Someone with diagnostic Knowhow...PLEASE

Year of car will help. Since you mentioned PIH swap, we will assume a 94-95 GT for now.

When it wont start, does it have spark? Injector pulsing? When it wont start and you have cranked it a bit, if you floor the gas pedal while (and ONLY while) cranking, does it start?

Jrichker has a very nice list of things to systematically check for no-start situations. I would look at that.

Good luck.

when was the last tune up to include fuel filter replacement,new dist. cap&rotor,spark plugs, wires.air filter.have you checked for codes.

Since some of the tests will bypass the safety interlocks, make sure that the car is in neutral and the parking brake is set. Becoming a pancake isn’t part of the repair process…

Check battery, terminal connections, ground, starter relay switch (also known as solenoid) and starter in that order.

A voltmeter is handy if you are familiar with how to use it to find bad connections. Measure the voltage drop across a connection: more than .5 volts across a connection indicates a problem.
See http://www.fluke.com/application_not...AGID=1&SID=103 for help
FPRIVATE "TYPE=PICT;ALT="

1.) Will the car start if it is jumped? Then clean battery terminals and check battery.

2.) Check the battery to engine block ground, and the ground behind the engine to the firewall.

3.) Jump the big terminals on the starter relay next to the battery with a screwdriver - watch out for the sparks! If the engine cranks, the starter and power wiring is good. The starter relay is also known as a starter solenoid.

4.) Then pull the small push on connector (red wire) off the starter relay (Looks like it is stuck on a screw). Then jump between the screw and the terminal that is connected to the battery. If it starts, the relay is good and your problem is in the rest of the circuit.

5.) Remember to check the ignition switch, neutral safety switch on auto trans and the clutch safety switch on manual trans cars. If they are good, then you have wiring problems. See http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/g...3d80195963.gif for 88-90 year cars .OR see http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/g...3d80195964.gif for 91-93 year cars. See http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiBr...3d801ddb3c.jsp for 94-95 model cars.

6.) The starter may be hung, loosen up the bolts that hold it on, and give it a good whack with a big hammer. Tighten up the bolts and try again.

7.) If that doesn't work, use a jumper cable from the positive lead on the battery direct to the starter post where the big wire from the relay connects. If it cranks then, it is the power wire from the relay gone bad. This will be hard to do, since there isn't much room to do it.

8.) Pull the starter and take it to Autozone or Pep Boys and have them test it. Starter fails test, then replace it. If you got this far, the starter is probably bad.

excellent info, bill302... but it sounds more like it cranks but won't fire.

i'd be guessing it's either the TFI module or the pip sensor in the dizzy.

jadedinpa said:

excellent info, bill302... but it sounds more like it cranks but won't fire.

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That post you are referencing [once again] sounds like Jrichker's words.

bill302 said:

Since some of the tests will bypass the safety interlocks, make sure that the car is in neutral and the parking brake is set. Becoming a pancake isn’t part of the repair process…

Check battery, terminal connections, ground, starter relay switch (also known as solenoid) and starter in that order.

A voltmeter is handy if you are familiar with how to use it to find bad connections. Measure the voltage drop across a connection: more than .5 volts across a connection indicates a problem.
See http://www.fluke.com/application_not...AGID=1&SID=103 for help
FPRIVATE "TYPE=PICT;ALT="

1.) Will the car start if it is jumped? Then clean battery terminals and check battery.

2.) Check the battery to engine block ground, and the ground behind the engine to the firewall.

3.) Jump the big terminals on the starter relay next to the battery with a screwdriver - watch out for the sparks! If the engine cranks, the starter and power wiring is good. The starter relay is also known as a starter solenoid.

4.) Then pull the small push on connector (red wire) off the starter relay (Looks like it is stuck on a screw). Then jump between the screw and the terminal that is connected to the battery. If it starts, the relay is good and your problem is in the rest of the circuit.

5.) Remember to check the ignition switch, neutral safety switch on auto trans and the clutch safety switch on manual trans cars. If they are good, then you have wiring problems. See http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/g...3d80195963.gif for 88-90 year cars .OR see http://www.autozone.com/images/cds/g...3d80195964.gif for 91-93 year cars. See http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiBr...3d801ddb3c.jsp for 94-95 model cars.

6.) The starter may be hung, loosen up the bolts that hold it on, and give it a good whack with a big hammer. Tighten up the bolts and try again.

