Spacers and Autocross
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CornerCarvin67
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- Dec 30, 2004
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I would NOT recommend that for autocrossing. But that's just my two cents. I wouldn't want the wheel to have any chance of slippage with the spacer. If they were somehow fitted to each other (male/female), that would be much better. But I've never seen a spacer like that ever. 1/4 or maybe 1/2" spacer... but not that big. Sorry... I just don't like the idea of it.
red65
Member
CornerCarvin67 said:
I agree. Wheel spacers aren't adequate for road-racing or autoX, in my opinion. Lots of guys on this board will surely disagree, since they seem to be in common use, but I've seen a spacer fail in regular street use (not pretty). I wouldn't take one on the track... Get the right wheel instead.
CornerCarvin67 said:
I think there's some confusion here around 'spacers' and 'wheel adapters'. I agree spacers are inadequate and shouldn't be considered for anything greater than 1/4"
Wheel adapters, however, are torqued down to the rotor/hub using the original wheel studs while providing a new set of studs for the wheel to mount to.
I mistakenly said "Spacer" in my post instead of "Wheel Adapter" which probably caused the confusion.
CornerCarvin67
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Well then you might be answering your own question. If you feel that the adapter is a much better solution...
1320stang
Founding Member
I wouldn't use a spacer or a wheel adapter. I'd get wheels that are correct for the application, in this case, road racing.
That's just my opinion.
That's just my opinion.
DarkBuddha
Founding Member
I have a set of 1" hubcentric adapters on my '70 Mach being used to accomodate a set of late model wheels. They're made of billet 6061 and have grade 8 studs and lugs. I'd feel ok auto-x'ing with 'em on the car.
And I agree that there is a lot of confusion when discussing this sort of thing. The term "spacer" is often mis-used to describe adapters. Also, there seems to be a lot of misconceptions about the use of adapters and their merit in general. Spacers and adapters both have been used for years in lots and lots of motorsports, ranging from F1 to trans am to circle track to off-roading. Properly designed and machined adapters made from proper material, and outfitted with proper hardware should be up to auto-x. As for merit, their uses range from adapting wheel bolt patterns to offering a way to tune the track width of race cars to accomodate different tracks and conditions without having to completely redesign, re-engineer, or rebuild the existing suspension, chassis, or wheels.
And I agree that there is a lot of confusion when discussing this sort of thing. The term "spacer" is often mis-used to describe adapters. Also, there seems to be a lot of misconceptions about the use of adapters and their merit in general. Spacers and adapters both have been used for years in lots and lots of motorsports, ranging from F1 to trans am to circle track to off-roading. Properly designed and machined adapters made from proper material, and outfitted with proper hardware should be up to auto-x. As for merit, their uses range from adapting wheel bolt patterns to offering a way to tune the track width of race cars to accomodate different tracks and conditions without having to completely redesign, re-engineer, or rebuild the existing suspension, chassis, or wheels.
CornerCarvin67
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jikelly
20+ Year Stangneter 
I've got 1" wheel adapters on my stang. No problems after 1.5 years and if I'm going somewhere its while driven like a nut.
I just talked to a guy who has considerable road racing experience at Laguna Seca. He said that when they use adapters to alter wheel track width (never spacers) they are machine fit to provide a mechanical lock to prevent and lateral or spin shift. They also use a medium duty thread locker on the adapter nuts only.
1320stang
Founding Member
My feeling is, if you're going to spend $400 on a set of adapters so that you can get by on a set of $400 wheels, why not just buy $800 wheels that fit?
I don't know a lot about autocrossing, I want to try some out once my '65 coupe is back together, but it's my understanding a smaller wheel is better than a large wheel, but as small of a wheel as you can get around your brakes. I also understand that 400+ hp engines aren't needed either, so I'm doubting most need 6 piston calipers with 14" cross drilled, slotted, unobtainium rotors.
I do know for a fact that you can have a damn good race car or a damn nice street car, but you'll never have one that's both, you have to compromise one way or another, ALWAYS... You give me a car that you think is great in both and I can make it better in one or the other, guarenteed.
Us older guys usually only offer this type advice because we've been there before, trying to do something halfa$$ed. The younger bunch either listens or learns the same damn lesson all over again. My philosophy is to learn from other's mistakes and try and if you're going to make a mistake, make one that no one has ever made. Chances of doing that are slim....
