Looking for 325 rwhp. Help!!!

[trav_19]

well whats your goal is it to have 325 hp or to go 12.7 in the 1/4?? you can throw a bottle on your car to hit that number for a lot less then a h/c/i.


i believe your 6.8l is correct or close....i think chevys 400ci is a 6.6l ..? but i would def. just tell people its a stoked windsor.

 

[xr8d302]

maybe i should scrap the 410 and go with a triton v10!

but seriously, if i did the math correctly, 410CI is 6.8L

dunno, the Corvette's 7 litre is a 427 correct?

that would make the 6.8 closer to 418

then again, i don't actually know the formula

Triton V10 would be a cool thing to see in an sn95

 

[5spd GT]

http://www.4lo.com/calc/literstocid.htm

 

[1bad04GT]

my ultimate goal is 325 rwhp n/a with the cam and exhaust i have now. im thinking about going with a 94-95 cobra intake and gt40x heads. i know there is better stuff out there but ive heard the e cam is a good nitrous cam so thats why i chose it because i plan on throwing a 100 shot on top of the h/c/i. my friend with a stock 94 cobra intake, e cam, and box stock gt40x heads layed down 271hp and 292 torque through a slushbox untuned on a dynojet with SAE correction so i figure that would be a good way to go, except with some moderate porting and a custom dyno tune. what do you guys think of that idea? what sort of ignition stuff do i need to upgrade (mine is stock)? also, will my stock injectors feed the h/c/i and the bottle? if not, what size do i need? i really appreciate you guys taking the time to respond for me.

 

[dartvader]

my ultimate goal is 325 rwhp n/a with the cam and exhaust i have now.

sorry to burst ur bubbles but its not going to happen
not with those parts
get some custom pistons so you can bolt on a pair AFR 185
good intake, ported performer rpm,rpm 2 or holley systemax
custom cam or something like the Anderson N-61 so you can spin it
compression 10.5 to 11.0 but you will only be able to run premium gas
and then you need all the supporting hardware and matching valvetrain components it can get very $$$$ in a hurry ....

good luck

 

[trav_19]

i feel your goals are kinda high for what your using....but with the bottle it will make up for what your slacking

 

[gmkillr]

325 to the wheels....
AFR 165 competition package w/ upgraded springs from CI
CI custom cam www.camshaftinnovations.com
Ported Cobra or other, Edelbrock, Holley, Trick Flow
1 5/8 longtube headers
75mm throttle body
custom burnt chip
This should get you right there.

 

[tjh566]

my ultimate goal is 325 rwhp n/a with the cam and exhaust i have now. im thinking about going with a 94-95 cobra intake and gt40x heads. i know there is better stuff out there but ive heard the e cam is a good nitrous cam so thats why i chose it because i plan on throwing a 100 shot on top of the h/c/i. my friend with a stock 94 cobra intake, e cam, and box stock gt40x heads layed down 271hp and 292 torque through a slushbox untuned on a dynojet with SAE correction so i figure that would be a good way to go, except with some moderate porting and a custom dyno tune. what do you guys think of that idea? what sort of ignition stuff do i need to upgrade (mine is stock)? also, will my stock injectors feed the h/c/i and the bottle? if not, what size do i need? i really appreciate you guys taking the time to respond for me.

Trying to get 50+ hp with porting and a tune, I doubt that will happen, very much so. just go back and read what the other have said about obtaining that goal, that just aint gonna do it.

 

[final5-0]

IMHO.....this needs to be brought up
when
we talk about what is possible with our Stangs

I, like a lot of peeps, based my combo on the stock short block .....

A no brainer for me as I had only 45K on the clock at that time
and the motor was still plenty fresh

Now, with the stock OEM sb ......

you can only build so much compression
you can only go so high with cam lobes
and ... other similar issues

You are at a small disadvantage with the OEM block
when talking about working with NA induction

Its just not the same
as if
you put together a purpose built B & B'ed 306

I've looked at countless dyno pulls of different combos
and
OEM based part combos that reach 300rwhp
WITH
decent low and mid range torque curves
are
far and few between

Most that make it to 300 had
very soft low and lack luster mid range power

They just can't produce enough air flow ... most of the time

Also consider this .......