7.) If that doesn't work, use a jumper cable from the positive lead on the battery direct to the starter post where the big wire from the relay connects. If it cranks then, it is the power wire from the relay gone bad. This will be hard to do, since there isn't much room to do it.

8.) Pull the starter and take it to Autozone or Pep Boys and have them test it. Starter fails test, then replace it. If you got this far, the starter is probably bad.

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Plagiarism is the sincerest form of flattery...

jrichker said:

Plagiarism is the sincerest form of flattery...

Click to expand...

owned by the man, J, himself!

red ink said:

Its a 95 cobra.
Jadedinpa is correct, Its cranking just fine. How can i check if there is spark? I know there would be spark after it finally starts, but what would cause it to not have spark and then have spark so consistently? remember, it starts everytime. It just takes so patience. i've pumped the gas pedle with no effect. I'll almost garentee the starter is good. The amount of time it has spent turning my engine over is unbelieveable that it still works...
I'll look into an msd distributor or something...i dont really wanna spend money on something im not sure on. any other surefire ideas?

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You would pull a plug wire and insert an extra plug into the wire. Set the threads of the plug against the intake (metal) and crank - look for spark. Or use a spark tester or timing light from the parts store.

When it wont fire right up, what happens if you cycle the key several times (but without trying to start the car)? This primes the pump a few times rather than once. It is something to do on weaker pumps.

Also, what MAF do you run? The cobra puter in your 95 was what took care of the injector calibration. With an A9L puter (if that is what you have), you would need a MAF cal'd for the 24's on your cobra.

Now as i recall, with the remote mounted TFI on SN95's, there is a terminal on the TFI that gets the crank signal. So if that wire is not seeing the crank signal, due to a damaged wire or bad TFI, that could interfere with getting spark. That is a REAL longshot, so I would not act on it, unless you want to put your meter on that wire to ensure it has juice while cranking.

Good luck.

Cranks OK, but No Start Checklist for Fuel Injected Mustangs

1.) Remove push on connector from starter solenoid and turn ignition switch on. Place car in neutral or Park. Remove coil wire from distributor & and hold 3/8” away from engine block. Jumper the screw to the big bolt on the starter solenoid that has the battery wire connected to it. You should get a nice fat blue spark.
Most of the items are electrical in nature, so a test light, or even better, a voltmeter, is helpful to be sure they have power to them.
No spark, possible failed items in order of their probability:
A.) MSD or Crane ignition box if so equipped
B.) Coil
C.) TFI module
D.) PIP sensor in distributor
E.) ECC relay next to computer - look for 12 volts at the fuel injector red wires
F.) Fuse links in wiring harness - look for 12 volts at the fuel injector red wires. All the fuse links live in a bundle up near the starter solenoid.
G.) Ignition switch - look for 12 volts at the ignition coil red/lt green wire.
H.) Computer

See the following links for wiring diagrams...

http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiB..._us/0900823d/80/16/71/3c/0900823d8016713c.jsp for 79-88 model cars

http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiB..._us/0900823d/80/19/59/5a/0900823d8019595a.jsp for 89-93 model cars

http://www.autozone.com/servlet/UiB..._us/0900823d/80/1d/db/3c/0900823d801ddb3c.jsp for 94-98 model cars


2.) Spark at coil wire, pull #1 plug wire off at the spark plug and check to see spark. No spark, possible failed items in order of their probability:
A.) Moisture inside distributor – remove cap, dry off & spray with WD40
B.) Distributor cap
C.) Rotor
D.) Spark Plug wires
E.) Coil weak or intermittent - you should see 3/8" fat blue spark with a good coil

3.) Spark at spark plug, but no start.
Next, get a can of starting fluid (ether) from your local auto parts store: costs a $1.30 or so. Then pull the air duct off at the throttle body elbow, open the throttle, and spray the ether in it. Reconnect the air duct and try to start the car. Do not try to start the car without reconnecting the air duct.
Two reasons:
1.) If it backfires, the chance for a serious fire is increased.
2.) On Mass Air cars, the computer needs to measure the MAF flow once the engine starts.
If it starts then, you have a fuel management issue. Continue the checklist with emphasis of fuel related items that follow. If it doesn’t, then it is a computer or timing issue: see Step 4.

