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  • 1996 - 2004 SN95 Mustang -General/Talk-
  • SN95 4.6L Mustang Tech

Major Engine Problems

  • Thread starter Thread starter fmd28
  • Start date Start date Dec 1, 2006

fmd28

New Member
Jul 7, 2005
31
0
0
Las Vegas, NV
Dec 1, 2006
#1
  • Dec 1, 2006
  • #1
Well here is a little history before the Nice Juicy E-mail. Well it started when I changed cylinder heads to to Patroit Stage II's. Within 2 months the right Cam gear parted it self from the Cam. Hense the cam desimating the Intake and exhaust Valves. So I was told that we need to replace the Gear adn the intake and exhaust valves . . . or so I thought. Anways, I ask the mechanic to give me an update and here is the answer he gave me: (JUICY PART)

For starters when I got your engine broke down I discovered that you had holes in two of your pistons. I had to make the decision to replace them. While replacing them I found that your rod and main bearings are severely damaged and grooved down to the aluminum part of the bearing along with other internal engine damage due to when you accidentally ran the motor without oil. The crank shaft is also grooved badly. I was unable to fix the problems with the bearings or the crank due to lack of funds. I finally got the motor back together started it and for the first two minutes it made lots of knocking noises then got quiet. After about 30-40 minutes the motor started knocking again, just as I went to shut it off it stopped knocking. After about 10 more minutes it started knocking again and started running real rough. It smelled very lean out of the tail pipes, I shut the vehicle off and went to check the program that was currently installed in the PCM. It was running on the factory tune. I plugged in the SCT, and proceeded to program the PCM, just then the SCT programmer did like it was supposed to and stored the factory tune in the SCT module and went to write the new custom tune to the PCM, just then the SCT programmer crapped out. It has erased the factory tune out of your PCM and is unable to install a new tune. So basically the PCM has no tune at all and is unable to even start the vehicle because the SCT programmer crapped out which seems to be a common problem. So now, we basically have a Mustang GT that makes knocking noises when it runs but currently can't run because the factory PCM has no tune. I have to replace the pistons as they needed to be replaced, the bearings on both of those journals, and the necessary gaskets to perform the repair. ( I had to lift the Engine to do this) Because of this I did not install the Torque converter, and currently can not sell/install the MAF and injectors because that money went to the extra repair needed for the engine.

Clearification to the Oil thingy. When we installed the New Valve covers to the Patriot heads and using the flimsy gaskets provided apparently the pressure was to great and the gaskets allowed oil to seep out and when we cougth it there was about a qurt of oil left in the engine.

Well now based on the above reply what am I looking at to get my GT running again. BTW I was having him change the stall convertor to a 3600 stall.

Personnally, I think A Whole new engine is required but hopefully just a entire engine retro fit.

Well any replies would be nice.
 
D

Disturbed One

New Member
Jun 26, 2005
191
0
0
Dec 1, 2006
#2
  • Dec 1, 2006
  • #2
not sure what your looking for a reply about... but from the looks of it I'd say your in order for a whole new motor and different person to install it. I know how one thing can lead to another but basically what he listed is you need a new motor to go in and be done with it rather then spending all this money on remaching parts that might work if they can.

So are you being charged twice for new pistons and the labor to remove and replace them?? Is this a reputable shop cause from the looks of it I'd be asking for some kind of lube.
 
J

jimfitzgerald

New Member
Apr 11, 2001
6,672
0
0
Dec 1, 2006
#3
  • Dec 1, 2006
  • #3
If that was my car, I would send a roll-back and get it the hell out of there. Sounds like you may need an entire longblock.
 

the98stang

Active Member
Aug 12, 2005
2,408
0
47
Clovis, CA
Dec 1, 2006
#4
  • Dec 1, 2006
  • #4
OMFG that mechanic sounds like an IDIOT. He's trying to fix things that don't even need attention. And on top of that, he ruined your PCM with the "defective" Xcal which seems to be "a common problem". OH HELL NO!

Your going to need a brand new engine man. Find a reputable modular shop, and have them drop in a new engine. I would recommend a MMR900 or VT engine if money permits.
 

Kurgan

Founding Member
Jan 31, 2001
3,028
1
58
Palm Beach Gardens, FL
Dec 1, 2006
#5
  • Dec 1, 2006
  • #5
Were you using adjustable cam gears?
 

mity2

I like Pro3 and all I got was this crappy CT.
Jul 24, 2003
2,872
3
48
StateCollege PA
Dec 2, 2006
#6
  • Dec 2, 2006
  • #6
Patriot head still having an issue huh?
 
P

Pennywise2

Banned
May 16, 2006
1,379
1
0
Dec 2, 2006
#7
  • Dec 2, 2006
  • #7
mity2 said:
Patriot head still having an issue huh?
Click to expand...
That's not surprizing Mity I never heard of a company that
got so,many complaints and have so, many faulty products
before in my life. I know Patroit cylinder heads will never be
going on my car avoid them at all costs.
 

ADRENLN

Active Member
Apr 16, 2003
2,342
3
49
NJ
Dec 2, 2006
#8
  • Dec 2, 2006
  • #8
i dont even know what to say to this...i would be having a stroke and my blood pressure would be through the roof , id be so mad. im sure you are. anyway, yea its gonna be tough to use that engine after this bone keeps running it while its knocking on the wrong tune.
 

fmd28

New Member
Jul 7, 2005
31
0
0
Las Vegas, NV
Dec 3, 2006
#9
  • Dec 3, 2006
  • #9
Well hopefully I be able to get the auto shiipped from this Rock I live on as a disabled Auto. Well I need to due some research as to when the GT does get it back to Mainland USA how to transport it to my home in Southern Nevada and find a Mustang shop around there that will help me with procuring a new engine. As to the new engine anyone know of any companies that sell good engine replacements, besides junkyards. Well hopefully in a couple weeks the GT will be in route to Mainland US and then be able to get her repaired.

