2v to 4v head swaps

Thegame826 · Oct 4, 2004

hey guys, Im new to this board and recently picked up a 2000 GT. I did a search and havent been able to find very much information that would help me in doing a 2v to 4v head swap. Obviously the GT intake wouldnt work with DOHC so I also am planning on swapping in a supercharger off of a 03 cobra. Any help would be aprreciated. Thanks

WhiteDevil69 · Oct 4, 2004

Thegame826 said:
hey guys, Im new to this board and recently picked up a 2000 GT. I did a search and havent been able to find very much information that would help me in doing a 2v to 4v head swap. Obviously the GT intake wouldnt work with DOHC so I also am planning on swapping in a supercharger off of a 03 cobra. Any help would be aprreciated. Thanks

Not really worth the $$ to be honest. I was thinking the same thing a long time ago but the more I read into it, the more I was advised against it. No real need to be honest, would be cheaper to get a blower and be done with it. Just gotta know how much power you wanna make.

tangerine · Oct 4, 2004

your best bet would be to drop a complete 03 cobra motor in your car because it will take you forever to piece everything together.

Magius231 · Oct 5, 2004

hmm...after doing some research on this myself, it didn't look that hard at all. The one that I know of that has done it said it bolted up but required one hole to be drilled in the 2v block to accomodate the 4v timing chain tensioner, thats it. 4V heads are most definitely the way to go for power though, N/A or boosted...

stang976 · Oct 5, 2004

Magius231 said:
hmm...after doing some research on this myself, it didn't look that hard at all. The one that I know of that has done it said it bolted up but required one hole to be drilled in the 2v block to accomodate the 4v timing chain tensioner, thats it. 4V heads are most definitely the way to go for power though, N/A or boosted...

i'm no ford technician...but i dont think the conversion is a lot more involved than just swapping the heads. if stangnet had a ssearch button right now then i would back my reply up with previous tech posts.

Magius231 · Oct 5, 2004

allow me then...

http://www.modularfords.com/forums/showthread.php?s=&postid=26236#post26236

check out the 7th post on the first page, Franken-modular lives.

mustang70 · Oct 5, 2004

Would it be better to swap over to 4V heads instead of doing the PI head swap?

Tylerb59 · Oct 5, 2004

I'd go with PI Head / Intake + Forged bottom end + boost =

Thegame826 · Oct 5, 2004

thanks for the replys... im still doing research if i come across anything helpful ill post it.... anyways any more help would be appreciated..

It would not take all that long to piece everything together and is definately going to cost less then buying a complete 03 motor...

once any more posts would be helpful

Green4.6GT · Oct 5, 2004

i wouldnt bother, its expensive, and wont get you that much further ahead than you are now... threre are lots of guys over 500 rwhp with the 2v heads..

bdcardinal · Oct 5, 2004

well if you were to do it, i hope you wouldnt go through all the trouble just to swap on an eaton. if you do happen to do a 4v swap and want a blower, you better get a KB, Whipple or Procharger. the eaton is a decent blower, but its not efficient.

Magius231 · Oct 6, 2004

the 4v heads would be much better to swap in than the PI heads, but there is a little more money involved. The best price I've seen so far is $475 for a set of cobra heads/cams, but the 4v guys have other options that are cheaper. While its possible to do 500rwhp on a 2v with boost, its possible to do 500rwhp on a 4v N/A...something to think about.

IMO it depends on what you want to do. The 4v heads would probably allow you to get more power cheaper as they flow more out of the box than the current offerings of ported 2v heads. They have the ability to flow 300+ CFM when warmed over which is a huge jump from the 2v ported heads numbers. The downsides are you have to buy 4 cams (costs twice what the 2v cams do) and your old headers won't fit. These heads have the ability to support N/A power levels that will require a forged shortblock

RedGTvert · Oct 6, 2004

Magius231 said:
the 4v heads would be much better to swap in than the PI heads, but there is a little more money involved. The best price I've seen so far is $475 for a set of cobra heads/cams, but the 4v guys have other options that are cheaper. While its possible to do 500rwhp on a 2v with boost, its possible to do 500rwhp on a 4v N/A...something to think about.

$475 for a set of 4V heads and cams? Are these takeoffs? As far as making 500rwhp N/A out of a 4V, what do you think it will cost.

You can make 500rwhp on a 2V for a third the cost of a 4V N/A, so please don't make it sound easy.

IMO it depends on what you want to do. The 4v heads would probably allow you to get more power cheaper as they flow more out of the box than the current offerings of ported 2v heads. They have the ability to flow 300+ CFM when warmed over which is a huge jump from the 2v ported heads numbers. The downsides are you have to buy 4 cams (costs twice what the 2v cams do) and your old headers won't fit. These heads have the ability to support N/A power levels that will require a forged shortblock

It would be nice if you have a clear understanding of what the costs are to convert 4V heads onto a 2V, the heads, cams, intake and headers are not cheap, not to mention other things needed. I guarantee you that you can make easily the same if not more HP with a good set of ported 2V heads, nice cams and LT's then with a 4V swap, and still have money left to spend.