I understand that Trans-Am or F1 teams do this. Are they using $400 adapters? Do they have higher budgets than we do? The USS Missouri had guns that would shoot 20 miles, why can't I do that with my .22 rifle?
I just don't see the reason to spend so much money on a proper set of adapters that you couldn't purchase the wheels for. Now maybe we're not getting all the info. I'm assuming that this is the only set of wheels for this car, if it's a set of autocross only wheels that he already has or can get super cheap, that might be a bit different. But if I've spent several years and several thousand dollars redoing a car and put something on that could fail and ruin my work (or on the drag strip, someone elses work), I'm not compromising and going that route. Again, just me, do as you wish.
I don't know a lot about autocrossing, I want to try some out once my '65 coupe is back together, but it's my understanding a smaller wheel is better than a large wheel, but as small of a wheel as you can get around your brakes. I also understand that 400+ hp engines aren't needed either, so I'm doubting most need 6 piston calipers with 14" cross drilled, slotted, unobtainium rotors.
I do know for a fact that you can have a damn good race car or a damn nice street car, but you'll never have one that's both, you have to compromise one way or another, ALWAYS... You give me a car that you think is great in both and I can make it better in one or the other, guarenteed.
Us older guys usually only offer this type advice because we've been there before, trying to do something halfa$$ed. The younger bunch either listens or learns the same damn lesson all over again. My philosophy is to learn from other's mistakes and try and if you're going to make a mistake, make one that no one has ever made. Chances of doing that are slim....
I understand that Trans-Am or F1 teams do this. Are they using $400 adapters? Do they have higher budgets than we do? The USS Missouri had guns that would shoot 20 miles, why can't I do that with my .22 rifle?
I just don't see the reason to spend so much money on a proper set of adapters that you couldn't purchase the wheels for. Now maybe we're not getting all the info. I'm assuming that this is the only set of wheels for this car, if it's a set of autocross only wheels that he already has or can get super cheap, that might be a bit different. But if I've spent several years and several thousand dollars redoing a car and put something on that could fail and ruin my work (or on the drag strip, someone elses work), I'm not compromising and going that route. Again, just me, do as you wish.
Yes.. I must also admit I was thinking adapters but typed "spacers".
I used to have a quality set of machined adapters.. only cost me $120 for a pair.
17" factory takeoffs from a newer stang along with some wheel adapters will be MUCH cheaper than a set of custom wheels with the proper backspacing. But I agree that if you are buying brand new wheels already...might as well spend a few extra $$ and get wheels with the proper backspacing.
I used to have a quality set of machined adapters.. only cost me $120 for a pair.
17" factory takeoffs from a newer stang along with some wheel adapters will be MUCH cheaper than a set of custom wheels with the proper backspacing. But I agree that if you are buying brand new wheels already...might as well spend a few extra $$ and get wheels with the proper backspacing.
1320stang
Founding Member
Dang, I read what I typed.....
I'm getting crotchity as I get older....
AHHHHHRRRGGGHHH!!!! I'M GETTING OLD!!!!!!!!!
I'm getting crotchity as I get older....
AHHHHHRRRGGGHHH!!!! I'M GETTING OLD!!!!!!!!!
zookeeper
Founding Member
Personally, I think spacers that are 1 1/4" thick may be pushing it a bit, but are they unsafe? I don't know one way or the other. But I do know a couple things: first lots and lots of different racers from circle track to road racers use spacers as a tuning device. I've made several sets for local racers and have never even heard of a failure, but they are never more than 1/2" thick. Second, it cracks me up to hear people refer to 6061 aluminum like it's some sort of rare, super-stout metal that posesses almost mythical strength and durability. 6061 aluminum is soft, fairly easy to compress and oxidizes quickly and easily. If you are having spacers made and want extreme durability and strength, buy some 7075 aluminum. Yes it's about twice as expensive as 6061 but it will outlast the car it's on and then some. Honda makes it's frames from 7000-series aluminum and they are paper-thin but strong as a bridge.
DarkBuddha
Founding Member
Just to clarify, I just stated what my spacers were made of (6061) and that I felt they'd be up to auto-x. Admittedly, there is always a better option, but like all things in life, using 6061 is a compromise. They are less expensive and they are not as hard as other billet stock, but they are economical and should be quite adequate for their intended use. Seems reasonable to me.
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