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Has anyone had problems with camshaft endplay???

  • Thread starter Thread starter Caitlmt
  • Start date Start date Jan 16, 2006
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Caitlmt

New Member
Oct 24, 2005
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Kailua, HI
Jan 16, 2006
#1
  • Jan 16, 2006
  • #1
I recently installed the trickflow trackheat kit on my 93 5.0. The first time i started her up the timing chain blasted through the timing chain cover and I bent 4 intake valves, metal was all in my oil pan, It was a disaster. I sent everything back to trick flow and this is what they said:

Chad,
After both visually inspecting & dimensionally checking everything that was
sent in, We have determined the reason for the failure to be insufficient
camshaft endplay. As you are well aware, Endplay is the ability of the
camshaft to move back & forth in the block. The minimum is .001", The
maximum is .007".

We are willing to repair the heads & sell you the required components at a
reduced price. For example:

Intake valves: normal cost $12.95 each, I will sell them to you at $8.50
each.

Head install gasket kit: normally goes for $90.95, Your cost would be
$64.95.

Timing Chain: normally goes for $63.39, Your cost is $50.00.

Camshaft: normally goes for $159.95, Your cost $115.00. (Your camshaft is
reusable but would require refacing the end of the camshaft to make it so.
We do not have the capability to do this operation in house, Sorry...)

If you want, You can use a standard double row timing chain, That is not a
problem at all. If you are interested in a standard double row chain, I can
sell you one at $25.00...

Please make sure your friend verifies the camshaft endplay in his block
before final assembly!...

Thanks,
Art Kakiou TFS Tech Advisor

Has anyone had to deal with this before? Please give me your input!!!
 
5

5-oh stang

Founding Member
Apr 30, 2002
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Jan 16, 2006
#2
  • Jan 16, 2006
  • #2
Sounds like to me that YOU forgot to install the camshaft trust plate!! Maybe you were in a hurry to hear that beast come to life????? Take your time and learn from your mistakes. Small errors can be costly! Hopefully that was what happened and you don't have anything else majorly wrong.. Sorry to hear the bad news
 
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Caitlmt

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Oct 24, 2005
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Jan 16, 2006
#3
  • Jan 16, 2006
  • #3
Thrust Plate

Oh no, the thrust plate was definately on. The only thing is that TF required me to countersink the screws into the thrust plate which might of weakened it???
 
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Caitlmt

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Oct 24, 2005
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Jan 16, 2006
#4
  • Jan 16, 2006
  • #4
Thats it

No one has anything else for me???
 

retro50

New Member
Jul 15, 2003
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Jan 16, 2006
#5
  • Jan 16, 2006
  • #5
Why would you countersink the screws in the Thrustplate? The screws clear the cam sprocket.The cam sprocket is off set. Did you install the cam sprocket backwards? If so this will move the chain forward. The bottom crank sprocket will slide forward too as this sprocket is a slip fit not a press fit.
 
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Caitlmt

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Oct 24, 2005
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Jan 16, 2006
#6
  • Jan 16, 2006
  • #6
Why???

In the H/C/I Kit I bought it cam with a new timing chain also and new allen head bolts for the thrust plate. And in the instructions I recieved it said to counter sink the allen head bolts into the thrust plate??? New style timing chain I guess......
 
5

5-oh stang

Founding Member
Apr 30, 2002
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Jan 17, 2006
#7
  • Jan 17, 2006
  • #7
Well when you pulled it down, was the cam thrust plate broken? Were the bolts that hold it on alright? Did the cam move forward any? Was the timing chaing top sproket still attached to the cam? We gotta figure this one out!
 

Rick 91GT

Mustang Master
Nov 29, 1999
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Jan 17, 2006
#8
  • Jan 17, 2006
  • #8
End play is important but I have never ran into an issue on a stock block. I also have never countersunk any bolts into the stock thrust plate, the stock thin headed bolts clear the timing chain if not you have issues somewhere else.
 
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Caitlmt

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Oct 24, 2005
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Jan 17, 2006
#9
  • Jan 17, 2006
  • #9
Ahhhhhhhh

Yep, the cam thrust plate was destroyed! One of the allenhead bolts that held it was completly broken off and the other was bent to the block. The cam diddnt seem to move foward when I had it all back apart. Timing chain was still attached to the cam but was in the process of coming off the sprocket.
 

vristang

15 Year Member
Mar 31, 2005
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Jan 17, 2006
#10
  • Jan 17, 2006
  • #10
I would love to see some pics of the broken thrust plate. If you can't post them, can you pm me?
If you have pics of the bolts in the block (as they were when you took things apart), I may be able to help see the problem.
This is fairly close to what I do for $.

