351 Windsor hp limit? head options?

Hack · Oct 29, 2010

1968-coupe said:
It may be next weekend before I can pick this one up. I will post the casting numbers. It came out of an early 80s F150 hotrod. mild cam, punched .030 over (it had a piston crack it will need to be bored again) Edlebrock intake, it had a Holley 750 on it. Not sure what head work was done. Im getting the entire dieassembled engine so if anyone is looking for parts i will be selling what I dont need. I will probably end up using just the block.

For how common 351W blocks are I would recommend you stay away from something that's already 0.030" over and needs to be bored again.

You should be able to find a std bore block no problem.

I agree with above posts that Clevor isn't as cheap as building a Windsor, depending on exactly how you go. I'm building a Cleveland because that's what I like, not because it's cheapest. However, I'm using a set of 4V closed chamber heads with aftermarket double springs, 1 pc SST valves, fresh valve job, new seals, etc. that I paid $350 for. Edit: they also include guide plates and screw in studs and all that machine work is already done. They might be heavy old and cast iron, but they will support 500+ horse power and were very inexpensive. You aren't going to find that with a 351W.

rbohm · Oct 29, 2010

68RCodeConv said:
500 hp out of 351 cubic inches is doable but I'm not sure how drivable it will be. You are talking about a pretty radical cam that probably won't make much vacuum and the idle quality won't be very good. Plus below 2500 it will not pull great.

In my 347 (worked Dart Pro 1 heads) I had a 240/249 duration at 050 cam with 108 LSA and .570 lift. 4 inches of vacuum, would not idle below 1100, did not smooth out until 2000 rpm. It did not make anywhere near 500 hp. It was an awful combo in urban driving.

500hp from a streetable 351w is fairly easy with the right combination. modern heads and cam designs means you dont have to put up with a lumpy idling engine that overheats every time you get stuck in traffic.

rbohm · Oct 29, 2010

Hack said:
For how common 351W blocks are I would recommend you stay away from something that's already 0.030" over and needs to be bored again.

You should be able to find a std bore block no problem.

I agree with above posts that Clevor isn't as cheap as building a Windsor, depending on exactly how you go. I'm building a Cleveland because that's what I like, not because it's cheapest. However, I'm using a set of 4V closed chamber heads with aftermarket double springs, 1 pc SST valves, fresh valve job, new seals, etc. that I paid $350 for. Edit: they also include guide plates and screw in studs and all that machine work is already done. They might be heavy old and cast iron, but they will support 500+ horse power and were very inexpensive. You aren't going to find that with a 351W.

hack, if this were 30 years ago, i would agree with you that building a cleveland over a windsor if you wanted a lot of power was the way to go. but these days, both can be built to make a lot of power on similar budgets. the only advantage the cleveland holds these days is that it revs quicker that the windsor does.

j69302 · Oct 30, 2010

rbohm said:
hack, if this were 30 years ago, i would agree with you that building a cleveland over a windsor if you wanted a lot of power was the way to go. but these days, both can be built to make a lot of power on similar budgets. the only advantage the cleveland holds these days is that it revs quicker that the windsor does.

what makes a cleveland rev faster? and are you talking about an actual cleveland or a clevor now?

rbohm · Oct 30, 2010

j69302 said:
what makes a cleveland rev faster? and are you talking about an actual cleveland or a clevor now?

the cleveland has smaller main bearing journals than the windsor does. 2.75" vs 3". that alone allows for less friction. the other thing the smaller main journals allow for is a lighter rotating assembly.

BuckeyeDemon · Oct 30, 2010

rbohm said:
the cleveland has smaller main bearing journals than the windsor does. 2.75" vs 3". that alone allows for less friction. the other thing the smaller main journals allow for is a lighter rotating assembly.

i would highly doubt a person could notice a cleveland rev faster given two similar builds.

according to Scat's website for their 4340 forged cranks:

3.5" Cleveland: 56 lbs
3.5" Windsor: 58 lbs

4.0" Cleveland: 58 lbs
4.0" Windsor: 58 lbs

seems like a wash to me for a street motor.

but i'm not that knowledgeable in the topic.

brianj5600 · Oct 30, 2010

Especially when the weight is so near the center. I would not hinge a decision on that. If you want a Cleveland, build one. There are a few things that can trip you up, but nothing major.

1968-coupe · Oct 30, 2010

I like the Windsor block, but I like the Cleveland heads. Im going for an old school hotrod, very close to stock interior, Mag500 wheels, Shelby decklid, 67 shelby hood. From what I understand the Clevor was an old way to get a performance engine from what you had, but the Cleveland heads on the windsor block. Who knows, I may use cast iron Cleveland heads. Power isnt everything, there will always be someone getting more power out of their small block than you are. Im looking for something that will make an oldschool powerplant that will be different, unique and fun. The fact that the Clevor setup isnt popular anymore draws me to it, it takes more thought than bolt on and go. Im going for old school (with just a little new stuff mixed in with it)

brianj5600 · Oct 30, 2010

There is nothing wrong with a C block for what you are doing.

351 Windsor hp limit? head options?

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