F or B cam for my explorer motor

maverick0716 · Nov 1, 2005

I say the F303 is a little much for those heads.

tjm73 · Nov 2, 2005

I think the flow improvements that the P heads offer make them a better balenced head for intake to exhaust ratios. But not so much so that the B or F cam over the TF1 will make any appreciable difference. B or F cam will cost you $165 bucks. TF1 will cost $140.

And, for what it's worth, the TF heads (for which the TF cams were made) have very close to what is considered perfect intake to exhaust flow ratios. The TF cams still have slightly biased lifts and they work great with the well balenced TF head.

If you're doing things as low budget as possible, I fail to see why the TF1 is so summarily dismissed so easily.

Woodrow · Nov 2, 2005

stang2841 said:
better duration? its a split pattern favoring the exhaust side...

to each his own.. but I believe the TFS1 was designed stockheads / TFS heads in mind..

nvm I will go elsewhere for this opinion.

If you claim to know this much already why the hell did you ask in the first place? Use the search and you can see that 90% use the f cam over the b cam, but you prob need to upgrade your valve springs with that cam.
:worthlesa

Imo I would use the crane 2031, it works well witht he p heads

18mustangs · Nov 2, 2005

stang2841 said:
I asked between 2 cams and you brang up something completely different...

crapola You asked about being better for P heads, then you stipulate that the TFS cam that was offered (the cheaper, better HP, better gas mileage, better behaved cam with an equally agressive sound that met all your requirements except being an FMS cam) wasn't designed for P heads. As stated earlier neither was the B or F cam designed for P heads, so that means you're stuck with the stock explorer cam if you want a cam designed for those heads! Just take the advice of someone who has a B cam with worked over Ford iron heads and go with the TFS Stage 1. I'm switching as soon as possible to that cam. Perhaps next time you should call the thread "which is better, B303 or F303" and leave out the head question if you're just comparing those two cams.
Tim

18mustangs · Nov 2, 2005

stang2841 said:
better duration? its a split pattern favoring the exhaust side... to each his own.. but I believe the TFS1 was designed stockheads / TFS heads in mind.

You just showed how much research you've done...ZERO! Ford heads need help on the exhaust side which is why most good cams are split lift\split duration favoring the exhaust, or why some guys put 1.7s on the exhaust valves with 1.6s on the intake valves.

maverick0716 · Nov 2, 2005

stang2841 said:
the TFS cam is not designed AT ALL for P style heads...

thats why I didnt list it..

...yet you have the F303 in your list of two cams that aren't even the greatest to begin with......I have an idea, why don't you flip a coin and pick one of those two cams your so rock solid set on....you sure as hell don't want help from us.

87AODGT · Nov 2, 2005

I think the b cam would work alright with the P heads without the 1.7s, not the best cam for the job, but it would make decent power for the street

tjm73 · Nov 3, 2005

Cam specs:

TF1 - 112 Lobe Seperation
Int. Lift w/ 1.6:1 = .499"
Open -3 TDC
Close 38 BDC

Exh. Lift w/ 1.6:1 = .510"
Open -48 BDC
Close -4 TDC

B303/X303- 112 Lobe Seperation
Int. Lift w/ 1.6:1 = .480" - w/ 1.7:1 = .510" (X303 w/ 1.6:1 = .542")
Open -5 TDC
Close 39 BDC

Exh. Lift w/ 1.6:1 = .480" - w/ 1.7:1 = .510" (X303 w/ 1.6:1 = .542")
Open -49 BDC
Close -5 TDC

F303 - 114 Lobe Seperation
Int. Lift w/ 1.6:1 = .512"
Open -4 TDC
Close 42 BDC

Exh. Lift w/ 1.6:1 = .512"
Open -52 BDC
Close -6 TDC

The B303 and TF1 are almost the same camshaft. The only possible real difference is the ammount of lift and the shape of the lobes since the timing events are only different by a degree or two.

Also of note, I see that Summit has increased the price of the TF cams.

5.0ina66 · Nov 3, 2005

tjm73 said:
Because it's cheap and it works. I believe it's the cheapest roller cam you can buy, much less one that's worth a damn.

Amen!

To note: the LSA on the E303 is actually 110*, F303 LSA is 109*, B303 LSA is107*.

IMHO, I wouldn't go under 110* LSA on a typical street motor. LSA and duration kill or build lowend, especially torque.

I also would NEVER use a single pattern cam on an SBF UNLESS testing with that PARTICULAR combo demonstrated that a single pattern cam would be better suited for THAT combo.

I'd even run a split pattern cam on aftermarket heads. If you look at the flow numbers, aftermarket heads still flow significantly less on the exhaust, and therefore could also use the help of a split pattern cam.

The TFS 1 cam is the BEST cheap cam, and can beat some more expensive cams. FMS cams are, in general POSes. I'd never go near a E or B to save my arse!

Mr. Original Poster, you are full of crapola You ask us, then you tell us...WTF kind of question is that??? Either do WTF you want or keep asking other places 'till they tell you what you want to hear!

tjm73 · Nov 3, 2005

5.0ina66 said:
Amen!

