Fox Valve Spring Kit PAC-1219X. Help finding needed additional parts.

93gtmustang · Wednesday at 8:34 AM

I have M-6049-X-303 Ford Racing Aluminum Heads.
I would like to try and install this kit to prevent valve float at higher rpms drag racing.

Ford Performance Mustang PAC 1219X Beehive Valve Spring M-6513-1219X (79-93 302, 351W Mustang) - Free Shipping

FREE SHIPPING! Elevate Engine Performance. Unlock the full potential of your Ford's engine with the Ford Performance PAC 1219X Beehive Valve Springs. These spri

www.americanmuscle.com

It requires beehive-specific retainers, locks, and valve stem seals, properly sized spring locators and shims.
Where can I purchase these?
And find detailed how-to instructions?
Thanks

AeroCoupe · Wednesday at 8:57 AM

Why not just find some valves that work with the valve train parts you already have? A good machine shop should be able to recommend some valves that will work like Isky, Comp Cams, PAC, etc.

93gtmustang · Wednesday at 10:47 AM

I don't know? It's all Greek to me!
I just want to eliminate valve float at higher rpms with the spring kit.
The tech person at American Muscle said that I would need those additional parts.
They don't stock them.

fasterthangas · Wednesday at 11:33 AM

You need to contact Ed Curtis @ FTI. He will know exactly what you need.
https://flowtechinduction.com/

Mustang5L5 · Wednesday at 12:58 PM

Do you have valve float? Really going to depend on your cam specs that you are using.

I second talking to Ed. I got my cam and spring kit from him, as he sells complete kits.

93gtmustang · Wednesday at 2:53 PM

fasterthangas said:
You need to contact Ed Curtis @ FTI. He will know exactly what you need.
https://flowtechinduction.com/

Thank you. There is so good stuff on that site!

93gtmustang · Wednesday at 3:05 PM

Mustang5L5 said:
Do you have valve float? Really going to depend on your cam specs that you are using.

I second talking to Ed. I got my cam and spring kit from him, as he sells complete kits.

I would say yes for valve float. Not all the time. But I can tell sometimes when it lays over before the stripe with certain weather conditions.
The motor is the old Ford Racing Crate stock 5.0 bottom end with the B-303 cam and the Gt-40 X-303 heads
I've read that the Gt40 x-303 heads are only good for like 5500-5800 rpm I guess. I am hitting the finish line at 6000-6100 rpm.
I want to buy heads that will flow 6000 rpm and a new cam but, It's not in the budget right now.
Thanks for the link! I will give him a call.

fasterthangas · Wednesday at 4:24 PM

Valve float will leave a star pattern on the valve tips. It's pretty easy to see. Sometimes there will be chatter marks on the valve seats.

AeroCoupe · Wednesday at 5:45 PM

I wonder what lifters are in that crate motor? By this I mean are the the M-6500-R302's or the M-6500-R302H's? If you remember the crate motor part number you could call Ford Performance and see if they would have an idea as to which lifters are in it. If it is the M-6007-XB3 then on that instruction sheet (see attached) it just says "Current production lifters".

This excerpt is from the 2020 Ford Performance Parts catalog on page 138:

M-6500-R302H DESCRIPTION
It’s not often that little changes can deliver big results – but in the case of the Ford Performance R302H Lifter, that’s exactly the result.
Before getting into the technical details of the lifter, here’s the background on why and how this special lifter was developed by the engineers at Ford Performance. Circle track racers who use the production hydraulic roller lifter in 347 crate engines reported that their engine seemed to lose power during long green flag runs. Dyno testing by Ford Performance engineers confirmed that – and showed a dramatic performance fall off over 6000 rpm with hot oil temperatures. The problem was traced to the piddle valve check ball, which would become unseated at high rpm when the oil got hot. The fix was a lighter-weight ceramic piddle valve check ball combined with a higher-rate piddle valve spring to keep it seated. The results of these two small changes were impressive – and noticeable by the racers. The power range was extended 300-400 rpm in hot operating conditions – and more importantly, the performance fall off on those long runs was gone.
This unique lifter construction for a drop-in hydraulic roller lifter is an exclusive from Ford Performance and fits any small block Ford roller cam application. While the R302H was developed specifically for racing conditions, it’s the right choice when assembling a high-performance small block that uses a hydraulic roller camshaft.

It could be that you are experiencing the issues they had with the non-H models.

I would still go to a better spring as it's just time in the river and drag motors tend to live at high rpms so they will wear a spring out faster than a street car even though its only 1/8 or 1/4 mile at a time.

Noobz347 · Thursday at 3:23 AM

I just saw this:

Camshafts

Shop Camshafts Parts

www.airflowresearch.com

From this thread:

Thread 'AFR matched cam kits'

Wednesday at 8:21 PM

Not sure where to post this but may be of some interest for those looking for matched camshaft kits from a reputable place for the small block Ford.

Camshafts

Shop Camshafts Parts

www.airflowresearch.com

Send them an email and tell them what you've got and what you need.

