6 cyl 65-69 Mustang, how fast can I make it?

mtiso · Mar 23, 2004

Posted: 23 Mar 2004 21:26 Post subject: 65-68 Mustang.. how fast

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Hi folks,
I have a small problem..... I would like to get a classic american car (like the mid-late 60's Mustang with the 170 inline 6), tune it a little, add a suspension....
and need the car to run ~8 sec from 0-60 and should have a top speed of at least 130mph ......
is that feasable??????

Reason... I am moving back to Austria and would like to get a nice piece of american car history with me. The problem is that gas is expensive (~$3.50-$4 per gallon), thus a big V8 is out of the question.
Besides a ****ty diesel 4 cylinder does about 130mph top speed and I don't want to get smoked on the highway by a friggn 4 cyl diesel!!!! That would freak me out.....

So, can I put some bolt ons on the inline 6 (170cu inch), put a decent suspension on that thing and drive is somewhat reasonable??
The budget I have is ~$6k to $7k including the parts......

I have been looking at other cars, looking nice on the outside but FUGGLY on the inside (I would become blind if I am forced to drive one )....... but if you have another idea on a nice car (I really love the late 50's Thunderbirds.. but I would have to be married to a gas station owenr to afford that kind a car) please let me know ...

dodgestang · Mar 23, 2004

An I6 radically tuned to the specs you want will burn just as much, or more gas than a lightly tuned v8 with Vacuum seconardies or just a simple 2 barrel carb.

D.Hearne · Mar 23, 2004

One other question to how fast do you want it, is this: How high are the hills? I also agree with dodgestang, anything you do to improve the performance to equal a V8's power will net you the same fuel economy. An EFI equiped 5.0 will be about the most fuel efficient route to what you want.

brianj5600 · Mar 24, 2004

The sound of an american V8 would be sweet as well.

TheWolf · Mar 24, 2004

A 170 has a four bearing bottom end and is not recomended more modding. A 7 bearing 200 is better suited and came out in 65. You can get 30+mpg out of them, but the mods requried will only net you about 150hp give or take. You can get up to about 250hp out of them with a LOT of modification and MONEY like turbo, a better head, among many other things. This, of course, makes your milage suck.

mtiso · Mar 24, 2004

well first off,
thanks for the replies so far.

Based on the research, it seems that a standard 286 (?) V8 with 218 (or so) hp makes the Mustang go from 0-60 in ~10 seconds, and the top speed of ~110mph.... (1/4 is in the low 16's)

Based on those numbers I seriously doubht I can make the V6 anything close to what I need
A V8 would be sweet, the problem are the taxes. Cars are based on their power as well as on their emissions. Just the running cost difference of a 110hp to a 218hp makes about $500 bucks a year in taxes.. plus another $800
in insurance.... maybe I might get by and get a "classic car exemption", but I am not sure on the restrictions...

On the fuel consumption, regular 91 oct fuel runs currently at ~$4 / gallon. Not sure about the tank size on the Mustang, I would guess about 15 Gallons, thus one fill up will cost me 60 bucks and prices are rising

I don't plan to "radically" improve the performance on the I6. Make it more rev-happy. So I was thinking of a race header, full exhaust, more aggressive cam.... that is pretty much it. A complete new suspension to make the car handle somewhat nice is a must.

I definately am looking for a manual .... did any of them come in a 4 speed? Or is it just 3 speeds? What years did they come in 4 speeds?

@D. Hearne: I cannot make big changes to the car (like converting from carb to EFI) since it would require the car to be made "smoke legal" by the latest standarts.. and it would not past unless I put in a late model engine in it... it I leave the car "original" the techse usually do not take the engine appart to check for the cam or pistons so I have a little bit of room to "cheat"
HOWEVER they are not stupid.. if they would see a EFI on a 65' it would give it away lol

dogstang: if what you say is true, what displacement V8 would you recommend?

TheWolf: the 200 cui in is the smallest V8 right? So if I would be looking for a nice 200 cu in in original condition I can beef the car up to 150hp. Is that whp or crank hp? Do they come with automatics only or with 4 speeds as well? What kind of mods would I have to make.. and what would it cost (give or take).. what is the stock power rating of the 200 cu in? and last.. you think I can find a rust free, good condition 65 and up Mustang with a 200 for ~$7k??

I am not looking to make a race car.. just a car that I will not be blown away by a friggn micro car with a 4 banger diesel if at all possible. Anything 150whp - 170whp would be just fine (with NO nitrous that is).....

Thanks for your help.....

TheWolf · Mar 24, 2004

The 200 is an I6, it replaced the 170. If you go with an I6 look into a 2bbl progressive carb along with your other ideas. It will add a little power plus help your milage. I beleive they all came with 3spds or autos, but a t5 can be mated behind them with an adaptor.

allcarfan · Mar 24, 2004

Im confused.

If you put in an EFI engine, you have to meet emission standards of today? That seems a little odd...but I am not familiar with Austria's Automotive Regulations. However, that EFI V8 will get you some GREAT gas mileage and emissions would be less than that of the inline 6 that is modded. You COULD bring the car over there (along with all of your parts)...have it tested witht he 6cyl in it, pass whatever tests you need it to pass, then swap in the V8 If you want great great great gas mileage....stick with the lil 6 cylinder...and swap in a 6 speed. Change the rear gears....the car will be very quick and still get great mileage!

