05 GTs walked by Used Non-Modded Z28s

True.

If you want to be faster, then you should have bought an old LS1 Trans Am or Z28.

If you want a new car, almost as fast as a Trans Am, then buy the '05 GT.

Mod, mod, mods !!!

Gosh, I heard how fast the 05 Mustang was, but then when I asked the dealer why I should buy a Mustang that can't even beat my modded 1987 Yugo in the 1/4 mile he didn't have an answer... cuz my Yugo is sick... 400 rwhp, all black, tinted windows, low down, sweet tires, fancy wing...

(that's a joke)

If all you want is the fastest 1/4 mile at the cheapest price you're in the wrong place and the 05 Mustang isn't the car for you.

My 05 is a sweet ride, and a decent 1/4 mile and decent hp are just a small part of the package.

My 300hp 05GT is slower than your 01 GT. No stress here. Happy for you. But IMO, with mine parked next to yours with the extra hp, very easy decision. I want the 05GT - plain and simple - it handles better, rides better and , IMO, looks 100 times better.

I wouldn't care if a F-bod can outrun one if I had it. The Mustang is better looking and nicer. And in reality, only a few mili-ticks behind the LS1.

peonslayer said:

I am really sorry I bought into all of the marketing hype surrounding the Mustang and the paid off mags. 0-60 in 5.1 and quarters in 13.6. Yeah then how come every story of a Z28/Trans AM ends in the Mustang getting walked fairly easily. So basically my car will get walked by some kid in a used car. Mod it? At what cost. To have my engine or tranny blow at 60-80k miles. Yeah I make good money, but who has the cash to be buying new engines. Oh and this supposed Mustang take off. Not one real life story has read the Mustang pulled ahead till 60. No they have all been "The guy modded it so it was even" or "It was stock so it was 1/2 a car length or a full length or even more off the line and then it was goodbye past 60/80"

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sorry but I have no sympothy here.

I mean what did you expect. Come on think about it!

A 05 GT has 300bhp and any LS1 Fbody has 345bhp stock yet weighs about the same. It doesn't take a genius to figure out which should be faster!

Although the GT can put in a very respectable 13.6 ET, on a like for like basis an Fbody should be doing 12.9-13.0 ET's.

But don't winge on price or 2nd hand either as there are loads of other cars that will be quicker! A C5 Corvette for instance, even the later 330bhp LT1 Vettets and Fbody's will. Not to mention a whole host of other American and not American cars that could (BMW's, Porshces, Jaguars, TVR's, Caterhams, etc.). But you should have known this before hand.

If you want the fastest car there is by the one with the best power to weight ratio as it stands more chance!

Or do you drive your car on the road, where 99% of the time a few tenths of second means nothing!

I think he's right guys. I don't know about you, but I'm gonna trade in my 05 GT on a new '05 Camaro. Oh, wait...

Dealing with it...

007 said:

The LS1 is an excellent motor and reacts very well to mods. Deal with it, its more powerful.

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hmm....I am ok with the LS1...I am even ok with it being a better motor...the part I can't deal with is what the motor is put in!

Seriously though....I didn't buy my car to go out and beat other cars. I bought it because it looks like liquid sex and goes fast (enough for me).

What's up with all the chevy lovers and non-05 driving jealous mustang owners coming into our house and pulling our chain?

If you don't like the car...so what? I do like any mustang. I bought an 05 cause I like the retro look. I even debated about purchasing an 04 Saleen vert when the 05's came out because they had discounted it so much they were pratically giving it away. Bottom line...To Each Their Own.

Just don't come in here tanking the 05 and not expect someone to talk back. :damnit:

Jay

The way I see it, one of the main reasons the LS1 F-bods didn't survive was because the insurance rates were to freaking high for normal demographic buyers.

Ford does things for a reason, they want to see as many cars as possible. Staying competitive and letting owners do the rest has always been their game and thats why the Mustang has been around for 40+ years.

If I remember correctly, the insurance on an F-body used to be as expensive as owning a Vette. That's crazy

I think the guys point is the new 05's aren't worth the bang for the buck to him at this point in time.

His car is only 4 years old and the after market is pretty much there with proven products at a decent cost. Consider an 04 cobra at the same cost as an 05 stang or an 04 Mach at several thousand dolllars cheeper. The cobra and mach are based on older chasis but are still very nice cars. I don't think all the new changes to the mustang are drastically superior to the old platform and both cars would smoke a 05 stock for stock.

The 05 stang is a great car and I do plan to get one after all the market adjustments from the dealers die down. Realistically, I am looking at 06 or 07 when the prices come down and the specialty versions hit the market.

Lime05owner said:

Seriously though....I didn't buy my car to go out and beat other cars. I bought it because it looks like liquid sex and goes fast (enough for me).

Jay

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Leave it at that man, that's all you have to say. Don't stoop down to the trolls.

:OT: Now I have a question for you, how does that SLP sound on the 05, I love it on my Cobra.

Brisk281GT said:

The way I see it, one of the main reasons the LS1 F-bods didn't survive was because the insurance rates were to freaking high for normal demographic buyers.