93gtmustang · Thursday at 8:37 AM

AeroCoupe said:
I wonder what lifters are in that crate motor? By this I mean are the the M-6500-R302's or the M-6500-R302H's? If you remember the crate motor part number you could call Ford Performance and see if they would have an idea as to which lifters are in it. If it is the M-6007-XB3 then on that instruction sheet (see attached) it just says "Current production lifters".

This excerpt is from the 2020 Ford Performance Parts catalog on page 138:

M-6500-R302H DESCRIPTION
It’s not often that little changes can deliver big results – but in the case of the Ford Performance R302H Lifter, that’s exactly the result.
Before getting into the technical details of the lifter, here’s the background on why and how this special lifter was developed by the engineers at Ford Performance. Circle track racers who use the production hydraulic roller lifter in 347 crate engines reported that their engine seemed to lose power during long green flag runs. Dyno testing by Ford Performance engineers confirmed that – and showed a dramatic performance fall off over 6000 rpm with hot oil temperatures. The problem was traced to the piddle valve check ball, which would become unseated at high rpm when the oil got hot. The fix was a lighter-weight ceramic piddle valve check ball combined with a higher-rate piddle valve spring to keep it seated. The results of these two small changes were impressive – and noticeable by the racers. The power range was extended 300-400 rpm in hot operating conditions – and more importantly, the performance fall off on those long runs was gone.
This unique lifter construction for a drop-in hydraulic roller lifter is an exclusive from Ford Performance and fits any small block Ford roller cam application. While the R302H was developed specifically for racing conditions, it’s the right choice when assembling a high-performance small block that uses a hydraulic roller camshaft.

It could be that you are experiencing the issues they had with the non-H models.

I would still go to a better spring as it's just time in the river and drag motors tend to live at high rpms so they will wear a spring out faster than a street car even though its only 1/8 or 1/4 mile at a time.

Here's the complete 2006 For Racing catalog.

https://shnack.com/docs/2006-pp.pdf

Page 86 is the info on the crate engine. Mine is the M-6007-XB3M.
I didn't know the heads had roller rockers lol!
The current production lifter. On page 86 it shows part number M-6500-R302. So, I assume that is the one that was used?

AeroCoupe · Thursday at 10:18 AM

Yup. Just me but I would pull them and put the R302H’s in there. I’ve had mine north of 7,000 on the dyno with good springs and no float.

93gtmustang · Thursday at 11:34 AM

AeroCoupe said:
Yup. Just me but I would pull them and put the R302H’s in there. I’ve had mine north of 7,000 on the dyno with good springs and no float.

What Heads and cam do you have?

93gtmustang · Thursday at 11:36 AM

Just got this from flow tech induction.
They are not taking calls just e-mails.
This is a beehive spring kit that was developed for the GT40 castings.

https://flowtechinduction.com/fti-gt40-k1-beehive-valve-spring-kit/

The current pricing for the FTI-GT40-K1 Beehive Valve Spring Kit: $465.00 plus shipping.

Shipping quotes will require the "ship to" address and contact number for an accurate cost.

For payment, we are currently using Venmo with their friends payment system for this type of purchase.

If you have any other items required to complete the installation, let us know.

Tech

fasterthangas · Thursday at 4:18 PM

That's how Ed has communicated for years. The phone calls keep him from getting the job done. He's a one man band and is super busy year around. He will set you up right the first time. He did my cam and built my new heads.

AeroCoupe · Thursday at 7:09 PM

What I would run is not the question. What the question should be is how much hp do you want to make. You might want to email FTI back and tell them what motor you have and if they think a custom grind cam would perform better. Any more than this and I would just build another motor but THAT is me.

93gtmustang · Friday at 8:30 AM

AeroCoupe said:
What I would run is not the question. What the question should be is how much hp do you want to make. You might want to email FTI back and tell them what motor you have and if they think a custom grind cam would perform better. Any more than this and I would just build another motor but THAT is me.

Oh, I was just curious. Sounds like you have a good set up. I gave them all the specs. I don't have the money to build another motor at this time.
First things first.
I have to get the converter tightened back up. They loosened it too much when they freshened the transmission last year.
That could very well be what is going on at the end of the quarter mile.
I'm going to start there and then figure out the next move before throwing the kitchen sink at it.
Thanks for all the info.

Fox Valve Spring Kit PAC-1219X. Help finding needed additional parts.

93gtmustang

Ford Performance Mustang PAC 1219X Beehive Valve Spring M-6513-1219X (79-93 302, 351W Mustang) - Free Shipping

AeroCoupe

lube between the nut and the face. I know my lubes

93gtmustang

fasterthangas

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Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell

93gtmustang

93gtmustang

fasterthangas

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AeroCoupe

lube between the nut and the face. I know my lubes

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Thread 'AFR matched cam kits'

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lube between the nut and the face. I know my lubes

93gtmustang

93gtmustang

fasterthangas

Active Member

AeroCoupe

lube between the nut and the face. I know my lubes

93gtmustang

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lube between the nut and the face. I know my lubes

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Stangnet Facilities Maint Tech... Er... Janitor

lube between the nut and the face. I know my lubes

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