I hope you have better luck with the next build.
It seems to me that TF has very good customer service. They are giving you a discount for parts damaged due to something other than their deffective parts. Pretty impressive. Most companies would replace the cam, and only if the cam was not properly fab'd.

jason
 

Rick 91GT

Mustang Master
Nov 29, 1999
9,692
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Jan 17, 2006
#11
  • Jan 17, 2006
  • #11
I'd like to see the pics to, since I am a engine builder I may be able to point out your issue as well.

Rick91GT@suscom.net

You got a hold of someone good at TFS, I have had less then stellar support from them in the past.
 

5.0Droptop

...all those nights we shared, and you're a dude??
Special Agent Mukity-Muck Whats in Charge Round Here
May 15, 2002
1,785
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Indiana
Jan 17, 2006
#12
  • Jan 17, 2006
  • #12
Sounds to me like you followed their instructions and it failed. I would be calling them back!
 

retro50

New Member
Jul 15, 2003
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Jan 17, 2006
#13
  • Jan 17, 2006
  • #13
For some reason I can't understand Trick Flow using allen bolts to hold on the thrustplate. Then telling you to countersink them. The stock thrustplate is very thin and by countersinking them you take the meat out of it. I'm Not familiar with the Trickflow stuff so you'll have to forgive me. I understand the reason to countersink the thrust plate. To get the bolts away from the cam sprocket but there isn't much to countersink. Did they tell you to grind down the head of the allenbolts too? The allenbolts usually have a thick head on them. It sounds like the cam sprocket hit the bolts while turning Therefore breaking one off and then bending the other one down. Take your time putting it back together. Good luck! As far as Trickflow doing anything for you.They probably feel they are giving you a good deal on the reduced cost of the parts. This is a no win situation for both parties involved. Atleast they are trying to work with you.
 
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Caitlmt

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Oct 24, 2005
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Jan 18, 2006
#14
  • Jan 18, 2006
  • #14
Posting Pics

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a307/Thechad808/IMG_1008.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a307/Thechad808/2ae62ee1.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a307/Thechad808/IMG_1010.jpg
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a307/Thechad808/IMG_1016.jpg
 

Black1987Stang

Active Member
Aug 22, 2004
1,422
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37
Jersey Shore
Jan 18, 2006
#15
  • Jan 18, 2006
  • #15
Caitlmt said:
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a307/Thechad808/IMG_1008.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a307/Thechad808/2ae62ee1.jpg

http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a307/Thechad808/IMG_1010.jpg
http://i14.photobucket.com/albums/a307/Thechad808/IMG_1016.jpg
Click to expand...



Damn Ive never seen that happen before, One thing I highly recommend is get that Fram off there before the next time u start her. My friend had bad experiences from them along with many others.
 
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Caitlmt

New Member
Oct 24, 2005
44
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Kailua, HI
Jan 18, 2006
#16
  • Jan 18, 2006
  • #16
Good news!!

TrickFlow has offered to:

Repair the heads at no cost.
Give me a standard double row timing chain.
Give me a complete Fel-Pro gasket set.
Give me a camshaft
and a free t-shirt

not too bad. Customer Service turned out to be damn good!
 

jaymac

New Member
Feb 18, 2004
995
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Northern Mass
Mar 22, 2006
#17
  • Mar 22, 2006
  • #17
how'd you manage to get from cheap to free??!?!
 

Modular2v

Founding Member
Jun 30, 2002
3,222
23
99
oklahoma
Mar 22, 2006
#18
  • Mar 22, 2006
  • #18
Caitlmt said:
TrickFlow has offered to:

Repair the heads at no cost.
Give me a standard double row timing chain.
Give me a complete Fel-Pro gasket set.
Give me a camshaft
and a free t-shirt

not too bad. Customer Service turned out to be damn good!
Click to expand...
you lucked out, what trick flow cam was this? Why would you ever dream of sinking the bolts?
 
S

Sicarius428

Active Member
Jan 6, 2004
2,085
5
49
Mar 22, 2006
#19
  • Mar 22, 2006
  • #19
That is really odd that they would use allen bolts. Allen bolts typically have to be taller to get more meat on the wrench then they suggest to countersink it to compensate for the added height.... how wierd. A grade 5 or 8 bolt should have done the job. I'm glad they are owning up for their mistake. Too bad they won't cover the rest of the engine damage.
Kevin
 

Realmongo

I prefer to be called "Evil Genius"
Founding Member
Oct 10, 2001
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Mar 22, 2006
#20
  • Mar 22, 2006
  • #20
I have never seen that happen before!

The only Ford engines I ever saw with countersunk thrust plate screws were the 221, 260, and early 289 engines (back in the 5 bolt bellhousing days).
 
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