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Engine Won't Run Right Since I Tried Maf

  • Thread starter Thread starter 91gte303
  • Start date Start date Mar 25, 2015
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91gte303

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Mar 3, 2015
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#21
  • Apr 6, 2015
  • #21
Yes I am getting a front fire when it does it and I try to speed up.
Put my stock tb and maf back on,a couple of days ago and changed fuel filter today,still does it,just not as bad. The old filter was actually new and was told the fuel pump was a new 190lph pump. So that's dang near everything. My uncle thinks it might have something to do with the lower. Said he ported it to 1214 gasket and thinks it might be too mmuch. Other than the injectors being maxed out... I just never figured that could be it. I did notice a pretty big gain in power when I put the stock tb and maf back on. No new codes,btw
 
9

91gte303

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Mar 3, 2015
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Lake city,SC
Apr 6, 2015
#22
  • Apr 6, 2015
  • #22
Also,I noticed #4 is running more rich than all the others. I think I'll put my 24's in and put my c&l kit writhe the 24lb tube I just got and my 65mm tb back on and see what happens. Yall's opinion?
 

FoxMustangLvr

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#23
  • Apr 7, 2015
  • #23
Does your #4 have good spark? I don't see a problem with swapping the injectors and MAF back in. I think every time you do that the computer needs a minute or so to re-learn after starting your engine. Check your plug wires. What is your base timing set at?
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
144
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Apr 7, 2015
#24
  • Apr 7, 2015
  • #24
FoxMustangLvr said:
Does your #4 have good spark? I don't see a problem with swapping the injectors and MAF back in. I think every time you do that the computer needs a minute or so to re-learn after starting your engine. Check your plug wires. What is your base timing set at?
Click to expand...

yes,it has good spark. my plugs are autolights and they are gapped at .045
plug wires are new and the base timing is at 12*

ive literally ran out of stuff to check without pulling the engine.
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
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Lake city,SC
Apr 7, 2015
#25
  • Apr 7, 2015
  • #25
i guess when i put my new cam in,that will be when i find something,if there is a problem.
all im left with is taking the lower off and getting one that isnt ported.
im figuring either the intake is ported too much,or it wants more fuel, or both.
only thing i havent changed is the fuel pressure regulator. i dont figure its bad,cuz i dont smell or see and raw fuel when i pull the vacuum line off of it. unless the fuel pump is over powering the reguator. seeing as #4 is closest to the regulator and thats the cylinder ive found with some type of problem.

its a 190lph pump and stock regulator,btw
 
9

91gte303

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Mar 3, 2015
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Apr 9, 2015
#26
  • Apr 9, 2015
  • #26
FoxMustangLvr said:
Does your #4 have good spark? I don't see a problem with swapping the injectors and MAF back in. I think every time you do that the computer needs a minute or so to re-learn after starting your engine. Check your plug wires. What is your base timing set at?
Click to expand...

I got a new code. 51. Ect out of range. Was showing my computer 5.0 volts. Said the computer was being told that the engine was -40*
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
144
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Lake city,SC
Apr 9, 2015
#27
  • Apr 9, 2015
  • #27
That was an engine running code and it was at 180*,from what the gauge said.
 

liljoe07

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Feb 18, 2009
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Apr 10, 2015
#28
  • Apr 10, 2015
  • #28
91gte303 said:
That was an engine running code and it was at 180*,from what the gauge said.
Click to expand...

Check the wiring first. Unplug the sensor, and see what the voltage is at the connector. Should be around 5v. If 5v is there, wiring is good, sensor bad. No 5v, you have a connection or wiring issue.
 

jrichker

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#29
  • Apr 10, 2015
  • #29
Backfiring out the intake is either a valve stuck open or a lean mixture or spark plug wire(s) connected to the wrong cylinder(s). Check compression on all cylinders and then look for vacuum hoses loose, cracked, or misconnected. Check the line for the vapor recirculation system – it is easy to knock loose and not see it when you connect the air pump plumbing. If the vacuum line for the EGR valve and the air pump are cross connected, some very strange things can happen. Check the mass air flow electrical connection and see that it is tight, the same goes for the fuel injection wiring harness connectors up on top of the manifold near the firewall.

