Loose front end, help me diagnose

DucatiRdr · Apr 14, 2008

My car is a 1988 with 17,800 original miles and until spring 2007 was in storage since 1992. Before putting it away I had installed polyurethane sway bar and end link bushings, Koni adjustable shocks/struts and FMS c-springs. Everything else is stock -K-member, LCAs, LCA bushings, etc and from what I can tell all are fine with no cracking or damage. I remember it always riding like a buckboard but was very sure footed. When I started driving it again last year the surefootedness was gone and the car was all over the road at highway speeds and the steering felt heavy with very little steering wheel return to center.

I had MM caster camber plates installed along with an alignment to MM's specs. The car is much better but the steering is still heavy and doesn't center well and at anything over 60ish the front feels loose and I am correcting my direction, especially if there is some wear on the road.

I jacked up the car (one side at a time) yesterday when I had 5 minutes and with my hands at 3 and 9 there was a little play on both wheels. With my hands at 12 and 6 there was even more play and I could see the strut on the driver's side move. On both wheels, I could see the rotor moving inside the caliper but the caliper didn't seem to move at all.

Does this sound like something familiar? If I have to replace ball joints and tie rod ends, are there improved parts?

allballsmustang · Apr 14, 2008

if you grab the wheel at 9 and 3 with the car jacked up and try to move it back and forth and you have play its your inner tie rods...as for replacing them its actually about the same price to buy the whole rack with the inners already on it... 75-100 max...also while your doing it replace the outters...get the moog brand there well worth the money... hope this helps

jim

DucatiRdr · Apr 14, 2008

Thanks Jim!

So would those just "go" on their own? I'm surprised there's even a problem with it since the mileage is so low.

What about the movement with the hands at 12 and 6? This is where there is the most play.

HISSIN50 · Apr 14, 2008

With pandemic movement like that, be careful with trying to diagnose things from vector movement. For instance, bad wheel bearings allow movement from any positioning of the hands. I'd want to inspect wheel bearings and put them back on to spec.

The strut moving is worrysome for sure. Is the top strut nut tight?

Check tie rod movement (visually) while moving the wheel. To check BJ's, you can check the wear indicators and do the pry-test with the corner jacked up.

In any case, time to give the front end a once over.

Good luck.

DucatiRdr · Apr 14, 2008

Hissin, thanks for the input! So do these things just wear out from sitting around? When the car rolls there isn't a bang or knock like if the bearing had a wear spot.

Could the lack of return to center and front wheel play be related?

HISSIN50 · Apr 14, 2008

DucatiRdr said:
Hissin, thanks for the input! So do these things just wear out from sitting around? When the car rolls there isn't a bang or knock like if the bearing had a wear spot.

Could the lack of return to center and front wheel play be related?

The bearings shouldn't have worn out but they might not have been put back on to spec (or there's an issue with the spindles). For wheel bearings one has to seat them, back 'em off and then retorque them. The spec is very loose and some folks dont have a wrench that reads that low. This can lead to error.

Your lack of return to center could be simply related to the alignment issues. Seems to me that your kingpin is going to be wandering with that loose strut.

DucatiRdr · Apr 14, 2008

Does the problem sound like rod ends or ball joints?

2000xp8 · Apr 15, 2008

Hissing is right, the centering problem could be your alignment. Also could be your rack.
IMO, if your rack is stock with that many miles on it, replace it before you get the alignment, might as well, and most racks you get new inners with.

When you get the alignment, see if the shop will set the caster to it's maximum (matching for both sides), that will eliminate most of the wandering on the highway.

DucatiRdr · Apr 15, 2008

2000xp8 said:
Hissing is right, the centering problem could be your alignment. Also could be your rack. IMO, if your rack is stock with that many miles on it, replace it before you get the alignment, might as well, and most racks you get new inners with.

What do you mean by "that many miles"? 17,800 original, no more.

2000xp8 said:
When you get the alignment, see if the shop will set the caster to it's maximum (matching for both sides), that will eliminate most of the wandering on the highway.

I think that was done already. I'm at 3.1 on the left and 3.3 on the right.

At this point I'm guessing the culprit is the wheel bearings. I'll pull and repack those tomorrow and hopefully that will do it.

2000xp8 · Apr 15, 2008

my bad, lol.
I though it was 178,000, not many guys here with cars under 20k.

I doubt the wheel bearings have anything to do with a centering issue.

HaynStang · Apr 15, 2008

The centering issue sounds like a rack/tie rod issue. Might as well just replace everything as it's cheaper to buy it all together. I had this issue with my car.

The wheels moving when you grab them sounds like loose wheel bearings... dealt with this on my car too. They can get pretty loose and cause the steering to wander and feel unsure well before they give any other signs, like making noise or vibration.

cevtv · Apr 15, 2008

HaynStang said:
The centering issue sounds like a rack/tie rod issue.

When I had that problem, it was ball joints........

DucatiRdr · Apr 16, 2008

I took the passenger side off down to the spindle today and reassembled everything, repacked the bearings, etc. and there was no appreciable difference in the play at the wheel. At this point I'm guessing it's the ball joints, but for the life of me I can't figure out how these would just go with under 18,000 on the car.

HISSIN50 · Apr 17, 2008

Did you happen to do a return to center test? If you have the tie rod disconnected, turn the wheel (the actual wheel/tire, not the steering wheel) by hand and see how the range of motion and resistance is.

12 and 6 play can be BJ's but the 3 and 9 should be wheel bearings or steering linkage). I'd narrow down the latter and deal with what's left.

mike93lx · Apr 17, 2008

did you replace the tires last year? The uneasiness on the highway could certainly be tire related.

Mustang5L5 · Apr 17, 2008

Stupid suggestion. Make sure the bolts for the strut to spindle are nice and tight

DucatiRdr · Apr 17, 2008

There seems to be a lot going on. I did replace the tires last year but that would have little to do with the wheel being loose.

If I grab the wheel at 12 and 6 and move it I can see the rotor moving inside the caliper but I can also see the lower end of the strut moving with the caliper.

With my hands at 9 and 3 there is also movement. I dunno...tomorrow I'm going to try Hissin's return to center test and see if I can't be more scientific with setting the wheel bearing preload but I'm guessing ball joints have a lot to do with things.

Are there any ball joints that are better than others? What about tie rod ends? Are there any of those that are better than others? Should I go for a bump-steer kit while I'm at it? BTW, the guys at MM told me a bump-steer kit was only required for cars with different K-members, but my tie rod ends are at a much different angle than my LCAs.

2000xp8 · Apr 18, 2008

I believe in 93 ford upgraded the ball joints.
If you buy new FMS control arms, they come with them installed if i remember correctly.

fiveohlxhatch · Apr 18, 2008

Sounds like the bearings as well as strut to spindle bolts may be loose. Further dissasembly and inspection should yield the culprit. GL!

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