To note: the LSA on the E303 is actually 110*, F303 LSA is 109*, B303 LSA is107*.

Advertised LSA is the lobe sep of the intake plus the lobe sep of the exhaust divided by 2. You're numbers are the lobe seps of just the intake side. The numbers I posted were the result of the industry standard formula above.

5.0ina66 · Nov 3, 2005

tjm73 said:
Advertised LSA is the lobe sep of the intake plus the lobe sep of the exhaust divided by 2. You're numbers are the lobe seps of just the intake side. The numbers I posted were the result of the industry standard formula above.

Innterrresting! The formula makes sense, but where did you get the numbers? Summit just says LSA = 112, and so on. FRPP doesn't say anything about the LSA, anywhere. So where did the numbers come from?
PS: Then I WAS quoting the advertised LSA, considering that Summit is a major advertiser. Unless you know something I don't?
PPS: Who'd you have to kill to get the valve event info?

tjm73 · Nov 3, 2005

5.0ina66 said:
Innterrresting! The formula makes sense, but where did you get the numbers? Summit just says LSA = 112, and so on. FRPP doesn't say anything about the LSA, anywhere. So where did the numbers come from?
PS: Then I WAS quoting the advertised LSA, considering that Summit is a major advertiser. Unless you know something I don't?
PPS: Who'd you have to kill to get the valve event info?

I got the timing events for the TF cam from the TF website ( http://www.trickflow.com/product/camsandvalvetrain/track_cams/track_camsspecs.asp ) and the FRPP timing events out of the FRPP catalog on page 80.

I don't always trust information given in a Summit catalog. I've seen it wrong too many times. I try to go to the source.

5.0ina66 · Nov 3, 2005

Must be a different FRPP catalog then...I looked high & low at the online PDF verison and found none of that. In taking a second look at the TFS catalog, I see all the info...musta missed theirs :o
PS: Yeah, the Summit catalog sucks

tjm73 · Nov 3, 2005

5.0ina66 said:
Must be a different FRPP catalog then...I looked high & low at the online PDF verison and found none of that.

Weird. Cause that's where I got the info.

18mustangs · Nov 3, 2005

tjm73 said:
Advertised LSA is the lobe sep of the intake plus the lobe sep of the exhaust divided by 2. You're numbers are the lobe seps of just the intake side. The numbers I posted were the result of the industry standard formula above.

:Word: The Bcam has an LSA of 107*\117* which is 112* overall.
Tim

orangecapri · Nov 3, 2005

I am running the tf1 cam in my gt40p headed motor and i love it. Before that I had a crane flat tappet with .512/.512 and around 234* duration. I love this trick flow cam alot more. The car pulls alot harder, is easier to drive, and the sound is so much more nastier even thought its smaller. I got mine for $80 new while searching around, but either way I was going to buy it anyways. I recommend it 100%! You will not be dissapointed

stang2841 · Nov 3, 2005

okay... nvm I found a used custom cam designed for the heads.. forget this whole thread...

I very much know the 5.0 motor and what it takes to match up a combo.. I just dislike the TFS1 cam for a few reasons... but to everybody here it was made my god himself..

.226/.232 @ .499/.499 at 111 lSA

look up on how a GT40p heads flow btw.

maverick0716 · Nov 3, 2005

Good luck with that cam, Guru of 5.0 motors.....hope it works well

8950HO · Nov 3, 2005

tjm73 said:
I would not put the Crane 1.7's on anything. Their cheap powdered metal pedestals crack regularly. They are JUNK!

I have the B303 with FRPP 1.72:1 rockers and those same pedestal stands. What I would do now is get the TF Stage 1 cam which is cheaper than either the B or F cam, makes more power than the B or F cam AND sounds as good or better than either the B or F cam. Then I'd take the difference for the cams purchase price and add it to the cost of the junky Crane Cobra rockers and add a little extra ( I know you are tryign to keep budget but this is nessacary to not deal with the sh-hitty powedered metal pedestals) and buy the Steeda 1.6:1 bolt down rockers.

Any proof to back this up???Re.Crane 1.7 roller rockers.

To date ,I`ve never heard of Crane 1.7`s "cracking",or being called junk.
They are rated to 500lbs open spring pressure.

mustangramair · Nov 3, 2005

stang2841 said:
okay... nvm I found a used custom cam designed for the heads.. forget this whole thread...

I very much know the 5.0 motor and what it takes to match up a combo.. I just dislike the TFS1 cam for a few reasons... but to everybody here it was made my god himself..

.226/.232 @ .499/.499 at 111 lSA

look up on how a GT40p heads flow btw.

Have fun with your combo, but for the record people who know a thing or two were trying to help you. I don't know why you post when you just want to fight and think you know everything. I wouldn't have had a problem with your last post if you were not a smartass and said god himself made the trick flow cam, for the record trick flow made the trick flow cam I know for myself i didn't know everything when i was 16, and i still don't know everything at 22, but whatever. SOOOO SORRY FOR TRYING TO HELP YOU!

F or B cam for my explorer motor

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