You said that a 170 mustang ran low 16s in the 1/4?? I think thats a little fast for that car.

mtiso · Mar 24, 2004

The Wolf:
thanks.. I just finished my search on traderonline and figured out that the 200 is an inline 6 (uuups) lol

Well anyhow, I will keep my eyes open for a 200 cu inch inline 6.... seems that I could find a nice one for $5k - $7k.....

The "T5" is a 5 speed manual?

Is the 200 I6 much better in regards of fuel economy than the small V8?
Any idea on the base power of the I6? Is it rated ~120hp?

TheWolf · Mar 24, 2004

I think it was listed at 16s back in the day. All engines back in the 60s were rated gross at the flywheel, so v8s and I6 made less than listed. An unmodded I6 only made about 100hp at the rear wheels(net). Yep, a t5 is a five speed with the top gear being an overdrive (good milage improver). In my opinion, the I6 has the edge in mileage over a v8, part being the weight difference.

mtiso · Mar 24, 2004

@ allcarfan:
well it is pretty simple. Whenever one modifies an excisting vehicle extensivly (like in popping a new engine in it) it does not qualify as the original car anymore. Since oldtimers (vehicles more than 20 years old) qualify for a "special treatment" (like they don't have to conform to emission laws, are moslty tax excempt and one has to pay low taxes, no need for seatbelts, no need to meet emissions class 3. etc etc) ppl could simply cheat the system by purchasing an old (20year plus) 4 cyl and pop in a huge V8.....

Similar to US building code. I.e. if you have an old home (like a 1910) with original unsafe wiring (textile insulation, very dangerous) and you make ONE (!) change to it, lets say you want to change the broken outlet, the new oulet must either be an original (not made anymore ) OR has to meet the latest building code (pretty much you have to rip out the wire to all the way down to the fuse box since the new outlets have to be grounded)....

Plus the emission laws in Austria are currently tougher then in California.. there is plenty of work ahead for me to do that.... on top of that the car has to get safety approved... and with that engine most likely I would be required to improve my braking system (try to slow down from 150 - 30 mph on the highway with the stock brake system)... since the original car was designed to do only ~100mph or so.....

Well.. I have found plenty of 200 cu in I6 with a 3 speed.....

Any of you has an idea on how much a T5 conversion would run at?

Thanks for all the info guys !!!!

TheWolf · Mar 24, 2004

If you can get a good deal on the transmission, expect a little over $1000. Thats my next step.

mtiso · Mar 25, 2004

hey.. just a quick question..
how much to pay for a 200 3spd in very good condition? (regular coupe)

TireSmoknWindsr · Mar 25, 2004

I dont know about the tranny with it as I too would go with the 5spd but it seems you could get the I6 for around 100-200 that could be rebuilt pretty cheaply(I'd recommend a rebuild for sure especially with bigger cam and such) and for a good rebuilt one already maybe 500-700. A buddy of mine has a good running one from his 65 stang and he was just wanting 100 or so for it. So they are cheap and available.

mtiso · Mar 25, 2004

sorry for my confused post...
how much would I have to spend for a nice (no rust, good cosmetics) 66-68 Mustang with a 200 I6 enigne and 3 spd stick shift..... regular coupe

Penguin · Mar 25, 2004

If you haven't already found where to get parts and such...
Clifford Performance 6=8
Ford Six Performance

And if you have any problems installing the stuff, these guys can probably help you out...
Ford Six Forums

Here's a nice little buildup for a 200/250ci i6 also...
200/250 street buildup

Hope this helps, if you already knew about this stuff, oh well.. enjoy the banana

allcarfan · Mar 26, 2004

Sorry to hear about all of the restrictions in Austria. You keep mentioning that you want to drive 150? mph or is that kph? In order to drive at those speeds safely....you will need to do extensive work to the car. IE, brakes, aerodynamics, lower the car a bit, etc etc. I would NEVER EVER take my classic up that fast. Furthermore, you are gonig to need some serious HP to make your car go that fast. I doubt you will even be able to come close with an I6 and still be safe.

For the budget you are on, what you want to do, and where you want to do it....is going to be EXTREMELY difficult..darn near impossible.

Classic stang
I6 engine
havent decided on trans
must meet original safety standards and possibly emissions
must be able to run in excess of (lets say) 135mph for extended periods of time
must be SAFE to drive

Budget...$7000

Good luck my friend~

TheWolf · Mar 26, 2004

I paid a little over $2000 for mine (a little rust and needed a paint job), so with any luck you can do similar. Allcarfan is right, thats very fast to be driving a classic car which lacks modern safety stuff. Top speed of stock I6 is listed as 90mph, more like a hundred actually. The light weight and good torque of an I6, gives you a good take off, the lack of high horsepower limits its top speed and acceleration at higher speeds (still pulls pretty good though). You should be able to get the car to run at 110mph for a long time, but I wouldn't advise it. Kinda hope you're talking about kmh

Penguin · Mar 29, 2004

Also... for 69-70, they could come with the 250ci I6. It had about 155hp (flywheel). That would be a better starting point.. but the 69-70 Mustang probably costs more than a 65-68 with the 200ci I6.

If you converted everything over from the I6 to a 5.0 EFI, exhaust and such (I mean everything), wouldn't it then meet the standards that it should (for a '90 Mustang or so)? Or does it have to meet "new" car standards?

6 cyl 65-69 Mustang, how fast can I make it?

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