Mass air to Speed Density?

Haus · Aug 20, 2010

you should disconnect the vacuum hose from the map sensor and plug the line going to the Intake.

Leave the Map sensor connected and dont cap off the port on the sensor.

JenkinsBS · Aug 20, 2010

Haus said:
you should disconnect the vacuum hose from the map sensor and plug the line going to the Intake.

Leave the Map sensor connected and dont cap off the port on the sensor.

Thank you. I will be trying that today before i drop the money for spark plugs. I appreciate it.

JenkinsBS · Aug 20, 2010

JenkinsBS said:
Thank you. I will be trying that today before i drop the money for spark plugs. I appreciate it.

Ok, so just tried removing the vaccum line from the intake that goes to the MAP, plugged it, left the vaccum line going into the sensor open, the car started, but wont hold an idle... this mean anything?

Mustang5L5 · Aug 20, 2010

Does it idle low and just stall out? What if you give it gas. Will it run.

The sensor needs to stay with the port open to atmosphere pressure on a maf car.

Seems like we really need to start from absolutely scratch here. Did the guy run the codes with both the engine off and the engine running?

Can you possibly take pics of your engine bay? Just random shots up close at all them wiring and vacuum lines.

Also, double check the firing order....and make sure all the injectors are plugged into the harness. There are two injectors where the pigtails come out in the same spot. Might be worth a shot to swap them and see how the car runs. I think it's the two middle cylinders on pass side.

JenkinsBS · Aug 20, 2010

It seems that if i gave it gas, it would keep running, however i set off the car alarm on the car next to me when i tried to start it 2 times... so ill be trying after work when i move my car.

If it will keep running if i give it gas, what would be my next step...

i can definatly take pics of the bay once i get home of all the "problem" areas.

He did run it with car on and off, plus we retarded the timing a bit, it was at 16, dropped it to 10... im taking the car back to him today to replace the fuel filter, and im thinking twice about the spark plugs being replaced today, 1 thing at a time i guess.

Ill check firing order and look at those 2 injectors after im off work and have my haynes in front of me.

JenkinsBS · Aug 20, 2010

here are some pics of the engine bay (dont mind the string, its only temporary till my mount stand comes in)

Injectors

Random silicone in the firewall (dont know what for)

MAP sensor

MAF (string only temp)

Random thing on my smog pump i think

JenkinsBS · Aug 21, 2010

so, after looking at the first injector picture, i saw color on the end of the injector, and it was red! i asked my room mate to tell me what color he thought they were, and he said "red".

So this means that i still have my 30# injectors installed, which are brand new (but they look awfly grimey). I bought the stock 19# MAF, which i know now was a waste of money, so i now will pick up a MAF calibrated for the 30# ers, but im still stuck on the MAP sensor issue.

If i keep the MAP sensor open to air, but plug the hose coming from the intake, and it wont hold an idle, how do i fix that?

Im for sure getting a new fuel filter, but the rails and regulator are still stock. Should i upgrade those, or just the regulator to make it run better?

Mustang5L5 · Aug 21, 2010

Those don't look red to me, but you can see them better.

Personally, I don't think you need red 30# injectors. Buy a set of used 19s and out those on.

30s with a stock maf would def cause issues if that is the case. I would wait til you put 19s or a 30# maf on there first before analyzing the map/bap sensor issue. It needs to be left open on a mass air car.

JenkinsBS · Aug 21, 2010

I didnt think they were red either, but my room mate and neighbor both say red... so im going try and pull one out later, clean it up and take a good look.

agreed, i really dont need 30's anymore, the original plan was to turbo the car, but yea... maybe some other time.

If they are indeed red, Im thinking of ordering up a new C&L meter for the 30s, cheaper than getting a new set of injectors. And im always iffy about getting used equipment, so going that route would be cheaper.

Haus · Aug 21, 2010

those injectors are not red. they are white/off white at the fuel injector connector. the red you see is probably the fuel injector wire harness. they look like an auto store replacement type injector like SMP or BWD

you need to find out exactly what size they are instead of throwing money that may not fix your problem or make things worse.

Haus · Aug 21, 2010

another thing I noticed. Is your smog pump hooked up?? are you running converters or an off road Hpipe??

JenkinsBS · Aug 21, 2010

@ Haus- i thought that the only part that would be the colored on the injector would be the top part where it connects to the female end, where im seeing the red/orange.

Now i got in real close, and theres a part number on the injector, E59E -A2B, and looking around, it seems that they were used on all sorts of cars, from 2.3l tempos to 5.0 L Crown Vics, and i can only assume mustangs as well...

So that pretty much clears that up, now back to the MAP / MAF issue, lol... when i leave the MAP open to atmosphere and plug the tube going into the upper intake manifold, how should i get it to hold an idle?

I do not believe i have the smog pump hooked up, but the ports should all be clogged, i dont know whats up w the silicone in the firewall pic. As far as exhaust, its the stock H pipe i believe, or whatever it came with stock.

