Need help bad... Thumper... Someone

79dog

Founding Member

Oct 26, 2002

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Sunny Fl.

May 14, 2004

#1

• May 14, 2004

• #1

Man, we just was getting ready to put this engine in the car. Went to put the Edge racing Stall converter in,and low in behold the bolt pattern is different. The stall conv. has 9 1/4 " bolt pattern side to side. The flexplate has a 11 1/2" bolt pattern. What are my options??????? Help.....

 

thumper460

Founding Member

Jul 24, 2000

3,022

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56

Orange Park , Fl

May 14, 2004

#2

• May 14, 2004

• #2

79Dog..... your still alive!! Hi!! sounds like you bought a high stall 10 inch converter??? They do make a flex plate for that bolt pattern ... or send it back and get one that fits the flexplate you have... yeah, no help there... OR.... Dare I say??
Hell yeah.. you can see IF you can drill the existing flexplate for the converter you have!! It can be done and it is a PITA to make sure your align correct... maybe a machine shop or a clutch and fly wheel place?? I do it to the C4 flex plate to run the smaller 10 inch Pinto converter , and they work fine!! Cool??

Just me..........................

Thumper

 

5.0Droptop

...all those nights we shared, and you're a dude??

Special Agent Mukity-Muck Whats in Charge Round Here

May 15, 2002

1,785

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Indiana

May 14, 2004

#3

• May 14, 2004

• #3

Thats what I was thinking. Take it to a machine shop and let them fix it up.

Hi Mike! My heads are stillll Going

 

79dog

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Oct 26, 2002

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Sunny Fl.

May 15, 2004

#4

• May 15, 2004

• #4

Hey Thumper, yea I'm still kickin'.....I'm still confussed, this guy just came over. He's been moding fords for a long time. Here's what he said. My motor came out of a 85, so I need the 50 oz. balancer. The flywheel needs to match the 50 oz. balancer. He had a flywheel for a 10" converter. The stall converter I got from Edge racing has even smaller bolt hole pattern than that. If I take the flywheel "flexplate" to a machine shop and have them redrill the holes the studs will rub against the engine. He also said if the side plate cover on the tranny is the original, the tranny is a 1968 C4. I wonder if they make a after market flexplate that will work on a 50 oz. balancer for a C4 tranny?

 

thumper460

Founding Member

Jul 24, 2000

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Orange Park , Fl

May 15, 2004

#5

• May 15, 2004

• #5

OK.... the 68 C4 has a smaller input shaft than the later C4s, like 75 up!! they have a 26 spline and the early have a 24? spline!! SOOOooo.. check the input shaft in to the converter and make sure it is right!! Second... find an engine balancer!! ( there are two up here in Jax),and ask if they can mod the 24 oz to a 50 oz?? usually they CAN for a price... !! Or call B&M or TCI or some trans place and thell them you need a flywheel for a 50 oz 5.0 10 inch converter 164 tooth flex plate!! ( Oh, yeah... ford did the flywheel change also...!! ) the smaller flywheel is a 157 tooth and the larger is the 164 tooth!! the 68 C4 will probably us the 164 tooth!! Count the starter ring teeth...cool?? I know this SUX!! sorry!! I always use the early STRONGER early 302 crankshaft (28oz) and have it all balanced befor I build it!! But then after 35 years of doing this... there are just a few things I have learned , I guess I should have thrown it at you when you were into the building.... huh?? LOL But it is still doable!! the flexplates should be about 60-80.00!!

Having fun yet??? LOL

Just me..................................

Thumper

 

79dog

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Oct 26, 2002

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May 15, 2004

#6

• May 15, 2004

• #6

Hey Thumper, O.K. I did some checking. The flywheel is 164 tooth and the input shaft is 26. My question is, when you say 10" converter.... how do you measure that? I need to know if I have a 10" converter. The input shaft fits properly in the stall converter also, and the stall converter fits in the tranny perfect. Thanks...........

 

79dog

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Oct 26, 2002

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May 15, 2004

#7

• May 15, 2004

• #7

Update time.....I just went to TCIAUTO.COM, they list the converter I have. Bolt hole pattern is 9.375". They list it as the mustang 2 converter size. I guess I have 2 options then....
1. Change my crank back to a '79 style with the 24 oz. balancer or
2. See if I can get a mustang 2 flexplate and have it modified to a 50 oz.
Any more help out there......??

 

thumper460

Founding Member

Jul 24, 2000

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Orange Park , Fl

May 15, 2004

#8

• May 15, 2004

• #8

Do this... the AOD 26 tooth fly wheel is 50 oz!! cooL?? the bolt holes are just short of the 9.375 bolt pattern... get the AOD 50 oz and then mod the holes for the converter you have... and your rocking... see attached!!

Tpr

 

thumper460

Founding Member

Jul 24, 2000

3,022

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Orange Park , Fl

May 15, 2004

#9

• May 15, 2004

• #9

the picture...

