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  • 1979 - 1995 (Fox, SN95.0, & 2.3L) -General/Talk-

WOW! Timing makes a BIG difference!

  • Thread starter Thread starter Ike83
  • Start date Start date Aug 6, 2007
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Ike83

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Sep 27, 2006
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St. Louis, Missouri
Aug 6, 2007
#21
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #21
87Mustang351 said:
what should i run my timing at on my 351W? im not sure whats its on now we jsut set it by ear because there was no marks on my balancer, but i just picked up some msd timing tape...thanks!!! also what should run my total advanced timing at for the drag strip!
Click to expand...

With your camshaft and heads and everything in your signature.....your guess is as good as mine.
 

25thmustang

Mustang Master
Sep 5, 2003
2,021
85
99
Montgomery, NY
Aug 6, 2007
#22
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #22
I adjusted my timing on the dyno with 89 octane in the car. My car didn't ping even with 20 degrees, and made the most power at 18. I didn't just play with timing and guess, I did it on the dyno, and also run 89 octane because thats what I had in it that day, I could probably run 87 and be fine!
 

Ike83

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Sep 27, 2006
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Aug 6, 2007
#23
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #23
25thmustang said:
I adjusted my timing on the dyno with 89 octane in the car. My car didn't ping even with 20 degrees, and made the most power at 18. I didn't just play with timing and guess, I did it on the dyno, and also run 89 octane because thats what I had in it that day, I could probably run 87 and be fine!
Click to expand...

So than it IS a good idea to bump the timing up to say 12-14?
 

FrankenStang

Now, give me a damn CT!
15 Year Member
Apr 16, 2005
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Aug 6, 2007
#24
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #24
Ike83 said:
I FINALLY checked my timing last night.......2 degrees. I couldn't believe I've been running 8-10 degrees retarded for this long. In any event, I reset it back to 10 degrees and the thing feels like a whole new monster. Throttle response is back AND my car doesn't backfire in the low rpms anymore.

I can't wait to get off work so I can get back on the highway and let 'er rip. Now my car doesn't fall on its face in the high rpms. Matter of fact, feels like she'll make power all the way up to 5500. ****, she feels like she'll make power past that.

Oh well....I'm going to bump it up to 12-14 and see how she runs, hopefully she'll run even better.

I noticed when I was under the car that I have a Pro Street harmonic balancer. Is this a badass harmonic balancer or not? The ****ing thing had 3 sets of numbers. It took a minute to figure out which hash marks to use. What the hell are they all for?
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I believe Dave set the timing on my Capri to 14. I'm all like... ... now...
 

Ike83

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Aug 6, 2007
#25
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #25
~FrankenStang~ said:
I believe Dave set the timing on my Capri to 14. I'm all like... ... now...
Click to expand...

Are you runnin' the stock cam and stock heads?
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
43,265
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Massachusetts
Aug 6, 2007
#26
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #26
Ike83 said:
So than it IS a good idea to bump the timing up to say 12-14?
Click to expand...


You want to run as much timing as you can without detonation....so toss in some 93 octane, bump the timing by a degree and take it for a ride. If you don't hear any pinging, bump it another degree and go again.

Keep going until it pings and then back it down two degrees. Every car is different. Some cars can go to 16 degrees without pinging, while mine pings at 14 degrees.

Also keep in mind weather conditions can play a role, so you may find it still pings on really warm days requiring you to knock it down a degree again.

Basically whay i'm saying is you'll have to stay on top of it.
 

Ike83

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Aug 6, 2007
#27
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #27
Mustang5L5 said:
You want to run as much timing as you can without detonation....so toss in some 93 octane, bump the timing by a degree and take it for a ride. If you don't hear any pinging, bump it another degree and go again.

Keep going until it pings and then back it down two degrees. Every car is different. Some cars can go to 16 degrees without pinging, while mine pings at 14 degrees.

Also keep in mind weather conditions can play a role, so you may find it still pings on really warm days requiring you to knock it down a degree again.

Basically whay i'm saying is you'll have to stay on top of it.
Click to expand...

But I thought you didn't want to have to go to a higher octane when bumping the timing.....I thought you wanted to keep the octane low and the timing as high as possible without detonation?
 

Roland69

Sergeant Tangnet
Sep 17, 2005
2,867
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58
Port Elgin, Ontario
Aug 6, 2007
#28
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #28
I set mine at 13* and with 87 I had very little pinging...I run 81 and it runs fine. I might try foing up a few deg's with some 91 or 92 and see where it likes it
 

fiveohwblow

Official Member
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#29
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #29
Ike83 said:
Ummm......I believe it defeats the purpose to advance your timing to the point of having to run a higher octane. The theory behind it is to advance your timing enough, but not TOO much that you have to run a higher octane. If you have to run a higher octane (which is usually due to spark knock) than you're defeating the purpose. You shouldn't have to run a higher octane on a LOW compression car. Apparently, our engines weren't built to run a high octane. Matter of fact, higher octanes in a low compression car can sometimes lead to unburnt fuel on the cylinder walls and you simply don't want that.