Sticking valves: If a intake valve is bent, has a bad spring or is misadjusted, the engine will sometimes backfire through the intake. Use a vacuum gauge connected to any convenient spot on the intake manifold. Run the engine at 1000 RPM & look for 18-21 inches of vacuum with a steady needle. A problem intake valve will make the vacuum gauge needle sweep 5-10 inches.

Lean fuel mixture breaks out into several sub categories:
A.). Vacuum leaks
B.) Air entering the intake without passing through the MAF on Mass Air cars (89-95 models).
C.) Failure of the MAF, BAP/MAP (Baro or Manifold Air Pressure, same sensor, different name), ACT (air charge temp), or ECT (engine coolant temp). These should set a code in the computer.
D.) O2 sensor problems: one or both O2 sensors with low output or bad O2 sensor heater ground. This should set codes 41/91. The O2 sensor heater ground is an Orange wire in the engine mounted fuel injector harness. Ground it to the back of the head or intake manifold.
E.) Leaking exhaust gases from EGR valve at WOT or EGR opening when it should not be open.
F.) Poor fuel delivery due to bad fuel pump, clogged filter or bad fuel pump wiring. Look for low pressure or fluctuating pressure. Standard injector pressure is 39 PSI at idle, with the vacuum line disconnected from the regulator and capped.
G.) Clogged fuel injectors.- see the cylinder balance test below
H.) Fuel injector wiring problems causing injector not to deliver rated flow (dirty or stuck shut injectors).
I.) Computer problems: (computer problems are not common like sensor problems)
J.). ROM has bad data in fuel or timing table. This should also set a code in the computer.
K.) Failure of one or more of the computer's driver transistors for the fuel injectors. No code set on this one. Use a noid test light to test the injector wiring & injector drivers,
L.) MAF calibration off or mismatched to injectors.
M.) ACT or ECT bad. Sometimes the sensors will be off calibration, but not bad enough to set a code. If they falsely read too high a temp, the engine will back off fuel delivery.

The HO firing order is 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8.
Non HO firing order is 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8




Vacuum leak due to slipped lower intake manifold gasket...

Ask Nicoleb3x3 about the intake gasket that slipped out of place and caused idle and vacuum leak problems that could not be seen or found by external examination. I don't care what you spray with, you won't find the leak when it is sucking air from the lifter valley. It simply isn't possible to spray anything in there with the lower manifold bolted in place.





Cylinder balance test:
See the procedure below to dump the codes and place the computer into diagnostic mode.

Warm the car's engine up to normal operating temperature. Use a jumper wire or paper clip to put the computer into test mode. Start the engine and let it go through the normal diagnostic tests, then quickly press the throttle to the floor. The engine RPM should exceed 2500 RPM's for a brief second. The engine RPM's will increase to about 1450-1600 RPM and hold steady. The engine will shut off power to each injector, one at a time. When it has sequenced through all 8 injectors, it will flash 9 for everything OK, or the number of the failing cylinder such as 2 for cylinder #2. Quickly pressing the throttle again up to 2500 RPM’s will cause the test to re-run with smaller qualifying figures. Do it a third time, and if the same cylinder shows up, the cylinder is weak and isn’t putting out power like it should. See the Chilton’s Shop manual for the complete test procedure

Dump the codes: Codes may be present even if the Check Engine Light (CEL) isn't on.

Dumping the computer diagnostic codes on 86-95 Mustangs

Revised 26-July-2011. Added need to make sure the clutch is pressed when dumping codes.

Codes may be present even if the check engine light hasn’t come on, so be sure to check for them.

Here's the way to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

Post the codes you get and I will post 86-93 model 5.0 Mustang specific code definitions and fixes. I do not have a complete listing for 94-95 model 5.0 Mustangs at this time.