A big reason 94-95 OEM combos don't make it to 300 more often ...

Peeps choose those parts with a smaller budget in mind
and
Since the combo is budget based
then
They don't gain any advantage from a good tune

And ... with OEM combos ... you see this Q asked ... A Lot
since
They have the concern about ....... The Tune

"What cam will play nice with my Computer?"

So you see ... decisions that cause ..........
a little loss here
a little loss there
Well ... it all adds up

Again ... with the stock block ... you ain't got a lot to work with
so
You gotta pick and choose parts ... wisely
or
There's just not a lotta room for error to reach 300 or better

325rwhp MIGHT be able to be reached with OEM parts
but
I would be willing bet ... to gain that peak value ......
The low and mid range is gonna be WAY less than desirable

Again ... if peak dyno values are your only concern
Just flush this post down the drain

Hey ... I am not against budget based combos at all

I am trying to say it is much harder to pull the same power
all across the band with them like the more costly after market
parts based combos that run custom cams and such.

Hope I didn't upset anybody with my findings
but
I just wanted to throw that stuff out there

Good Discussion btw

Grady

 

[trav_19]

and thats why we all love grady he always brings good info to the table...good write up

 

[RAD]

and plenty of smilies

 

[Grn92LX]

http://bbs.hardcore50.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=23668

 

[final5-0]

and thats why we all love grady he always brings good info to the table...good write up

I don't know if you would call that stuff ....
Good Info

but

If you ask yourself .....

why did this combo do this
and
that other combo do that

You start lookin at a bunch of em .... and after a while ......

You start to see ... common things between em

Grady

 

[final5-0]

Got some good stuff to put up later
cause
tonight is Super Bowl

Comparo between the better looking pulls of the following:

Typical OEM GT 40 Style Street Combo
FTI Street Combo
FTI more suited to Race Only Combo

I think ya'll will find it interesting

Grady

 

[final5-0]

A three way pull comparison that is kinda interesting between .....

1) A well known 94-95 Stang FTI combo that many feel belongs in the
category of Top Street Car Combos when talking not only peak values
but power under the curve as well.

2) One of the best looking pair of curves from an OEM GT40 type head
based combo I've had the opportunity to take a look at.

3) A stock OEM block based FTI combo that almost rang the bell all the
way to 350 rwhp and did just bump into the 350 rwtq territory.

Mike gave us a link above to the dyno pull from the Hardcore site of the
350/350 Tom Combo.

Now ... This pull has been in my files for some time
but
While I found the pull to be impressive ..........

It was run with no accessories which is not a possibility for Street Car
Combos and certainly produces results that would be considered not
fair for an apples to apples Street Car Comparison

however

I did think it was good to include it along with the other two just to give
an idea about how you can use a "trick or two" to make more power.

I withheld the name of the GT40p head based combo as I don't know him
all that well and I pieced together his results and various combo parts from
several different threads where the other two combos were openly posted
by the owners themselves.

Allow me to say just a thing or two that I feel needs to be pointed out about
all three combos when looking at their results and parts used.

The GT40 combo has a block that may or may not be B&B'ed. If it is not
OEM ... it would have a slight advantage over the other two. I think, but
can't remember for sure, this combo may have a bump in compression
from having the heads milled.

The Tom combo has no drag from any accessories which we already
talked about. It is running an aluminum flywheel. It also has a serious
set of headers you typically don't find on Street Car Combos. Notice
this combo is untuned! Then again ... the A9L can be quite forgiving!

Jake's combo has an intake which flows better thanks to Tom Moss and
his handy work. It has been speculated that the tune on this combo could
have been further pushed for a bit more power.

Now lets look at the curves and notice just a few obvious things .....

Notice the Jake combo high end drops quickly at 5600 ...
I suspect that is more due to the longer runner intake choice
as opposed to the cam choice.

Notice the two tq curves between Tom and Jake
See how Tom closely follows Jake but at a higher value
A good bit of that was gained by no drag from accessories.

