1" or 1 1/8" sway bar?

[tjnavyblue]

From what I've seen, the price difference is negligable ($5). Is there any reason not to go with the 1 1/8 inch bar, or is it just for racing? I'm looking to do some spirited street driving and keep up with my buddy's 84' turbo Volvo in the corners.

I've seen suggestions for both in the archives, just wondering what the pro's and cons are for each. I have just ordered roller spring perches and 620's (which are actually 560lbs...I think), and have plans for Edel IAS's.

:SNSign:

 

[Max Power]

I have the big bar and it is fine for the street. Can't compare, cause I never had the smaller bar.

 

[SoCalCruising]

IMHO. 1 1/8 is not needed for 65-66, debatable on 67-68, but okay for 69-above. Downside is extra weight. You should pick whichever will best balance with the rear suspension you have/plan.

 

[Sicarius428]

I went with the 1 1/8th up front but I also have a lot of weight in the car.
Kevin

 

[mustangdave]

Speaking only from what I have read, the one inch is better suited to small blocks. It seems the larger bar can actually make the car push. Again, this is just hearsay.

 

[CraigMBA]

The larger bar will give the front end more roll stiffness. This will make the car seem more 'nimble' on turn in but in steady state cornering will make the front end push more.

It's more of a tuning thing than anything.

If you have all the stock stuff and aren't changing anything other than the bar, put the big one on.

Cobra Automotive makes a 1 1/2 hollow bar for the front. I'm debating if I should buy it or not, mostly because it's just UBER HOT looking. Supposed to be the same torsional stiffness of the 1 1/8.

 

[rbohm]

if you are planning on using the 620 springs, then use the 1" front bar to minimize the roll stiffness compared to the rear, also use a 3/4" bar out back to bring the rear roll stiffness up to balance with the front.

if you choose to use the 1 1/8" bar then you want a softer spring in front, something like the stock gt spring or the 540lb spring. again use a 3/4" rear bar for balance.

 

[zookeeper]

I've read that the curent trend in race cars is to use bigger bars and softer springs, but I'm not sure how that works on the street, or if you'de even feel the difference in a 1/8" bigger bar. I know that the difference in using a 1" bar over the stock bar was huge, so why wouldn't the bigger bar be even better? BTW, as far as the 1 1/8" bar being that much heavier, there's absolutely no way anyone can actually tell the difference behind the wheel, weight-wise. Sounds nice, though.

 

[66HertzClone]

Cobra Automotive makes a 1 1/2 hollow bar for the front. I'm debating if I should buy it or not, mostly because it's just UBER HOT looking. Supposed to be the same torsional stiffness of the 1 1/8.

Actually it is a 1 1/4 bar, and you're right it looks great, so does the neat centerlink they also offer. I have the sway bar sitting right in front of my 66 waiting until I finish some other adjustments before bolting it in place. I installed the centerlink last week, it is also very nice, I filed off some rough edges and coated it with POR15 to match the other pieces already on the car. Here is a link to the bar and the centerlink, http://www.cobraautomotive.com/new%20products.htm

 

[tjnavyblue]

From your posts I'm now leaning toward the 1" bar. I do in the future plan to install some frame connectors, monte carlo bar and export brace (and now, rear sway bar). Sounds like the 1" bar should still be fine even after those mods.

BTW, thanks for the help guys. Very informative. I do have a few theoretical questions about handling (as I know basically nothing) -

Is 'pushing' during solid state cornering essentially understeer?

So, carrying that line of thought, is it theoretically possible to have a car that understeers on solid state cornering and oversteers on active cornering?

Is it possible to have a car that is neutral in both types, or are there generally tradeoffs?

 

[rbohm]

I've read that the curent trend in race cars is to use bigger bars and softer springs, but I'm not sure how that works on the street, or if you'de even feel the difference in a 1/8" bigger bar. I know that the difference in using a 1" bar over the stock bar was huge, so why wouldn't the bigger bar be even better? BTW, as far as the 1 1/8" bar being that much heavier, there's absolutely no way anyone can actually tell the difference behind the wheel, weight-wise. Sounds nice, though.

the current trend in nascar is to use softer springs with the bigger bars to control body roll. the reason is to get the nose out of the air and increase downforce on the front end. in road racing, most racers follow one of two schools of thought;

1: stiffer springs and tune with the sway bars

2: soft springs and big sway bars to control body roll

either system works well both on the street or at the track. as for feeling the difference between a 1" and a 1 1/8" bar, that will depend on how sensitive you are to what your car is telling you, and what kind of condition your suspension is in overall.

a sloppy suspension and you will likely never feel the difference.

 

[HistoricMustang]

Following rehab and sensitivity training I sure do not want to get into a big argument but I feel anything that makes the front level (or there about) through turning is good on the early model. Therefore mine is set up with strong springs and 1 1/8" sway bar.