.

Magius231 · Oct 6, 2004

I'm not making anything sound easy, I'm saying the 4v heads have a lot more potential than the 2v heads do, and to back up my statement I present this:

http://www.corral.net/forums/showthread.php?t=515518

If you want to go the cheapest route, get a 2v and throw a 250 shot of nitrous on it, but not everyone wants to do that, just like not everyone wants to go with a supercharger or turbo. I would imagine it would cost about the same to go with a ported 4v head swap 500rwhp motor as it would to go with a boosted 500rwhp motor. Either way you have to build the shortblock.

You can guarantee anything you want, but for $500 for a set of take off 01 Cobra heads/cams, I can pretty much guarantee I'll throw the same parts at it that you do and make more power than you will with your weaker 2v heads.

Magius231 · Oct 6, 2004

and note this one:

Bob Cosby (356.2@6100/337.4@5000 SAE) .020 over and good valve job. Stock Cams & Intake.

As far as I know the highest HP 2v N/A with a well built shortblock, fully ported heads, custom cams, etc is around 360rwhp or so...Bob is only in the middle of the 4v HP list at that same power level.

GinoGT · Oct 6, 2004

You want a 4V, just buy a damn Cobra/Mach 1 engine.

I don't think anyone has mentioned the way too low compression ratio you would get if you put 4V heads on a 2V shortblock. Plus if you got a 4V engine, you would have the aluminum block and forged crank that the 2V doesn't have.

Personally, I think a big bore 2V N/A engine would be a fun project.

hotmustang331 · Oct 6, 2004

Screw 2Vs heads, they absolutly suck, and kill the power potential....Man you guys are supposed to me smart and actually know things about engines, yet most of you take lightly how much heads do for power and potential, and think that crappy flowing heads will give you all the power you want if you put a supercharger on it....well you guys can just keep on believing that.OK enough talk, here are the numbers. BTW not flaming.

Intake valve lift--------99Cobra stock--------STG III

.500 243 292

Intake valve lift--------99GT stock-----------STGIII*

.500 179 204
.600 181 212

*with stock sized valves(1.76 intake 1.41 exhaust)...with 1.83 intake and 1.41 inch exhaust FRPP valves the STG III heads still could only flow 224CFM on the intake at .600 inches of lift

As you see, the stage three 2V heads with bigger valves were still being out flowed by STOCK 4V head by 19 CFM.If you compare both at the 4V heads .500 inches of lift (instead of the 2V being at a higher .600 over the 4Vs .500) it outflows them by 25 CFM.And you could imagine how much those 2V heads would cost...thats why I am also going the 4V swap route....in short 2V heads are a joke and they SERIOUSLY limit our power, I can think of only one reason why some one would do a high powered build up of 2V head motor...and thats for the bragging rights.

CLIFF (sp LOL) NOTES... 2V heads suck, and even with a bunch of work cant match the flow of stock 4V heads.

Well thats my .02 take it or leave it....also hope that helped anyone who had any Qs about that sort of thing, or was having a hard time deciding between 2V and 4V heads.BTW all info was from 5.0 MUSTANG AND SUPER FORDS.They had the flow bench not me LOL.

bdcardinal · Oct 6, 2004

theres no denying that the 4v heads are way better than the 2v heads. however there is something about making 300+hp out of 2v heads thats so much cooler than making 400+hp out of 4v heads. when i get around to doing a 4.6 buildup it will definately be with 4v heads. also there is a cost factor. for someone with a 96-98 stang or older tbird or 00 and older panther, getting PI heads and a PI intake is the total budget way to go for more hp. another issue as stated above is the larger combustion chamber on the 4v heads lowers the compression ratio, which is cool if you want to run some boost, but if you want NA then you will lose some power there.

RedGTvert · Oct 7, 2004

Gary, do you realize what it will take to build a 500rwhp 4V N/A engine? It appears not, and other then Mike T., show me a 500rwhp 4V N/A.

I could build a 600rwhp boosted 2V for easily less then 1/2 the cost to reach say 450rwhp N/A on a 4V. I know, becuase I am getting ready to do that this winter on my Mystic right now, and I already own the damn 4V.

Whatever the case is, you are better off buying a Cobra or Mach 1 engine and dropping it in rather then trying to convert an exisiting 2V to a 4V.

Argue all you want, but I have been there and done that. I know what it takes to build these things and what it costs to do so, and a 4V is damn costly.

GinoGT · Oct 7, 2004

The 4V heads make more power than the 2v......no ****?????

This isn't about how they make more power, it's about how its a pain in the ass and how in the end it doesn't really work to put 4V heads on a 2V shortblock.

Another option would be to buy a 3V engine. Aluminum block, so you're set up to go big bore from the start, as well as a very promising head design. The variable cam timing as intake control will help get you a big fat torque curve too.

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