LS1 forum folks droolin over 05 stang

shatner saves · Feb 11, 2004

The '05 focus actually looks ok.

Cobalt redesign? I haven't heard this.

GelatiCruiser · Feb 11, 2004

Me either....maybe they're going to try to make it look LESS like the Cavy and the GTO.

RealQuick · Feb 11, 2004

300hp for an 05 Stang GT is Pathetic!!!!!!!! You guys can package it and make it sound like it has other positives, but it comes down to performance. The GT is the red headed step child of the stangs, and thats how ford has been treating them. All the goodies go to the cobra and Mach 1. I feel like the 05 could be something special, but then I saw what motor they were using and I was disappointed. Its also funny how the stang GT guys always refer to the blown cobra as the ultimate car once people start talking about the GT's shortcomings. The corvetees wont have too much trouble with the mustangs, so dont get too cocky out there. I would like to see a pony car come back because the GTO is too sedanish for me.

Omegalock · Feb 11, 2004

Honestly both companies had beter start paying more attention to Dodge. Ahh well I'll be glad when Chevy steps up to the plate. They are the biggest auto manufacturer but it's a sad statement they are being beaten down left and right by the number 3 and the number 4 car makers in performance avenues.
I mean I can't believe Chevy is seriously gonna put out the Cobalt and have it be beaten by the SRT-4 before it's even off the assembly line. Step up dammit!

Omegalock · Feb 11, 2004

RealQuick said:
300hp for an 05 Stang GT is Pathetic!!!!!!!! You guys can package it and make it sound like it has other positives, but it comes down to performance. The GT is the red headed step child of the stangs, and thats how ford has been treating them. All the goodies go to the cobra and Mach 1. I feel like the 05 could be something special, but then I saw what motor they were using and I was disappointed. Its also funny how the stang GT guys always refer to the blown cobra as the ultimate car once people start talking about the GT's shortcomings. The corvetees wont have too much trouble with the mustangs, so dont get too cocky out there. I would like to see a pony car come back because the GT is too sedanish for me.

The 03 Cobra is dang near close to being the ultimate pony car. Ton of power...it eats boost for breakfast and craps out
insane amounts of power. Can be made hella fast for hella cheap. Sounds about right to me.
Positives about he 05 Stang...
It will be decently fast out the box.
It's got a modern chassis.
It looks good.
Has a decent interior.
Will likely handle very well.
All for about 25k....what else out there that's a V8 RWD platform that can boast that? Not a single one.

65conv50 · Feb 11, 2004

CatmanJJ said:
Blasphemy

GM proved that it's not all about power. They put an awesome engine in a cheap car and looked where it got them.

Cheap car???? Hardly!! I bought a Firebird Formula for several reasons after driving a Mustang (what I really wanted, as I LUV my '65 Mustang). The 'bird was considerably faster, more aerodynamic looking, MUCH better looking interior (looked like a higher level expensive car by comparison), and had a six-speed (but very hard to get, as GM only built about 1/3 the demand for 6-speeds - they were gone in April each year). Also the 'bird was much more practical after I sold my pickup, as I could fold down the seats and get an awesome amount of hauling done. It is also a pleasure to drive: low, solid, and massively quick. Also very quiet, except for that great 5.7L V8 exhaust rumble.

It also cost LESS than the Mustang. I suppose that is one reason GM quit advertising them and wouldn't make many - not enough profit. (I know, I know, the sticker was higher... but street price was less, and that is what gets into the wallet - not the sticker.)

Didn't even consider a Trans-Am, as they were much more expensive and slower than a Formula. Also an ugly snout and spoiler. Nor a Camaro - because when you get to the bottom line, they are the same as a Corvette: just a Chevrolet....

So, guys, you are all up about the upcoming Mustang - great! I hope it lives up to expectations, because with no competition (not really) they don't have a lot of incentive to improve. I'm hoping for technology improvements - maybe even styling improvements in the second iteration, but meanwhile, I'll take VERY good care of my '65 Mustang. Nothing comes close to its looks!!

mp67 · Feb 11, 2004

TrueBlueCajun said:
I think the Mustang had better everything over the Bow Ties except for that darn LS1 engine in the past and now.

I disagree. You still don't get a six speed standard in a GT or even as an option, yet LS1 had it since 93. I was pissed that I could not get disc brakes on my 90 GT, Z28 was years ahead on that front. And they had it all over the mustang in handleing. But camaros were always cheap in quality inside. Everything would start rattling and falling apart after just a year or two on that tight suspension. Plus, the style of the LS1 body was plain. Not very exciting. GM concentrated too much on performance and not enough on quality and selling base models in volume like Ford does. Their LS1 was a performer, but it was high $. Ford has always concentrated on bang for buck theory. They sell more that way to people who don't give a crap about performance, and still deliver a platform that is workable for aftermarket folks. In the end it came down to the mystiyqe of the first ever pony car having a more loyal following than GM.

mp67 · Feb 11, 2004

65conv50 said:
but meanwhile, I'll take VERY good care of my '65 Mustang. Nothing comes close to its looks!!

Except my 67 shelby clone, I agree with you, those lines on the early fastbacks are still timeless. So slippery, they look fast sitting still.

65conv50 · Feb 11, 2004

mp67 said:
Except my 67 shelby clone, I agree with you, those lines on the early fastbacks are still timeless. So slippery, they look fast sitting still.

I agree, but mine is even better - a convertible, wind and sun in the hair (OK, what little hair is left) and even slipperier!!! >chuckle< (67 Shelbys are tough, too!!!)