Opps... see this!! cool??

Tpr

 

79dog

Founding Member

Oct 26, 2002

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May 15, 2004

#10

• May 15, 2004

• #10

Cool Thumper, the flexplate I have from the 85 motor looks like the one in the 2 pic. I just measured and it looks like its just a small mod to make. It looks to me as though the "plate" between the engine and tranny is going to have to be modded as well. That's where I was talking about the studs from the stall converter was going to hit the engine. Looks like there going to hit the plate, not the engine. You'll have to excuss my ignorance, I've never modified things like this before. LOL..... that's why I visit this board......Glad I met you. Thanks......

 

thumper460

Founding Member

Jul 24, 2000

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Orange Park , Fl

May 15, 2004

#11

• May 15, 2004

• #11

Rocking.....

Tpr

 

79dog

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Oct 26, 2002

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May 17, 2004

#12

• May 17, 2004

• #12

Thumper, how precise does the holes have to be? I mean do I have to be exact or do I have some play? Thanks......

 

ECU5.0

Banned

Jan 10, 2004

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raleigh, nc

May 17, 2004

#13

• May 17, 2004

• #13

im not thumper...but im pretty sure they need to be exact...since it is a rotating assembly and would be out of balance if it was wrong

 

79dog

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Oct 26, 2002

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May 17, 2004

#14

• May 17, 2004

• #14

I also see another potential problem. See pic #2. If I drill the hole where it is shown, Do I have to use some kind of spacer, cause it looks like it will be setting about 5/16" lower than normal. The studs on the Stall converter don't look long enough to use a spacer. Thumper, do you have a full write up on this project? I think I dying here......LOL..... just a thing.

 

thumper460

Founding Member

Jul 24, 2000

3,022

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Orange Park , Fl

May 17, 2004

#15

• May 17, 2004

• #15

the flex plate is to hold the converter in place , not binding the front pump in the trans and also to spin... I'm sure there are a lot of trans guys out there that will be more exact.... but, I drill the hole in the flex plate and then use a flat washer to pull the converter to the flexplate and hold it tight to it... the nose of the converter fits in the back of the crankshaft.. pilot Cool?? with it all set in place the alignment of the converter is set by the pilot in the crank and the trans input and pump drive...cool?? the converter only needs to spin... and that is the flex plates job... I would "mock" this up out of the car and make sure that the converter is good !! It should have a little movement and fit in the holes you drilled... the washer... the nut ... and then tighten!! cool??

Tpr

 

79dog

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Oct 26, 2002

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May 18, 2004

#16

• May 18, 2004

• #16

Hey Thumper, Got the holes drilled tonight. It don't even look like I need a washer. The stall converter on the edges, lays against the flexplate. I suppose I could put 1 or 2 washers to make it solid. I can get 3 full turns on the locking nuts before they hit the plate to tourqe them down. Do you think that's enough? Maybe If I put the washers in I won't get as many full turns. Just guessing, it looks like the stall conv. will come out about 3/16" from the tranny. I hope you know what I mean there....... Will that cause a problem? With the stall conv. fully back in the tranny, it seems I can pull it out quite a bit before I loose the splines. I hope this all makes sence...... Thanks.....

 

thumper460

Founding Member

Jul 24, 2000

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Orange Park , Fl

May 19, 2004

#17

• May 19, 2004

• #17

Sounds like your rocking... just remember there are TWO "clunks" when you install the converter on the trans... the second clunk is making sure the converter aligns on the front pump... hope THAT made sence?? if not ask the guy there that has been helping you...cool??

Now Damn 79DOG.... we want to hear tires squeeling and smell burning rubber ...soon???? LOL

Just me.................................

Thumper

 

79dog

Founding Member

Oct 26, 2002

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Sunny Fl.

May 19, 2004

#18

• May 19, 2004

• #18

By Thumper,
Now Damn 79DOG.... we want to hear tires squeeling and smell burning rubber ...soon???? LOL

Click to expand...

I'm trying, Ran into another snag tonight. After modifying the plate between the tranny and the engine, the nuts that hold the Stall Converter on still rub the plate. I mean just barely touch. Question....
Being called a flexplate, how much does it flex? I can probably grind off 1/8 to 3/16" off the nuts. Then it would be free from the plate. Do you think that's enough?
I love this grinding and cutting stuff....

 

79dog

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Oct 26, 2002

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Sunny Fl.

May 20, 2004

#19

• May 20, 2004

• #19

Someone can answer this can't they?

How much does a flexplate flex? Is a 1/8" clearance enough? Thanks.....

 

hllon4whls

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Jan 17, 2002

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Covington

May 20, 2004

#20

• May 20, 2004

• #20

We had to get some converter bolts from the hardware store with a reduced thickness head. They were not hard to find and we just got some grade 8 stuff. You dont need much clearance. If you have sure you have a whole 1/8, I htink that you will be OK.

Possibly you can grind a little off of the block to give that added clearance?