My $2000 Ignition - I need help!

wahoo23 · May 12, 2008

Long story, but here goes: I bought a new MSD ignition (box, coil, dizzy). The dizzy wouldn't drop all of the way in, because of a water fitting, which I tried to relocate. In pulling the old fitting out, it broke off. When trying to get it out with an easy-out, the manifold cracked.

So here's what I've done:
Replaced intake manifold (Edelbrock RPM Air Gap)
Replaced carb (Holly 650cfm)
Replaced fuel pump (Edelbrock mechanical)
Installed braided fuel lines, pump to carb
Installed the new MSD ignition
Built and installed new wires to accommodate the HEI
Replaced all water hoses (insignificant)

Car won't start. I can see fuel entering the carb. I've tested the ignition per MSD's instructions. I had marked the location of the old rotor and installed the new dizzy accordingly. Timing may be off a little, but car should start. Right? What am I missing?

blown65 · May 12, 2008

I'd pull the #1 plug, crank to TDC compression and make sure your not off on your stabbing of the dist.

wahoo23 · May 12, 2008

blown65 said:
I'd pull the #1 plug, crank to TDC compression and make sure your not off on your stabbing of the dist.

Please help me out here, I'm learning as I go. How would I know the dizzy is in the correct position by pulling the #1 plug? I understand that at top dead center, #1 is at it's highest compression, but how do I confirm that by simply pulling the plug? Wouldn't it be easier to rotate to TDC, then pull the cap and verify that the rotor is pointing at the #1 wire? Thanks!

blown65 · May 12, 2008

Pull the #1 plug and crank over by hand. When it comes up on compression stroke it will be compressing the air in the cylinder thus pushing the air out of the spark plug hole. Once the air stops coming out you should be very close to TDC. Look on your balancer and check and then check your dist. Make sure its pointing at the #1 spark plug wire.

wahoo23 · May 12, 2008

blown65 said:
Pull the #1 plug and crank over by hand. When it comes up on compression stroke it will be compressing the air in the cylinder thus pushing the air out of the spark plug hole. Once the air stops coming out you should be very close to TDC. Look on your balancer and check and then check your dist. Make sure its pointing at the #1 spark plug wire.

I'll try that...thanks!

GNGREN · May 12, 2008

I'm a little old school but.....

Are you sure your are getting spark? Pull a plug and ground it to the block while somebody turns the ignition. Or hot wire it and do it at the solinoid. (I do it on my points ignition don't know if it would hurt the electronic MSD!!) Have you moved the dist. around while cranking to see if it will even try to fire?

wahoo23 · May 12, 2008

GNGREN said:
Are you sure your are getting spark? Pull a plug and ground it to the block while somebody turns the ignition. Or hot wire it and do it at the solinoid. (I do it on my points ignition don't know if it would hurt the electronic MSD!!) Have you moved the dist. around while cranking to see if it will even try to fire?

Yes, per MSD's instructions, I pulled the lead wire from the coil of at the dizzy, and placed it ~1/2" from ground. I then turned on the ignition and shorted the two wires on the lead from box to dizzy. There was spark present.

mrmustangman357 · May 12, 2008

you might be 180 degrees off. Turn the engine to top dead center on number 1 cylinder, remove the cap, and see if the rotor is pointing to where the number 1 plug wire is on the rotor.

wahoo23 · May 12, 2008

mrmustangman357 said:
you might be 180 degrees off. Turn the engine to top dead center on number 1 cylinder, remove the cap, and see if the rotor is pointing to where the number 1 plug wire is on the rotor.

I will try that as soon as I'm done banging my head against a wall... I don't know how I could've gotten 180 degrees off, but I guess at this point, anything is possible. Thanks!

SoCalCruising · May 12, 2008

Your initial idea of turning the crank over until you have TDC on the damper and then seeing where the rotor is pointing in the dizzy should be adequate to know if you are 180 out, or not. On a fresh build, that might not be the case, but since you do not report messing with the short block, this should be fine.

Make sure you have a fully charged battery. MSD boxes don't like less than 12V.

fvike · May 12, 2008

Here's another one; when I installed my Crane HI-6 and Crane distributor, I could not get it to start, and I could not for the life of me find anything wrong. Turned out to be that my carb was so lean it burned up the fuel as it cranked, because of the multiple sparks. It didn't make enough combustion power to move the pistons. It was VERY VERY lean.

wahoo23 · May 14, 2008

I've verified that at top dead center, the dizzy is pointing at the #1 wire. I've had the battery on a trickle charger for 24 hours (it's a new red-top battery anyway...). Still doesn't start. While attempting to fire it up this time, the starter stopped dead in its tracks. I assume I need to change out the starter now before going any farther...

blown65 · May 14, 2008

Stopped as in not work anymore? Or does it work but has a hard time cranking?

wahoo23 · May 15, 2008

blown65 said:
Stopped as in not work anymore? Or does it work but has a hard time cranking?

I had cranked it for a minute, no problems. Then turned the key again to crank - it turned over a few times, then stopped completely while I still had the key turned. Now when the key is turned - nothing.

SoCalCruising · May 15, 2008

Maybe just your relay fried. Try to jump across the relay and see if it cranks - use a large gauge wire. If so, just replace the relay.

bnickel · May 15, 2008

how did you wire up the msd box? you have to wire to ignition with 12v, you can't just use the stock hot wire from the switch as it is a resistance wire (this wire will be pink) if you used that wire to the box you only have about 7-9v going to the box.

HookandLadder · May 15, 2008

Also, the MSD box needs a constant source from the battery and the switched goes to another wire. Please check and make sure you have a very good ground for the box as well. Hook it to the neg post of the battery if need be.

Check your wiring here: http://www.msdignition.com/1download.htm

wahoo23 · May 15, 2008

HookandLadder said:
Also, the MSD box needs a constant source from the battery and the switched goes to another wire. Please check and make sure you have a very good ground for the box as well. Hook it to the neg post of the battery if need be.

Check your wiring here: http://www.msdignition.com/1download.htm

Yes, I ran the heavy black and red directly to the battery, and ran a new switched wire as well.

D.Hearne · May 16, 2008

wahoo23 said:
I had cranked it for a minute, no problems. Then turned the key again to crank - it turned over a few times, then stopped completely while I still had the key turned. Now when the key is turned - nothing.

Check all the starter connections, including the ground wires.

wahoo23 · May 17, 2008

D.Hearne said:
Check all the starter connections, including the ground wires.

I checked all starter connections, and replaced the solenoid. No go. Replacing the starter next...

My $2000 Ignition - I need help!

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