junk quarter mile passes

mrmustangman357 · Jul 28, 2007

I went out to the strip last night, with great track conditions, and my 89 5.0 made a best pass of 14.69 at 95 mph! My 60 ft was 2.3 seconds. Where did the power go?

I know my 2.73 were holding me back, but the car felt weak. Here is my setup:
stock 5.0
B303 cam
gasket matched e7 heads and intake
68mm TB
K&N air filter
clutch quadrant and shifter
underdrive pullies
ford motorsports plug wires
ford motorsports stainless exhaust with cats
2.73 gears
here's some pics of the escapade:
http://bradley.facebook.com/album.php?aid=2046371&l=46c75&id=31404955

and thats it! My buddy's 87 hatch with speed density went 13.7 with a mildly slipping clutch and 2.73s. WTF? The car has a road race suspension, but I would think my trap speed would be much higher, along with a better ET. I was leaving at 2800 rpm with marginal wheelspin and shifting around 5000. I dialed 15 degrees in the distributor on premium before going. It felt like after 4000 rpm the power just levelled off. I recently tuned up the ignition. Where do you think I should start with disgnosing the engine?

Also, can I run 15 degrees of timing safely on the street when I dial the octane back to 89?

PJB · Jul 28, 2007

Thats faster than my car was last year.
For stock heads and intake its not too bad.

jtfairlane · Jul 28, 2007

that's not really an abnormal time for a mostly stock car like yours. The gears are hurting you (as far as the 1/4 goes), and you aren't really taking advantage of the B cam with stock heads and intake (gasket match or not...).

RsStanG1987 · Jul 28, 2007

with a b cam and ported heads you should be running low 14's high 13's.. Hell mob ran a 13.7 on street tires with 3:73s and a b cam no head work.. I ran a 13.9 on a speed density car with 3:55's and a shifter..

93gtmustang · Jul 28, 2007

With my old 5.0 motor I use to run consistant times of 14.4 - 14.6 ,depending on conditions. Ran a 14.2 best.
My motor had stock heads, Edelbrock 5.0 Performer Intake, Underdrive Pulley's, Elec. Fan,70mm throttle body, K&N Filter, the basics.
Timing 15 advanced.
Drag Radials.
3.73's

It think your times sound about right. I use to run 96 mph trap speed.
Are you using street tires? If so, drive around the water box and just stage the car. Heating up street tires actually makes them slippery and you'll spin of the line.
With 2.73's you can possibly launch at say 3500. Shift at 5500.
If your running 15 degrees of timing advanced run 93 octane. I alway did and never had a detonation problem.
Try what works best for you. You can most likely get into the lower 14's.

mrmustangman357 · Jul 28, 2007

i went to the local advance to get the car scanned for codes. it didnt have any hard codes, and i was only able to do key on engine off because the salesman ripped 2 wires out of the connector trying to take it off (he pulled b the wires! idiot). so for KOEO:
code 67 NDS or PNP switch, CKT open of A/C on for test (A/c was not on but it doesn't work)
code 33 EGR valve, no flow detected
code 96 fuel pump secondary circuit open
pcm to battery

What do these codes typically do? is there any effect on 1/4 mile time driveability, etc? It didn't throw any hard codes

mrmustangman357 · Jul 29, 2007

I noticed today that the 4 port vacuum connector that has the EGR valve and others was disconnected. Could this contribute to decreased performance?

BigHairyMonkey · Jul 29, 2007

i ran 13.9 w/ 3.73s, h-pipe, and flows

5spd GT · Jul 29, 2007

Your mph isn't that far off from what I would expect...you have stock gears with pullies and a cam. Those are about the only thing doing anything...

In a case like this, I would look at your mph, not e.t. That is based on traction and suspension...mph seems to stay more consistent.

Where did you get a 68mm TB?

Foxfan88 · Jul 29, 2007

it doesnt looks like you had tires at all. stock gears are worthless at the track. get a lower gear and get some tires, drop that 60' at least to a 2.0, practice some and get solid 1.8-1.9s, with the gears you will gain MPH, and with some practice. with just tires and gears you could kit high 13s with ease. the cam with stock gasket matched heads isnt matched to well. if you had better flowing heads or actually had the heads ported it would run harder. the TB does nothing at this point, the engine will only take the air it can get through the stock heads/intake. and a stock TB is more than enough for stock heads and intake. the exhaust isnt doing to much either, your stock heads and intake arent promoting any more airflow to utilize the bigger exhaust.

2 years ago i ran 13.90s at 97 with a stock engine, had gears, pullies, and exhaust pretty much. that was with only a 1.9 60' there was room to improve there.

on the gas stuff. i'd run 87 or 89 and advance timing until it feels best/ doesnt ping, buying the highest octane gas you can isnt smart. run the least octane gas you can without pining. higher octane gas is harder to burn and can decrease power

as for the timing, every engine is different. just play with until until it feels the best /doesnt ping thats where you want it. my car like timing for some reason, i run 16degrees base with 87 octane gas with not a lick of problems

do you happen to know the air temp that day and the altitude of the track, both of which can affect a car's performance greatly.

overall i dont think your down on power. get some tires and practice and you will be happy with the results.