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At least for me, 39 years old, single no tickets, no claims, no accidents - the insurance for my 2002 Z28 and a 2005 Mustang GT is virtually identical. Strangely, for a 2002 Vette it's much lower. I've just recently checked into rates on the 2005 GT and 2002 Vette

Maybe at other age ranges there's a bigger disparity in the insurance rates, but for me they're the same between the Stang and the Z28.

Brisk281GT said:

If I remember correctly, the insurance on an F-body used to be as expensive as owning a Vette. That's crazy

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Vettes are much cheaper to insure than F-Bodys or Mustangs. At least for me they are

My reason for not buying the new Mustang is the new Charger SRT8... and I think the new Charger will have a much better build quality.... nicer ride..... 4 doors..... and better looks............

Brisk281GT said:

The way I see it, one of the main reasons the LS1 F-bods didn't survive was because the insurance rates were to freaking high for normal demographic buyers.

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I'm sure that had a bearing on it but the reasons runn much deeper, ever since the haydays of the late 70's when Smokey and the Bandit shot Trans Am sales to all time highs they have been dropping. And it was not only GM that had this problem, in the early 90's Ford was actually considering dropping the Mustang due to such low sales performance, the replacement was eventually produced the 4 cylinder fwd Ford Probe, but due to public complaints the Mustang servived. Moving on thru the 90's into the Naughties sales where once again struggling, largly due to the explosion of performance pick ups and SUVs and increased compition from foriegn car makers such as BMW, Porsche and so on.

Both the Fbody and Mustang where using very old technology which was far behind the modern competition technically wise and where becoming un-economical to continue to develop. GM had no new platform to look at, at the time and decided that at the current sales rate it was not a viable market in invest in a new model. The 4th Gen Fbody had reached its pinicle of development, there was little left to be done without a whole redesign so it was axed.

Ford faced the same problem with the sn95, its sell by date had expired some 20 years earlier and they too had reached the end of the line. I would guess there was serious consideration of dumping the model but 3 factors probably changed it.

1. The SUV and pick up bubble appears to have burst recently and sales of performance coupes are once again picking up (although these figures are influenced by one other major factor which I will get on to in a min)

2. The Jaguar X-Type development and associated models (Mondeo, Lincoln LS). This gave Ford a whole new platform that was the correct size for a new Mustang without the cost of developing a whole new platform for it.

3. As GM axed the FBody this undeniable inflated Mustang sales. If in 2003 you wanted a new American V8 performance coupe there was but one choice, the Mustang. Had Ford folded 1st and axed the Mustang then I'm sure the Fbody would have survived by the same means.

GM did relise there error, which is apparant by the sudden release of a large rebadged Australian coupe called the Monaro. You know it as the GTO. It may not have been ideal to compete against the Mustang but at the time it was all GM had, and cost next to nothing to put into production. Although it may not sell in the numbers of the Mustang it was never intended too and is mearly a stop cap until a new model is ready for release.

The Fbody in one shape or another will return as GM can not afford to be selling in this now lucrative market.

GreyGoose said:

My reason for not buying the new Mustang is the new Charger SRT8... and I think the new Charger will have a much better build quality.... nicer ride..... 4 doors..... and better looks............

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I know no one who owns a Chrysler product who hasn't had problems with build qualtiy. That includes 11 people of close relationship who frequent the dealer with dash replacements, fuel tank replacements, computers, radios, transmissions and seals, exhaust leaks, alignment problems etc.

Now don't start any arguement, not saying they are the worst, just saying it is not any better over there.

GreyGoose said:

My reason for not buying the new Mustang is the new Charger SRT8... and I think the new Charger will have a much better build quality.... nicer ride..... 4 doors..... and better looks............

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Are you on the right forum? I really liked this part ".... and better looks ...." That's funny!

sawman70 said:

I know no one who owns a Chrysler product who hasn't had problems with build qualtiy. That includes 11 people of close relationship who frequent the dealer with dash replacements, fuel tank replacements, computers, radios, transmissions and seals, exhaust leaks, alignment problems etc.

Now don't start any arguement, not saying they are the worst, just saying it is not any better over there.

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Im sure Benz has changed them around by now....... I know how their quality used to be........ before I would rather buy a scooter then a Chrysler.... but now it's not Chrysler no more............ and looks the Charger is a hot car and to me it does look better then the new stang

I am talking about Magnums, 300C's and new caravans. Nothing older than 2 years. The Magnums being the worst.

They are still crap and the chargers are filling the lots, wonder why.

About the F-body:

Another one of the reasons that the F-body got the axe was the disappearing profit margin. The LS1s weren't produced in nearly the same volumes as Ford's Mod motors, which made an already expensive engine even more so, as they couldn't drive down the costs with larger economies of scale. Add onto that the fact that Mustangs consistently outsold F-bodies, the costs of maintaining two separate body/interior parts lines for Camaros and Firebirds, and the large rebates GM was selling F-bodies with, and it's no wonder they got the axe from a business standpoint.

About the Charger:

I don't know about the rest of the country, but OKC dealerships have already started offering $4000 rebates on Chargers to try to move them off the lot. I think anyone who would have bought a Charger here already has a 300 or a Magnum.