I am also of the opinion that loose is fast so therefore I use no rear sway bar (although they do look kinda cool).

HistoricMustang

 

[rbohm]

Following rehab and sensitivity training I sure do not want to get into a big argument but I feel anything that makes the front level (or there about) through turning is good on the early model. Therefore mine is set up with strong springs and 1 1/8" sway bar.

I am also of the opinion that loose is fast so therefore I use no rear sway bar (although they do look kinda cool).

HistoricMustang

no argument from me. i am a whatever works for you kind of guy.

 

[mo'factor]

sway bar

I have the 1" front sway bar and 620 springs, IAS shocks. I like the feel at the front, but it does feel like the rear end is going to break loose with no rear bar. I've read that if you use 1" front use 3/4 rear. If you use 11/8" front use 7/8" rear.

 

[Max Power]

The need for a rear bar depends entirely on your rear spring rate. I have big block mid-eye leafs in the rear, and with the 620lb springs and 1 1/8" bar in front, it feels pretty nuetral. I never bothered to install the rear bar because I didn't want to drill a perfect frame rail, it would interfere with my exhaust, and it didn't feel like I needed it. It makes for a nice garage decoration.

Of course, I am running Magnum wheels and radial TAs, so your mileage may vary. If I had better wheels and tires, I might find some warts.

Any reasonable discussion about bars and springs needs to include rear spring rate and wheel and tire package.

 

[CraigMBA]

Vintage:

If you think loose is fast you should ADD a new swaybar. The additional rear roll stiffness will give you an all new appreciation of the word "loose".

To the OP:

Anything is better than the stock piece of crap.

 

[HistoricMustang]

Vintage:

If you think loose is fast you should ADD a new swaybar. The additional rear roll stiffness will give you an all new appreciation of the word "loose".

To the OP:

Anything is better than the stock piece of crap.

Well lets see.

Summary of the front end set up:
Shelby Drop
1 1/8" Front Sway Bar
Front Coils cut to height for 2 1/2" front end
drop
Poly bushing everywhere
Monte Carlo Bar
Ford original Export Brace
KYB shocks
Toe In - 1/8" total
Camber - 1 degree negative
Caster - 2 1/2 to 3 degrees positive
Quick Steering Box with Shelby pitman arm
Granada spindle and brakes
Brake Master Cylinder from 1970 Ford Mustang
Ford Upper and Lower Control Arms
7" x 15" Torque Thrust Wheels
245 x 45 Hoosier Street TD's
Fender lips are rolled

And ugh, no rear sway bar.

Perhaps 60 to 70 MPH approaching apex of hard left hander.

Almost got the front left off the ground!

HistoricMustang

 

[67-Coupe]

Well lets see.

Summary of the front end set up:
Shelby Drop
1 1/8" Front Sway Bar
Front Coils cut to height for 2 1/2" front end
drop
Poly bushing everywhere
Monte Carlo Bar
Ford original Export Brace
KYB shocks
Toe In - 1/8" total
Camber - 1 degree negative
Caster - 2 1/2 to 3 degrees positive
Quick Steering Box with Shelby pitman arm
Granada spindle and brakes
Brake Master Cylinder from 1970 Ford Mustang
Ford Upper and Lower Control Arms
7" x 15" Torque Thrust Wheels
245 x 45 Hoosier Street TD's
Fender lips are rolled

And ugh, no rear sway bar.

Perhaps 60 to 70 MPH approaching apex of hard left hander.

Almost got the front left off the ground!

HistoricMustang

:OT: That's a great picture.... Where to you race?

 

[HistoricMustang]

The previous photograph was taken at Virginia International Raceway. The track list includes 11 others.

HistoricMustang

 

[rbohm]

Well lets see.

Summary of the front end set up:
Shelby Drop
1 1/8" Front Sway Bar
Front Coils cut to height for 2 1/2" front end
drop
Poly bushing everywhere
Monte Carlo Bar
Ford original Export Brace
KYB shocks
Toe In - 1/8" total
Camber - 1 degree negative
Caster - 2 1/2 to 3 degrees positive
Quick Steering Box with Shelby pitman arm
Granada spindle and brakes
Brake Master Cylinder from 1970 Ford Mustang
Ford Upper and Lower Control Arms
7" x 15" Torque Thrust Wheels
245 x 45 Hoosier Street TD's
Fender lips are rolled

And ugh, no rear sway bar.

Perhaps 60 to 70 MPH approaching apex of hard left hander.

Almost got the front left off the ground!

HistoricMustang

your suspension settup is just about perfect for racing. i would say a bit more rear roll stiffness and the car goes faster through the same corner. i know you dont like a rear bar, but in this instance perhaps a small one, say 1/2-5/8" would be about right to truely balance your suspension.