Be sure to turn off the A/C, and put the transmission in neutral when dumping the codes. On a manual transmission car, be sure to press the clutch to the floor.
Fail to do this and you will generate a code 67 and not be able to dump the Engine Running codes.





If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.



The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.

89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.



The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.


WARNING!!! There is a single dark brown connector with a black/orange wire. It is the 12 volt power to the under the hood light. Do not jumper it to the computer test connector. If you do, you will damage the computer.

What to expect:
You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good. No code 11 and you have some wiring problems. This is crucial: the same wire that provides the ground to dump the codes provides signal ground for the TPS, EGR, ACT and Map/Baro sensors. If it fails, you will have poor performance, economy and driveablity problems

Some codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Dumping the Engine Running codes: The procedure is the same, you start the engine with the test jumper in place. Be sure the A/C is off, and clutch (if present) is pressed to the floor, and the transmission is in neutral. You'll get an 11, then a 4 and the engine will speed up to do the EGR test. After the engine speed decreases back to idle, it will dump the engine running codes.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

Alternate methods:
For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see Actron® for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.

Or for a nicer scanner see Equus - Digital Ford Code Reader (3145) – It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $30.
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
144
18
28
Lake city,SC
Apr 13, 2015
#30
  • Apr 13, 2015
  • #30
jrichker said:
Backfiring out the intake is either a valve stuck open or a lean mixture or spark plug wire(s) connected to the wrong cylinder(s). Check compression on all cylinders and then look for vacuum hoses loose, cracked, or misconnected. Check the line for the vapor recirculation system – it is easy to knock loose and not see it when you connect the air pump plumbing. If the vacuum line for the EGR valve and the air pump are cross connected, some very strange things can happen. Check the mass air flow electrical connection and see that it is tight, the same goes for the fuel injection wiring harness connectors up on top of the manifold near the firewall.

Sticking valves: If a intake valve is bent, has a bad spring or is misadjusted, the engine will sometimes backfire through the intake. Use a vacuum gauge connected to any convenient spot on the intake manifold. Run the engine at 1000 RPM & look for 18-21 inches of vacuum with a steady needle. A problem intake valve will make the vacuum gauge needle sweep 5-10 inches.

Lean fuel mixture breaks out into several sub categories:
A.). Vacuum leaks
B.) Air entering the intake without passing through the MAF on Mass Air cars (89-95 models).
C.) Failure of the MAF, BAP/MAP (Baro or Manifold Air Pressure, same sensor, different name), ACT (air charge temp), or ECT (engine coolant temp). These should set a code in the computer.
D.) O2 sensor problems: one or both O2 sensors with low output or bad O2 sensor heater ground. This should set codes 41/91. The O2 sensor heater ground is an Orange wire in the engine mounted fuel injector harness. Ground it to the back of the head or intake manifold.
E.) Leaking exhaust gases from EGR valve at WOT or EGR opening when it should not be open.
F.) Poor fuel delivery due to bad fuel pump, clogged filter or bad fuel pump wiring. Look for low pressure or fluctuating pressure. Standard injector pressure is 39 PSI at idle, with the vacuum line disconnected from the regulator and capped.
G.) Clogged fuel injectors.- see the cylinder balance test below
H.) Fuel injector wiring problems causing injector not to deliver rated flow (dirty or stuck shut injectors).
I.) Computer problems: (computer problems are not common like sensor problems)
J.). ROM has bad data in fuel or timing table. This should also set a code in the computer.
K.) Failure of one or more of the computer's driver transistors for the fuel injectors. No code set on this one. Use a noid test light to test the injector wiring & injector drivers,
L.) MAF calibration off or mismatched to injectors.
M.) ACT or ECT bad. Sometimes the sensors will be off calibration, but not bad enough to set a code. If they falsely read too high a temp, the engine will back off fuel delivery.

The HO firing order is 1-3-7-2-6-5-4-8.
Non HO firing order is 1-5-4-2-6-3-7-8




Vacuum leak due to slipped lower intake manifold gasket...