65conv50 · Feb 11, 2004

mp67 said:
In the end it came down to the mystiyqe of the first ever pony car having a more loyal following than GM.

That has a lot of truth to it. Plus the fact that GM stopped advertising them and would not make the options available people wanted. (Example - a dealer told me he could sell 4 manual transmission 'birds for each one GM would let him have!!) Ford is making the same mistake on the T-Bird, and look what happened to sales.

CatmanJJ · Feb 11, 2004

RealQuick said:
300hp for an 05 Stang GT is Pathetic!!!!!!!! You guys can package it and make it sound like it has other positives, but it comes down to performance.

I think you're wrong. Seems like anything can be made fast these days (with a little extra cash) but for arguments sake, for the price it's the most hp you can get from a new car on the market this year. Not everyone wants an all out drag car. Afterall, power is only one part of the equation along with exertior style, handling, and interior. With 300 hp and potential for much more with mods and a mere 25k pricetag for a car all new from the ground up is pretty amazin and I think this car will kick some major ass.

XtorT'r · Feb 11, 2004

shatner saves said:
The '05 focus actually looks ok.

Cobalt redesign? I haven't heard this.

No, No, No...... SVT focus redesign.

mp67 · Feb 11, 2004

65conv50 said:
That has a lot of truth to it. Plus the fact that GM stopped advertising them and would not make the options available people wanted. (Example - a dealer told me he could sell 4 manual transmission 'birds for each one GM would let him have!!) Ford is making the same mistake on the T-Bird, and look what happened to sales.

Yeah, thats the funny part. The auto tranny cost more but is less popular, at least with the performance minded.Thats probably why GM did that, to try to get more money out of people. Trying to force people to pay more for something they don't want is a mistake.

Edbert · Feb 11, 2004

65conv50 said:
I agree, but mine is even better - a convertible, wind and sun in the hair (OK, what little hair is left) and even slipperier!!! >chuckle< (67 Shelbys are tough, too!!!)

So, how about a 67 Shelby clone that IS a convertible?

...or will be once I'm done...

mp67 · Feb 11, 2004

CatmanJJ said:
I think you're wrong. Seems like anything can be made fast these days (with a little extra cash) but for arguments sake, for the price it's the most hp you can get from a new car on the market this year. Not everyone wants an all out drag car. Afterall, power is only one part of the equation along with exertior style, handling, and interior. With 300 hp and potential for much more with mods and a mere 25k pricetag for a car all new from the ground up is pretty amazin and I think this car will kick some major ass.

True. Sure has come a long way from 1974 when you could not even get a V8 in a mustang. And 1975 when they put one back in but peak hp was an amazing 140hp. Read "sarcasm" in amazing.

mp67 · Feb 11, 2004

Edbert said:
So, how about a 67 Shelby clone that IS a convertible?

...or will be once I'm done...

Thats cool. I'm glassing on a spoiler on mine right now too. My objective is to make it look like it was part of the mold for the front nose piece.

shatner saves · Feb 11, 2004

Yes, in it's time, the last f-body car represented an incredible value for the performance dollar. So incredible that the general had to stop building them because they weren't making nay money on them. You can argue fine points like "they should have promoted it more" all you like, but he simple fact is that if the profit margins and the volumes aren't there, all other points are moot.

Consider also that this wasn't like discontinuing a chevette or something. The F-body, like the mustang, is something of a halo car for GM. The fact that they decided to abandon it shows how bad the situation really was.

Z28x · Feb 11, 2004

mp67 said:
Yeah, thats the funny part. The auto tranny cost more but is less popular, at least with the performance minded.Thats probably why GM did that, to try to get more money out of people. Trying to force people to pay more for something they don't want is a mistake.

In the V8 Camaros the Auto tranny came standard and the 6 speed manual was a no cost option. In the Vette and GTO the Manual cost more than the auto. I remember Back when I bought my LS1 Camaro I had a hard time finding a Manual car, like 75% of them are automatics. On the plus side, the automatic Camaros are about dead even with the manuals, unlike the dog auto Mustangs, I'd would never buy a automatic SN95. Lets hope the '05 5 speed auto does a lot better.

mp67 said:
Their LS1 was a performer, but it was high $. Ford has always concentrated on bang for buck theory.

LS1 Camaros started at $23K, I wouldn't call that high $$. A lot of Camaros came loaded with options, (T-tops $1000, ground fx $1300, SS pkg $3000) THe Mustang GT has always been a good value but there have been a few higher cost Stangs, Cobra R $55K, '03-04 Cobra $35K+, 01 Cobra $32K.

mp67 said:
In the end it came down to the mystiyqe of the first ever pony car having a more loyal following than GM.

actually it came down to not having a RWD platform avalible.

65conv50 · Feb 11, 2004

Edbert said:
So, how about a 67 Shelby clone that IS a convertible?

...or will be once I'm done...

Mmmmmm..... nice!!

mp67 · Feb 11, 2004

Z28x said:
In the V8 Camaros the Auto tranny came standard and the 6 speed manual was a no cost option. In the Vette and GTO the Manual cost more than the auto. I remember Back when I bought my LS1 Camaro I had a hard time finding a Manual car, like 75% of them are automatics. On the plus side, the automatic Camaros are about dead even with the manuals, unlike the dog auto Mustangs, I'd would never buy a automatic SN95. Lets hope the '05 5 speed auto does a lot better.

The manual being a no cost option is a clever marketing scheme. It costs more to do an automatic 4spd overdrive tranny than a manual, even a six speed manual. Those converters alone are $$$. So they put in a no cost to you downgrade(as far as cost is concerned) cause they know the performance people see it as an upgrade.

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