Want to go fast without supercharger

whitey09 · Dec 26, 2007

I'm new to the mustang world just having sold my 94 trans am and am wondering what the limits of the 4.6 are without the use of power adders. Call me old fashioned but i prefer the rumble of an na engine over the sound of a supercharger, but every fast mustang i see is supercharged. Are there ways to go fast on just engine? This will be a daily driver too, so i need it to be streetable and reliable.

steedman07 · Dec 26, 2007

Ive got a vortech super quiet, and u would never know my car is SC'ed...The most you are going to get to(not counting heads/cams, they are more than a s/c and not as much power) is about 340-360 rwhp depending on what dyno ur on..Not enough to keep up with older cobras,vettes, Gto's with mild bolt-ons...This has been a discussion on many forums, including this one, that there is only so much u can get out of these cars n/a..On the other hand, they respond great to forced induction and a dyno tune ..The exaust and intake/heads flow remarkably well on S-197's rather than older 5.0's, and S-197's dont respond to heads/cams and intakes like older models do...$3,500 gets u a full Vortech system(non-cooled) with 39lbs injectors, 255lph fuel pump, flash tuner if u dont have one..About $1,000 for labor and dyno time, and u have about 430 rwhp(DYNOJET)..plenty to pull on non C-5/Zo6 vettes, 03-04 stock cobras, and GTho's..

fobra559 · Dec 26, 2007

The most you can get from n/a is close to 400hp with every single bolt-on, heads, cams etc. But your better of just going FI if you want to go fast. It will save you some cash too.

anthony05gt · Dec 26, 2007

The thing with these modulars is they are expensive to do internal work. So far, going n/a on a 4.6 three valve has netted around 400rwhp with bottom and top end internal work. That's bumping the compression, stroker kit, ported heads, cams. I still say the jury is out because very few have gone all the way n/a do to the cost. You can slap a 6k blower on and make an easy 450 with a good tune and call it a day. A full n/a motor will cost much more and net less power.

DarkFireGT · Dec 26, 2007

It depends what you call fast. I mean, throw a cai/tune/headers/underdrive pullies and 4.10's and you're looking at mid to low 12's with sticky tires. Add heads and cams and a few suspension mods and you're in the 11's.

fobra559 · Dec 26, 2007

If you want street-able and reliability, just go FI because once you go to (cams), your car won't be gas friendly. At least on FI you will get more power than a n/a easily and still have good gas mileage.

GalaxieWarrior · Dec 30, 2007

umm....

Engine swap?

68FBJJZ109 · Dec 30, 2007

Well if you don't like the way a Supercharger sounds there is nothing cooler and currently exotic then a Turbo mustang IMHO that why I am building two. I can't seem to find the thread on here but some one is trying to build a head in hops of keeping NA mustang owners competitive once the new Camaro and such comes out. But both Turbo and NA are more expensive then a Supercharger.

LV51FER · Dec 31, 2007

I've had my 2005 Mustang for 2 years having sold my 1998 Camaro Z28 and 2002 Corvette Z06. I have to agree that supercharging is the way to go. I too have a Vortech with intercooler that is rated at 462hp.

It's by far the cheapest way to go. As another poster has said, you'd never know it was supercharged until the blower flings you into fast forward dimension-bending acceleration mode. It has about the same power to weight as my C5 Z06.

Like the F-bodies, these cars need better suspension which means lowering springs (I used Roush) and Tokico D-Spec adjustables. You can get by on the stock brakes if you put in a set of Hawk pads.

I know what you mean about the n/a because the supercharger is a bit mental when you give it some welly and you constsantly seem to be changing up but it has lots of benefits like great performance and reasonable gas mileage.

forensicsteve · Jan 1, 2008

nothing cooler and currently exotic then a Turbo mustang

What an adroit and superlative statement...

+1

anticubicle · Jan 1, 2008

whitey09 said:
I'm new to the mustang world just having sold my 94 trans am and am wondering what the limits of the 4.6 are without the use of power adders. Call me old fashioned but i prefer the rumble of an na engine over the sound of a supercharger, but every fast mustang i see is supercharged. Are there ways to go fast on just engine? This will be a daily driver too, so i need it to be streetable and reliable.

