331 Turbo vs 408

BlownFiveLiter · Aug 28, 2007

I vote 408. Cheaper than a turbo 331, easier to tune, stronger block, unless you're talking aftermarket for either one? Sure, you may need a new hood, but the Cobra R hood is sexy anyway.

gcomfx.com · Aug 28, 2007

I don't have the patients for a turbo. Too much work putting it all together, and then keeping it all that way.

408 - and you can always juice it if you want more.

1TallMF · Aug 28, 2007

408 - Cheaper, stronger, more reliable, and just plain bad-ass

nmcgrawj · Aug 28, 2007

Lets stop saying stronger cause a factory 351w block (69-71 or whatever years) isnt stronger than a Dart block which is in the poll for the 331.....

I'd be worried about front end weight with that big windsor for autocrossing....although i dont know much about the sport anyway. Turbo's are good once they're together and running, but thats a lot of crap to have to take off to fix it. But then again, it'd be a smaller advantage in weight cause of all the turbo stuff up front.

I think a 408 would be funner on the street....cheaper to build...easier to maintain...less crap to worry about....easier to fix....

I'd vote 408.

BlackVert · Aug 28, 2007

i decided to go 408 because i wanted a reliable mill with boatloads of torque all across the rpm range. i want to be able to just jump in the car and drive it anywhere without having to worry about anything. i am of the opinion that my goal is much easier to accomplish with a naturally aspirated motor than it is with a forced induction motor.

94-302-vert · Aug 28, 2007

408... then plan for a few psi of boost in one form or another later...

Zero Signal · Aug 28, 2007

That's tough. Both will be a lot of work and both will be crazy fast. A high compression, high revving 408 would be pretty sweet though.

Pokageek · Aug 28, 2007

"I'd be worried about front end weight with that big windsor for autocrossing...."

50# so that's not an issue. The turbos and tubing and intercooler..same for same.

I can't believe how well my car handles wth that new swaybar 1 3/8"..so I would recommend one of those whichever eng.

If you go turbo 331, you'd better get a dart like nmcgrawj was saying. older 351 blocks are getting harder to find though..but the newer ones are very strong as well.

rio95 · Aug 28, 2007

In my ideal set-up, a 408 would not make even close to enough power (typically). But a dart 331 with a turbo, now we're talking.

The 331 turbo would be quite a bit more money, but way more power, so I guess it depends on you.

As for weight, why is everyone saying the 408 set-up would be heavier? It is quite the opposite in my opinion.

nmcgrawj · Aug 29, 2007

rio95 said:
As for weight, why is everyone saying the 408 set-up would be heavier? It is quite the opposite in my opinion.

well a 351w motor is heavier than a 331, mainly from the block. I have never measured or saw actual numbers, so when u get into aftermarket the margin might not be nearly as big as some think. But the turbo stuff makes it even anyway....if not making the 331 more heavy

Black95GTS · Aug 29, 2007

Whats the goal of the car?

5spd GT · Aug 29, 2007

I have understood the 351 block to weigh around 30+ lbs more. I do not recall if that is block weight or block with internals.

Either way, the 331 will probably be quite a bit more expensive with the turbo installed. It would be faster though with the right amount of boost.

An N/A combo is less forgiving, and you could still rack out 450 rwhp out of it fairly easily. The turbo adds weight as well, which may negate the difference between the two possible combos more.

On the contrary, a 351 intake is going to weigh more as well...

Black Stampede · Aug 29, 2007

Whoever said the 408 would be more fun on the street has obviously never been in a fast turbo car. The sound alone is worth hours of fun. Overall though the fact is it comes down to the plans of the car. The 408 won't be anywhere near as fast so its kind of comparing apples to oranges considering the 408 will probably make around 450 rwhp and a 331 with a t70 with reasonable boost will make 600 rwhp. Just ask Eades. I believe his car is a 331 and I know he has a t70.

final5-0 · Aug 29, 2007

Its all about the application

There is W A Y more to building a successful combo than just being able
to say this or that combo makes such and such rwhp

You can have a motor that makes mega hp
and
If the drive line and chassis are not setup to take it

Well ...

Grady

rio95 · Aug 29, 2007

Black Stampede said:
Whoever said the 408 would be more fun on the street has obviously never been in a fast turbo car. The sound alone is worth hours of fun. Overall though the fact is it comes down to the plans of the car. The 408 won't be anywhere near as fast so its kind of comparing apples to oranges considering the 408 will probably make around 450 rwhp and a 331 with a t70 with reasonable boost will make 600 rwhp. Just ask Eades. I believe his car is a 331 and I know he has a t70.

600 rwhp?? Thats weak as hell. Why have a 331 then?? I was talking about an aftermarket block (which is heavier in most cases). So I think you meant to say 800-1000 rwhp. Sounds more fun than a NA 408 to me.

BlackVert · Aug 30, 2007

question: i know these were not mentioned as options, but:

why not put a turbo on a 351-based mill? don't the aftermarket 302 and 351 blocks and forged rotating assemblies cost fairly close to each other?

another popular option is to go 408 and then spray it for that extra kick when you need it ...

also, there is a certain logic to jr's approach. he has a stock bottom end ... then if (or more like when!) he blows up his motor, he just gets another 302 for a couple hundred and bolts his stuff onto that and he is back on the road again.

starting with a 351 block is like starting with an extra 50 cubes for free (compared to a stock 302). if you stroke 302 to 331, then a similarly stroked 351 would be 393 cubes. how can you go wrong with that?

if it were me, i'd start with the most cubes i could start with and then strap my power adder of choice to that. if i had the money for an aftermarket block and wanted a power adder, i'd want to go with a turbo'd 351. that probably would end up in the same ballpark as a turbo'd 331. but either way, i'd start with a 351 and go from there.

Engel · Aug 30, 2007

how much can the 351 blocks withstand?

I understand where you are coming from but it seems there is more potential problems with a turbo ie additional heat, more parts , increased upkeep, more wieght

BlackVert · Aug 30, 2007

5spd GT said:
... An N/A combo is less forgiving ...

don't you mean, "An N/A combo is more forgiving", or "An N/A combo is less finicky" ?

Engel said:
how much can the 351 blocks withstand?

they are a good bit stronger than a stock 302 block. read this ...

http://bbs.hardcore50.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=27754&highlight=stock+351+block+strength

http://bbs.hardcore50.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=14214&highlight=stock+351+block+strength

5spd GT · Aug 30, 2007

BlackVert said:
don't you mean, "An N/A combo is more forgiving", or "An N/A combo is less finicky" ?

Yep, your right, typo. An N/A combo is more forgiving... I'll edit...

Yeah, I have even read that the newer roller (late model 351 blocks) even handle some nice power

331 Turbo vs 408

Choose your engine

331 dart block turbo - turbo domestic rules

408 - to hell with power adders, wheres my cowl hood

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