Ask Nicoleb3x3 about the intake gasket that slipped out of place and caused idle and vacuum leak problems that could not be seen or found by external examination. I don't care what you spray with, you won't find the leak when it is sucking air from the lifter valley. It simply isn't possible to spray anything in there with the lower manifold bolted in place.





Cylinder balance test:
See the procedure below to dump the codes and place the computer into diagnostic mode.

Warm the car's engine up to normal operating temperature. Use a jumper wire or paper clip to put the computer into test mode. Start the engine and let it go through the normal diagnostic tests, then quickly press the throttle to the floor. The engine RPM should exceed 2500 RPM's for a brief second. The engine RPM's will increase to about 1450-1600 RPM and hold steady. The engine will shut off power to each injector, one at a time. When it has sequenced through all 8 injectors, it will flash 9 for everything OK, or the number of the failing cylinder such as 2 for cylinder #2. Quickly pressing the throttle again up to 2500 RPM’s will cause the test to re-run with smaller qualifying figures. Do it a third time, and if the same cylinder shows up, the cylinder is weak and isn’t putting out power like it should. See the Chilton’s Shop manual for the complete test procedure

Dump the codes: Codes may be present even if the Check Engine Light (CEL) isn't on.

Dumping the computer diagnostic codes on 86-95 Mustangs

Revised 26-July-2011. Added need to make sure the clutch is pressed when dumping codes.

Codes may be present even if the check engine light hasn’t come on, so be sure to check for them.

Here's the way to dump the computer codes with only a jumper wire or paper clip and the check engine light, or test light or voltmeter. I’ve used it for years, and it works great. You watch the flashing test lamp or Check Engine Light and count the flashes.

Post the codes you get and I will post 86-93 model 5.0 Mustang specific code definitions and fixes. I do not have a complete listing for 94-95 model 5.0 Mustangs at this time.

Be sure to turn off the A/C, and put the transmission in neutral when dumping the codes. On a manual transmission car, be sure to press the clutch to the floor.
Fail to do this and you will generate a code 67 and not be able to dump the Engine Running codes.





If your car is an 86-88 stang, you'll have to use the test lamp or voltmeter method. There is no functional check engine light on the 86-88's except possibly the Cali Mass Air cars.



The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.

89 through 95 cars have a working Check Engine light. Watch it instead of using a test lamp.



The STI has a gray connector shell and a white/red wire. It comes from the same bundle of wires as the self test connector.


WARNING!!! There is a single dark brown connector with a black/orange wire. It is the 12 volt power to the under the hood light. Do not jumper it to the computer test connector. If you do, you will damage the computer.

What to expect:
You should get a code 11 (two single flashes in succession). This says that the computer's internal workings are OK, and that the wiring to put the computer into diagnostic mode is good. No code 11 and you have some wiring problems. This is crucial: the same wire that provides the ground to dump the codes provides signal ground for the TPS, EGR, ACT and Map/Baro sensors. If it fails, you will have poor performance, economy and driveablity problems

Some codes have different answers if the engine is running from the answers that it has when the engine isn't running. It helps a lot to know if you had the engine running when you ran the test.

Dumping the Engine Running codes: The procedure is the same, you start the engine with the test jumper in place. Be sure the A/C is off, and clutch (if present) is pressed to the floor, and the transmission is in neutral. You'll get an 11, then a 4 and the engine will speed up to do the EGR test. After the engine speed decreases back to idle, it will dump the engine running codes.

Trouble codes are either 2 digit or 3 digit, there are no cars that use both 2 digit codes and 3 digit codes.

Alternate methods:
For those who are intimidated by all the wires & connections, see Actron® for what a typical hand scanner looks like. Normal retail price is about $30 or so at AutoZone or Wal-Mart.