Notice the high end of the GT40 and Tom combos
See how they pull to a higher rpm than Jake
You can easily see the benefit of the shorter runner intake

Notice the tq curve of the GT40 combo
While the low end is quite nice and the exception to the rule
See how it peaks at just over 4K
and
See how it's hp curve starts to climb at a slower rate at that rpm
IMHO .......
This is where the older technology starts to shows its age
and
its ability to flow is not quite on par with the other heads

Once Again ... This Combo ... It produces curves that are not typical
I've looked at a bunch of these types of combos
and this one ...
It's right in there with the best of em all ... If not better!

Well ... There You Have It

Just as I see things between the three and if anybody has a different
point of view or feels I have missed something
then
certainly speak up as I always want to help and not mislead
anyone with my input in these threads.

btw ... I included the numerical values this time around

To the owners of all three combos

I say ... Great Job
and
Thanks for sharing with us how you obtained your success

Grady

RPM TOM HP TOM TQ Tom from Hardcore50
2400 134 294 302 OEM Block
2600 155 314 1989LX Fox Stang
2800 170 318 347rwhp 353rwtq
3000 184 322 AFR 165's non ported
3200 201 331 Edel RPM FTI ported
3400 216 334 FTI cam
3600 234 344 Bassani 1 5/8 to 1 3/4 LT's
3800 253 350 Bassani x pipe
4000 269 353 dumped mufflers
4200 279 348 Holly 75mm tb
4400 292 348 ProM 80mm maf
4600 308 352 30 lb inj's
4800 321 352 MSD ignition
5000 330 347 aluminum flywheel
5200 338 341 no accessories
5400 342 333 t-5 trans
5600 345 324 untuned A9L pcm
5800 346 314
6000 344 301


RPM Jake HP Jake TQ GTJake from Stangnet
2250 102 242 afr 165 heads fti cam
2500 125 260 edel performer ported lower
3000 173 300 mac lt's mac pro chamber
3500 220 319 mac catback accufab 75tb
4000 258 333 pro-m 80 maf pulleys
4500 295 341 cai tweecer tune
5000 310 330
5500 326 310
6000 303 263


RPM GT HP GT TQ
2250 111 261 1995 GTS
2500 125 263 295rwhp 321rwtq
2750 150 283 D&D Pro Hawk 302 block
3000 167 293 GT40p heads
3250 190 308 Typhoon intake
3500 210 315 Comp xe270 cam
3750 225 318 Mac 1 5/8 lt's
4000 242 321 Mac Prochamber
4250 261 320 Spintech catback
4500 269 314 65mm tb ported
4750 276 305 77mm ProM maf
5000 282 298 24lb inj's
5250 289 289 Mac pulleys
5500 295 280 homemade cai
5750 295 268 t 5 trans
6000 281 247 no tune

 

[tmoss]

while the below linked combo did not make the 325RWHP, it is a look at the difference between a Performer upper and an RPM upper on the same ported lower, dynoed on the same day.............porting the upper of either intake will gain more power.........

scroll down to my first post in this thread and look at the dyno curve
http://forums.stangnet.com/showthread.php?t=673966

 

[1bad04GT]

the #s the guy layed down on the hardcore5.0 link were std corrected, dosnt that inflate them a good bit? also, approx. how much rwhp can we throw at our stock short blocks? ive heard 450 is tops but the guys here at protech performance in lubbock squeeze 550 to 600 out of them and they survive for 2-3 seasons...

 

[5spd GT]

Yeah std. corrections do elevate the numbers along with the powerband (higher revving) and loss of accessories. Tom's 89 Lx is no freak, it is just more track oriented and has a good driver.

If you want full accessories, average dyno time, and a more useable powerband for the street. It would be fair to say, do not assume to get 350rwhp

 

[tmoss]

Std numbers are not inflated, they are the numbers for the exact atmospheric conditions at the time of the dyno. SAE numbers are corrected to several different "standard" atmospheric conditions, so they will deflate or inflate the numbers depending on weather conditions during testing.

 

[Grn92LX]

Std numbers are not inflated, they are the numbers for the exact atmospheric conditions at the time of the dyno. SAE numbers are corrected to several different "standard" atmospheric conditions, so they will deflate or inflate the numbers depending on weather conditions during testing.

Yes sir!