Haus · Aug 21, 2010

dont those have a 14lb flow rate?

in the 2nd pic i dont see red at all on the injector. thats what makes me think its the the fuel injector harness connector. the tab is obviously broken

and if you have the stock H pipe and not running the smog pump you can clog your converters

JenkinsBS · Aug 21, 2010

I cant find any info on the flow rate of injector - E59E 9F593 A2B / Motorcraft Part Number: CM4347

I dont see them listed on any sites as coming in mustang 5.0 HOs, but Crown Vic 5.0 is listed on there... i dont know if this could be an issue...

But im still looking for a safe way to adjust idle after disconnecting the MAP and plugging the hose going to the intake... just the idle screw?

JenkinsBS · Aug 21, 2010

*UPDATE*

So i disconnected my battery to reprogram the computer, disconected the MAP, leaving the sensor open to atmosphere, plugged the hose going into the intake. 30 minutes later, fire her up, press gently on the gas and hold at 1k rpms for a few seconds, then will surge idle from 300-500 rpms, adjusted idle screw till she idles steady at 900.

Take her around the block and holy santa claus sh**, the lack of power and acceleration are gone, it drives like a completly different car... so i think that was a big issue that has now been corrected. BUT

i get home and see a mass of smoke coming out the passenger side of the car, so i jump out and look under the car w a flashlight, and somthing is smoking inside the cat, putting out ALOT of smoke. This is the first time this has happend, and i do not know what could be causing it. The car also still smells like its running a bit rich.

It looks like there is some sort of paper/cotton material inside of the casing of the cat on that side... i pulled some out with a pair or needle nose pliers, and its like... the aluminum from a gum wrapper with some sort of cotton or somthing attached to the other side, i have no clue what it is. The drivers side cat does NOT have this same material. Any ideas?

Haus · Aug 21, 2010

you need a smog pump when you have Cats. you need to hook that back up. I told you no smog pump can cause it to clog and burn up. or get an off road H pipe. you probably need a new cat anyway so you might as well get an another mid pipe.

a little trick if you smoke cigs. go under the car and stick your cig to the cat and you have a fun way of lighting your cigarette lol

not being serious btw but you can do that

Mustang5L5 · Aug 21, 2010

JenkinsBS said:
I cant find any info on the flow rate of injector - E59E 9F593 A2B / Motorcraft Part Number: CM4347

I dont see them listed on any sites as coming in mustang 5.0 HOs, but Crown Vic 5.0 is listed on there... i dont know if this could be an issue...

But im still looking for a safe way to adjust idle after disconnecting the MAP and plugging the hose going to the intake... just the idle screw?

Those are 14# injectors. Wow this shop stole your good parts. You def need to get 19's on there.

http://cgi.ebay.com/ebaymotors/Fuel-Injectors-Ford-Lincoln-Mercury-5-0L-8-NEW-/390226631879

That is what they look like new. Grey tops

The correct way to set idle is this. Turn the idle screw to open the throttle body and start the engine. Unplug the iac and the spout connector from the dizzy. Now back the idle set screw down to the lowest where you can reasonably maintain a good idle. Should be 600-800 rpm or so.

Now unplug computer to allow car to relearn idle. Plus the spout and iac back in. Check tps voltage to make sure it it in the 0.5-1.1 v range. A code is generated if it is not. start car up. Let idle 2 mins and then turn on all power accessories.

JenkinsBS · Aug 22, 2010

Gah! I told him the shop was shady! oh well, only thing to do now is move forward. Ill correct and set idle properly once i get my new exhaust with no cats.

Im wanting to go with a MAC setup, mainly because thats how i had it 7 years ago . But getting a MAC off road H pipe, direct fit onto the stock headers, and MAC flowpath mufflers. And then get some stock 19lbers from FIC, i hear good things about them. Ill be in heaven after i get all this done. Just a matter of finding a place round here that will weld up my exhaust with no Cats (or do the stock supplied clamps or bolts work fine?)

I also did alot of body work to the car, put on 87 gt side skirts and front pieces, and a 93 cobra rear bumper, but again, the shop took the side skirts and front pieces, but left the 93 bumper on the back. So i want to keep that look and get straight chrome tips out the back like the cobras.

Here she is as she stands. I have H&R lowering springs (1.25" lower in front 1" in rear), and a set of brushed aluminum 17x9 cobra Rs (wrapped in Nitto Extremes, 255/40 17 zr17 95w rear, and 235/45 17 zr17 94w fronts), getting those put on as soon as, or possibly the same time the exhaust work gets done.

Also got a 93 cobra wing, but need to get it painted to match the car and installed, dont know how it will look, but i got it if i want to.

Mustang5L5 · Aug 22, 2010

Nice looking car

JenkinsBS · Aug 22, 2010

Mustang5L5 said:
Nice looking car

Thanks

Now it just needs to run nice... EDIT

Here is a picture of the material and where the smoke was coming from... i dont think its the cat, unless the cat goes up and over the front of the pipe, right before the header.

The thing is attached right after the headers come down and bolt on the pipe. Anyone have ideas on this? Was the material catching on fire, or was somthing a miss burning inside my exhaust pipe?

Mass air to Speed Density?

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