Mustang5L5 · Jul 29, 2007

it should be much faster

my 1988 5.0 with an AOD and 2.73's went 14.7 @ 93MPH bone stock.
You should be low 14's to high 13's with your mods. That gearing sure isn't helping you. the B cam needs to be revved to make any power.

I hope you have upgraded springs on those e7's and not the stockers otherwise you might get some valve float at high rpms'. If not, the trick flow upgraded springs for stock e7's would be a good mod.

3.55's or 3.73's would make an improvement as well

93gtmustang · Jul 29, 2007

Originally Posted by Foxfan88
on the gas stuff. i'd run 87 or 89 and advance timing until it feels best/ doesnt ping, buying the highest octane gas you can isnt smart. run the least octane gas you can without pining. higher octane gas is harder to burn and can decrease power

as for the timing, every engine is different. just play with until until it feels the best /doesnt ping thats where you want it. my car like timing for some reason, i run 16degrees base with 87 octane gas with not a lick of problems

I would always use 93 octane when running advanced timing in the 14 to 16 range. Detonation is not a good thing. I just feel better not running on the edge of detonation. With 93 octane, I never had any pinging with my old motor at 15 or with my new motor. Just my opinion.

You are right about higher octane being harder to burn and decrease power.
Especially if your at the stock setting, 10 advanced. 87 is your best bet.

Foxfan88 · Jul 29, 2007

it also depends on the milage of the engine, if it has alot of carbon and gunk its more likely to knock, my engine has like 12k on it and it likes timing. it doesnt seem like its running on the edge. each car is different, you just have to find what works for your car.

mrmustangman357 · Jul 29, 2007

The humidity was pretty high at the track (likely 55-60 percent) , elevation 632 above sea level, and the ambient temps were sitting around 70 degrees. The track was very well prepped with VHT and I left best dumping the clutch at 2800 with modest wheelspin. My mph was 94.xx for all 8 passes I did! It did feel that the torque curve was heading off after 4000 rpm, but it has been like that since I got the car. The B cam was done by the previous owner, so I don't know what springs are in it, but I can tell you I don't think I got valve float. Would the EGR or codes cause me to miss my time? I just don't see how my mass air modified car ran almost .8 seconds slower than my buddys stock SD car with the same gears.
Here is the timeslip for best pass of the day. my r/t is horrible because it was a street race drags kinda thing, so they make the tree work like its a stoplight. no ambers just the green!

see anything out of place?

Mustang5L5 · Jul 29, 2007

The numbers look typical. I see the average 20MPH gain between the 1/8th and 1/4 MPH so i don't think your power is dropping off up top.

I just think your MPH is a little low. You should be a little quicker, up near 97-98MPH

bloopbloob · Jul 29, 2007

i'm running on 87 octane daily, with about 18* timing. dont know why its so high, but it is. i've only ever heard it ping once, and i was running at 20*, on a super hot day at about 4000-5000 rpms, so i dropped it 2*, and never had knock since.

NOmoreHONDA · Jul 30, 2007

dont feel bad. I just bought my fox and brougt to the track the next day. bone bone bone stock 273's and all. 15.2 at 90mph w/ 2.3 and 2.2 60 fts. Slowest car I have owned in 5 years, and I come from driving honda's. I think with tires and a little more seat time I could have gotten into the mid-high 14's. Drag racing this thing is a whole different animal than the front drivers I am used to.

i just put 3.55 gears in the other night, bought some second hand systemax intakes, holley throttle body, and ordered a catback mac system. We'll see how she goes then.

ps even though she is not the quickest I have owned she is definetly the most fun!

v8only · Jul 30, 2007

those times are good, and right on the money. If you drop your 60', it'll go down a few tenths.

there are alot of internet warriors here. Not pointing any fingers, of course. My first opinions were that a stock fox with modest bolt ons is an EASY mid 14 second car, and with decent bolt on's, 13, etc.

LOL, then I start going to the track, and see all the stock fox's, hitting mid to high 15's, Fox after fox, after fox, after fox. the ones with some decent bolt on's hit 14's.

There is a TON of factors involved in getting a good time slip. My buddy Tony is one of those mustang gods. He got a heavy 89 vert with a 243k stock longblock and bolt on's to hit mid 13's consistently, but he can do magic.

I've got a gt40p motor with a stock HO cam, 1.7 rr's, gears, and full bolt ons, and I JUST broke 14.9. Granted that is at elevation, in the heat, and a stock clogged 4 catted h pipe and a ****ty cam. That track is famous for being crap. my bro has the exact same comb as me, but with tires and a cam and more exhaust, and is hitting times closer to mid-high 13's (different track)

all I'm saying is racing isn't easy, don't go out and expect to blow a huge #.

mrmustangman357 · Jul 30, 2007

I'm thinking about either selling the car or seeing about going to the pick-a-part and finding 3.55s and an exploder top end for it, maybe along with the higher injectors and MAF, but I'll see where that leads. I was under the impression this car was a high 13 second car as is, but I was very surprised. what would the gt40 combo bring in for numbers?

Lyonmt · Jul 30, 2007

A key element is the driver. You can see, probably, a full second range inbetween a really good driver and a sucky driver. Practice, ask and learn.

Just my $.02 worth.

junk quarter mile passes

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