half a tank of gas - pretty frustrating! Not a hard thing to install - I made my own, but Glen's looks great, and lets me run the tank pretty much dry on the race track (worth about another 40 minutes of track time last time!)

EFI supply question

66HertzClone

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