Depends how fast you want to go and how much drivability you're willing to sacrifice!

An Intake and an aggressive tune should be numero uno and 4.10's should follow. Those mods + Pulleys, CMDP's, Mid-Pipe and some sticky tires will easily net you mid-high 12's if you've got the driver mod.

I know you said N/A but have you considered Nitrous? These 3V's can take a nice big shot with the stock motor!

TGJ · Jan 1, 2008

anthony05gt said:
The thing with these modulars is they are expensive to do internal work. So far, going n/a on a 4.6 three valve has netted around 400rwhp with bottom and top end internal work. That's bumping the compression, stroker kit, ported heads, cams. I still say the jury is out because very few have gone all the way n/a do to the cost. You can slap a 6k blower on and make an easy 450 with a good tune and call it a day. A full n/a motor will cost much more and net less power.

Actually people have got just 400 RWHP N/A without the Stroker. I don't know of a N/A 3V Stroker that has got there yet.

Mr_Q · Jan 1, 2008

You know I had a supercharged '07 GT that I recently sold to get my dream car the Shelby GT (hey everyone's dreams are different). I was terrified that I was going to miss the SC.

I don't. For one I had modified the suspension to handle the power and that made the car so damn harsh on our crappy SOCAL roads the car was rattling apart. I was getting 14mpg when I was careful and far less when I got on it.

And frankly in the areas I do get to put my foot down the stock car scoots plenty fast. Mind you I don't go to drag races though. I am strictly a street cruiser.

StonePony · Jan 2, 2008

Sorry guy but there are not enough cubic inches to make these cars go fast without forced induction. You really need the FI to make up for lack of cubes.
I have yet to see a 400HP N/A S197? Nobody has posted a dyno for a N/A car showing those gains.

Quote:
nothing cooler and currently exotic then a Turbo mustang

What an adroit and superlative statement...

That opinion is not widely shared....

steedman07 · Jan 2, 2008

^^ on top of that, show me 400 rwhp natural w/ no forged internals, stroker kit, etc. On a Mustang dyno..

spyder7724 · Jan 3, 2008

I've run 11's on the stock engine n/a and don't make that much power. last time i dyno'd mine it only came up with 296rwhp on a dynojet. sometimes it's not about the hp #'s but getting the combination of parts working together. I've spent 2 years figuring out what it takes to get a stock longblock n/a car (auto) to run 11's and believe me it wasn't cheaper than the FI or nitrous route but thats what I wanted to do. Now I'm going to build a bad ass n/a motor and see if I can run some 10's and still be streetable....kind of.

depends on what you are going to do with the car. If you are just looking for dyno #'s then you will need the full deal heads and cams etc. but if you just want to make it quick with bolt-ons there are tons of things to do to drop e.t.'s without sacrificing driveability.
I totally agree that nitrous and FI are the cheapest and easiest route to the 400hp-11 sec. range without losing your driveability.

I've used various formulas(based on e.t. and mph) to estimate the actual hp my car makes at the flywheel and they all come out to 400-410hp but on the dyno the converter slippage kills the #'s.

TGJ · Jan 3, 2008

I have seen 397 - 403 RWHP N/A from the 3V's. I know the 397 dyno-graph is on modular fords and that one was on a Dyno-jet. Those 4.6's do not have the stock shortblock, they are rebuilt with a higher compression ratio( 11:1 ). I doubt you will see 400 RWHP N/A on a properly calibrated Mustang Dyno unless you run a high compression Big-Bore.

Want to go fast without supercharger

whitey09

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steedman07

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fobra559

At least it's more erect and not floppy anymore.

anthony05gt

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DarkFireGT

Playing with my wife's really makes me want one.

fobra559

At least it's more erect and not floppy anymore.

GalaxieWarrior

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68FBJJZ109

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LV51FER

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forensicsteve

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anticubicle

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TGJ

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Mr_Q

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steedman07

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