Clue – listen for the fuel pump to prime when you first turn the ignition switch on. It should run for 5-20 seconds and shut off. To trick the fuel pump into running, find the ECC test connector and jump the connector in the lower RH corner to ground. See http://www.mustangworks.com/articles/electronics/eec-iv_codes.html for a description of the test connector. If the relay & inertia switch are OK, you will have power to the pump. Check fuel pressure – remove the cap from the schrader valve behind the alternator and depress the core. Fuel should squirt out, catch it in a rag. Beware of fire hazard when you do this. In pinch you can use a tire pressure gauge to measure the fuel pressure. It may not be completely accurate, but you will have some clue as to how much pressure you have.

No fuel pressure, possible failed items in order of their probability:
A.) Tripped inertia switch – Coupe & hatch cars hide it under the plastic trim covering the driver's side taillight. Use the voltmeter or test light to make sure you have power to both sides of the switch
B.) Fuel pump power relay – located under the driver’s seat in most stangs built before 92. On 92 and later model cars it is located below the Mass Air Flow meter. Look for 12 volts at the Pink/Black wire on the fuel pump relay.
C.) Clogged fuel filter
D.) Failed fuel pump
E.) Blown fuse link in wiring harness. Look for 12 volts at the Orange/Lt Blue wire on the fuel pump relay. The fuse links live in the wiring harness near the starter solenoid.
F.) Fuel pressure regulator failed. Remove vacuum line from regulator and inspect for fuel escaping while pump is running.

Fuel pressure OK, the injectors are not firing.

A.) A Noid light available from Autozone, is one way to test the injector wiring.
B.) I like to use an old injector with compressed air applied to the injector where the fuel rail would normally connect. I hook the whole thing up, apply compressed air to the injector and stick it in a paper cup of soapy water. When the engine cranks with the ignition switch on, if the injector fires, it makes bubbles. Cheap if you have the stuff laying around, and works good too.

a.) Pull an injector wire connector off and look for 12 volts on the red wire when the ignition switch is on.
b.) No power, then look for problems with the 10 pin connecter (salt & pepper shakers at the rear of the upper manifold).
c.) No power and the 10 pin connections are good: look for broken wiring between the orange/black wire on the ECC relay and the red wire for the 10 pin connectors.


4.) Spark & fuel pressure OK.

A.) Failed IAB (no airflow to start engine). Press the throttle ¼ way down and try to start the car.
B.) Failed computer (not very likely)
C.) Engine ignition or cam timing off: only likely if the engine has been worked on recently).
D.) Firing order off: HO & 351 use a different firing order from the non HO engines.
HO & 351W 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8
Non HO 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8
E.) No start when hot - Press the throttle to the floor & try starting it if you get this far. If it starts, replace the ECT.

red ink said:

If i leave it on the first position (the one where it beeps but no dash lights come on) it will fire up...

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do you jump the solenoid to start it, or push the key forward to crank then drop it back to this position?

jrichker said:

Plagiarism is the sincerest form of flattery...

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i hope you don't mind i copy alot of your diagnosis&troubleshooting threads and put them in my files along with a few other good threads for further references and display them if it will help someone.by the way i'm finally glad to meet you in a thread and nice website you have,i have learned alot from you and others on this site, i only worked on G.M.s and hated fords until about a year ago when i bought a 95 GT see my link in my signature and again thanks!!!!

bill302 said:

i hope you don't mind i copy alot of your diagnosis&troubleshooting threads and put them in my files along with a few other good threads for further references and display them if it will help someone.by the way i'm finally glad to meet you in a thread and nice website you have,i have learned alot from you and others on this site, i only worked on G.M.s and hated fords until about a year ago when i bought a 95 GT see my link in my signature and again thanks!!!!

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Bill, It is still proper to broadly preface your post with a heading or footnote that the information is authored by Jrichker. For this reason, I wont even even paste his quotes, even though they would be in their highlighted and italicized form (with his username plastered on both ends of the quote), because I would not want to leave room for confusion. I simply post links to Jrichker's posts.

You will also find that even Jrichker will reference others quite often, even if it is only an idea from the person - not even a direct quote.

Giving credit where credit is due is important IMHO. Now, I dont have to worry about that ever happening to me since no one can understand what I am talking about anyhow.

10-4 hissing50 new to computers and forums and learning as i go, hope i have not offended anyone but i realize even being new i should have used proper etiquette. i will use your reccomendations in the future. thanks for all the help.

red ink said:

No i leave it in this position and then start it normaly. Putting it in this position before i try to crank it seems to help it start more often.

holy crap..thanks for the check list Jrichker...I'll get on it!!! lol

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that sounds like an ignition switch issue then.