As far as I know......11 to 12 degrees on 87 octane should be perfect....but I could be wrong.
Click to expand...

Well that definitely makes sense, but I would think that increasing even further and running high octane would only improve in somewhat of a perpetual fashion. I know with increased timing and Underdrives I ran a 14.2 at 400 ft elevation. First time to ever drive a car down the quarter. Certainly helped me! Also, now that I have my S/C and chip I have to run higher octane, no choice. I know this is commonplace, but same engine and same internal components...
 

Ike83

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Sep 27, 2006
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St. Louis, Missouri
Aug 6, 2007
#30
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #30
fiveohwblow said:
Well that definitely makes sense, but I would think that increasing even further and running high octane would only improve in somewhat of a perpetual fashion. I know with increased timing and Underdrives I ran a 14.2 at 400 ft elevation. First time to ever drive a car down the quarter. Certainly helped me! Also, now that I have my S/C and chip I have to run higher octane, no choice. I know this is commonplace, but same engine and same internal components...
Click to expand...

Sounds good to me.
 

Mustang5L5

That is…until I whipped out my Bissell
Mod Dude
Feb 18, 2001
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Aug 6, 2007
#31
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #31
Ike83 said:
But I thought you didn't want to have to go to a higher octane when bumping the timing.....I thought you wanted to keep the octane low and the timing as high as possible without detonation?
Click to expand...



That's like putting a fat girl on a treadmill and giving her milkshakes to drink.





You can try to stick with 87 octane, but i doubt you'll get much more than 11 or 12 degrees tops. Even that is borderline. Like i said, every car is different. Mine pings at 14 degrees with 93 octane.

You are only putting in the higher octane to take advantage of higher timing since in theory, the higher you go, the more HP you make. The higher octane is just a preventative thing against detonation.

So if you want to try to advance with 87 octane, that's fine. But if you run higher octane you can advance timing further and gain a few more ponies.
 

blackened88lx

Active Member
Aug 9, 2006
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28
Connecticut
Aug 6, 2007
#32
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #32
Ike83 said:
But I thought you didn't want to have to go to a higher octane when bumping the timing.....I thought you wanted to keep the octane low and the timing as high as possible without detonation?
Click to expand...

No. Like Mustang5L5 said, you want to run as much timing as possible before detonation. I'm at 15* with 91 or 93 octane and it loves it. That's as far as I went and it's never pinged, I should try and push it a little more.
 

Foxfan88

My Grandpa has great wood.
Sep 13, 2004
2,487
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Miami, Ok
Aug 6, 2007
#33
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #33
before my supercharger i could run 16degrees on 87 octane and it ran great with no detonation
 
E

emagdnim

Active Member
Feb 5, 2003
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#34
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #34
I used to run 16 with regular 87 pump gas. No pinging.
 

Darkwriter77

Resident Ranting Negative Nancy
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#35
  • Aug 6, 2007
  • #35
I set Frankenstang's up the same as my notch at 14* with stock heads/cam/ignition and running 91 octane. For most of the year, I don't get any pinging at all, but those days where it gets above 110* outside, it'll ping above 2/3 throttle and 3000+ RPM when it gets up to full operating temp - I just avoid getting into the throttle as much on those days, rather than retarding the timing back down.

I HATED driving around with my timing set down for a week when I was gearing up to get it smogged. It was bad enough to have my exhaust tone choked up by that cat'ed UPR X-pipe - I'm totally spoiled to my off-road X, now - but I cranked the timing down to 8* this time. I was trying to compensate for the fact that I haven't changed (or needed to) my plugs/wires/etc. for a year and a half; as it turned out, my numbers were significantly lower this year at 8* than they were the previous year at 10* with the same octane in the tank, same set of plugs and such, and a filthy paper FRAM air filter.

Of course, needless to say, the timing went back up to 14* and the off-road X-pipe went back on the next day after smog.
 

pistonhead351

flim hunter
May 1, 2005
75
0
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Aug 7, 2007
#36
  • Aug 7, 2007
  • #36
i always ran my stock motor at 16*. ran awesom on 87 octane.
 

Ike83

Member
Sep 27, 2006
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St. Louis, Missouri
Aug 7, 2007
#37
  • Aug 7, 2007
  • #37
That's what I want to do.....find the highest timing with the lowest octane.
 

85_SS_302_Coupe

it sucks (I know) to be on the receiving end
15 Year Member
Nov 11, 2003
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#38
  • Aug 7, 2007
  • #38
It also has a lot to do with where you live and the quality of gas your area is getting.
 

Ike83

Member
Sep 27, 2006
0
0
17
St. Louis, Missouri
Aug 7, 2007
#39
  • Aug 7, 2007
  • #39
85_SS_302_Coupe said:
It also has a lot to do with where you live and the quality of gas your area is getting.
Click to expand...

I always thought it had to do with 3 snorkels, a blueberry, a swing set, 4 crayons, 2 monkeys, and a beach ball.........

....but I could be wrong though.
 
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