Anyways, If anyone can help me find a good mustang shop in Southern Nevada or San Diego area i'd greatly appreciate it.
 

hotrodredneck

New Member
Jul 28, 2004
200
0
0
Newport News Va
Dec 3, 2006
#10
  • Dec 3, 2006
  • #10
well parts of what he said are true....the 4.6 is built with very small clearances, and no cam bearings at all....when they get starved for oil, kiss it goodbye...now as far as the the SCT tuner...I call BS...I know hundreds of people using them with no Problems whatsover from dozens of deifferent tuners. Get her back to the mainland and get a new long block from a respectable builder like MPH or something.
 

Mike97gt

it doe snot
Founding Member
Jan 26, 1999
10,633
7
89
the people's republic of massachusetts
Dec 3, 2006
#11
  • Dec 3, 2006
  • #11
What caused the cam gear to seperate from the cam? that seems like the only part in there that I can point too and say "yep thats tech error"

after he took off the heads he saw the pistons were damaged from PTV right?

So he goes and replaces them and sees the bearings were damaged ( thats common after PTW) no surprise there..

Trying to save a motor that suffered severe PTV is risky, personally i would have told the customer this before I did any work after I saw the holes in the pistons and had them sign a wavier because I would have recomended a full rebuild or a new long block at that point.

As far as the programming issue.. I have never had that happen in the few trimes I used a SCT.. but I have had that happen to me programing at work with the WDS... I had to do a blank path program to restore the PCM..

Most common cause of that is the battery going dead during programing..
 

tomustang

Psychotic Member
Founding Member
Jun 8, 2000
3,434
2
78
McLean Hospital
Dec 3, 2006
#12
  • Dec 3, 2006
  • #12
svttech76 said:
So he goes and replaces them and sees the bearings were damaged ( thats common after PTW) no surprise there..
Click to expand...
It's he couldn't have replaced the 2 pistons without replacing all of them and alll new bearings, since in point he would have replaced everything, never just two
 

Mike97gt

it doe snot
Founding Member
Jan 26, 1999
10,633
7
89
the people's republic of massachusetts
Dec 3, 2006
#13
  • Dec 3, 2006
  • #13
tomustang said:
It's he couldn't have replaced the 2 pistons without replacing all of them and alll new bearings, since in point he would have replaced everything, never just two
Click to expand...

I agree this entire motor should have been rebuilt.. but it is posible to remove and replace two pistons without removing the crank..

I think he tried to replace the two damaged pistons and the two damaged rod bearings.. I bet the main bearings are also damaged. Hell even if the crank was removed you can reuse the bearings.. I would not do that myself but you could if you wanted too.

BTW.. If there is only damage to one piston or rod Ford will not allow us to replace everything.. We are told to remove that one piston/rod and replace the rod bearing for that cylinder and the damaged part ONLY. I have seen this before under warrenty.. Ford will bounce the claim if we replace one damaged and 7 good pistons.
 

fmd28

New Member
Jul 7, 2005
31
0
0
Las Vegas, NV
Nov 11, 2007
#14
  • Nov 11, 2007
  • #14
Well I got it to a real mustang shop and spending about 1k to have the engine Inspected and hopefully either have the engine rebuilt or start looking for a hole new Mod 4.6 engine.

Worse case is a whole new 4.6 engine. . . maybe or should I find an engine that will suit my needs. Cobra/mach engine?? Any ways anyone know any engine dealers that I can compare and decide?
 

the98stang

Active Member
Aug 12, 2005
2,408
0
47
Clovis, CA
Nov 11, 2007
#15
  • Nov 11, 2007
  • #15
fmd28 said:
Well I got it to a real mustang shop and spending about 1k to have the engine Inspected and hopefully either have the engine rebuilt or start looking for a hole new Mod 4.6 engine.

Worse case is a whole new 4.6 engine. . . maybe or should I find an engine that will suit my needs. Cobra/mach engine?? Any ways anyone know any engine dealers that I can compare and decide?
Click to expand...

Dude I would would just buy a long block from MMR or VT engines. Do it right the first time and don't look back. Patriot heads are sh1t anyway.
 

mustang50v8

Member
Feb 4, 2003
548
3
18
847 Chicago Burbs
Nov 11, 2007
#16
  • Nov 11, 2007
  • #16
fmd28 said:
Worse case is a whole new 4.6 engine. . . maybe or should I find an engine that will suit my needs. Cobra/mach engine?? Any ways anyone know any engine dealers that I can compare and decide?
Click to expand...

mach engines are pretty expensive
http://tinyurl.com/3bcrv5
 

fmd28

New Member
Jul 7, 2005
31
0
0
Las Vegas, NV
Nov 11, 2007
#17
  • Nov 11, 2007
  • #17
OK where do I find the MMR or VT longblocks? doing an internet search is annoying.
 

blkhorse

Founding Member
Oct 30, 1999
345
1
18
Nov 11, 2007
#18
  • Nov 11, 2007
  • #18
you can only get vt"s from them..vtengines.com..I think it's the same for mmr..modularmustangracing .com
 
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