Or for a nicer scanner see Equus - Digital Ford Code Reader (3145) – It has a 3 digit LCD display so that you don’t have to count flashes or beeps.. Cost is $30.
Click to expand...


im gonna try the cylinder balance test. do i need a obd1 scanner? also, #4 cylinder is the problem area. it runs very rich pulled the plugs and number four was pretty bad. no oil deposits...just fouled very bad.wet with fuel.checked the spark on that cylinder and it fires normal. i changed the ect sensor and the problem is still there. Im to the point im thinking its a bad injector. my uncle thinks its the port job causing it to puddle. i say,if its that,it would have been doing it the whole time. i Have also changed the computer out, so i ruled that out.
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
144
18
28
Lake city,SC
Apr 13, 2015
#31
  • Apr 13, 2015
  • #31
only things i havent changed is o2 sensors,(no code for them yet) or ACT sensor.
btw,i found out the cam is an XE264hr-14. im using 1.6's so the lift is something like .512"
 

FoxMustangLvr

I love my Pimp
SN Certified Technician
Oct 14, 2012
4,968
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204
Spokane, Wa
Apr 13, 2015
#32
  • Apr 13, 2015
  • #32
Switch the #4 injector to another cylinder and see if that one becomes fouled or rich.
 
Reactions: jrichker

jrichker

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In Remembrance. Thank you for your contributions
Mar 10, 2000
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Apr 14, 2015
#33
  • Apr 14, 2015
  • #33
No scanner needed to dump codes on a 86-95 Mustang, all you need is a paper clip. See my above post Dumping the computer diagnostic codes on 86-95 Mustangs
 

A5literMan

At least it is lumpy...
5 Year Member
Jul 30, 2011
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Apr 15, 2015
#34
  • Apr 15, 2015
  • #34
Or spend the $ for a reader. Believe me you'll probably need it again. Got mine off Amazon for around 25$
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
144
18
28
Lake city,SC
Apr 29, 2015
#35
  • Apr 29, 2015
  • #35
just checking back in. problem still isnt fixed as i am out of money and no hair left to pull out.lol
 

mikestang63

SN Certified Technician
Aug 27, 2012
11,606
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In the garage
Apr 29, 2015
#36
  • Apr 29, 2015
  • #36
Did you follow any of the advice given to you?
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
144
18
28
Lake city,SC
Apr 29, 2015
#37
  • Apr 29, 2015
  • #37
most of it,yeah. but some of the last few things,i havent gotten to. life got in the way. family needing me to work on their stuff, helping my friends, helping my uncle.....maybe ill get to it this weekend, but thats subject to change. my grandfather might want me do the rotors on all four wheels on is overpriced saturn this weekend. havent gotten to using the vacume gauge on it yet.nobody has one and i dont have the money to buy theone from the parts store. cheapest one they have is $79. basically everything after jrichker mentioned the vacum gauge, I havnt done.
 

skiwesser11

5 Year Member
Jun 19, 2012
315
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59
Rock Hill, South Carolina
Apr 30, 2015
#38
  • Apr 30, 2015
  • #38
So there were no problems at all before you tried the cobra meter?
For how long did the car run without problems (if it did) between motor work and maf swap?
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
144
18
28
Lake city,SC
Apr 30, 2015
#39
  • Apr 30, 2015
  • #39
that is correct. no problems for about a month,untill i tried that MAF. all the bolt on's and cam were already done and had yet to be driven until i bought it from my uncle. drove it for about a month or so and thats when my clutch cable and such the bed and i sent it to the shop to put the clutch in (i was on a shutdown). i had them tow it to my house to so i could put my quadrant and fire wall adjuster on and after i wrap'ed that up, i put on the maf. Right after i closed the hood, it had started raining. needed to go to the store,waited a while before i went to see if it was gonna clear up,it didnt, so i set out on my drive to wal-mart and thats when it started.
 
9

91gte303

Active Member
Mar 3, 2015
144
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28
Lake city,SC
May 6, 2015
#40
  • May 6, 2015
  • #40
btw..did a compression test after i noticed a noise from the topend. around #4

warm and dry all were between 155-165 except #4 it turned up 125psi
wet,they were all 165-175 except #4... 145
 
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